XPO | Info on demerit point system please.....

I can't seem to get a good explanation on the demerit point system at my terminal so I was hoping someone out here could shed some light. From my understanding, it seems to me that guy could point out quite quickly for a few minor incidents incurred over a short period of time.

Well this isn't good....100 views and no responses. Is the demerit point system so confusing that no one can answer a simple question about it?

[quote author=ldgarrit link=topic=80782.msg835254#msg835254 date=1275709290]
Well this isn't good....100 views and no responses. Is the demerit point system so confusing that no one can answer a simple question about it?
[/quote]Are you referring to the attendance policy?

What "demerit"system?

[quote author=ldgarrit link=topic=80782.msg835041#msg835041 date=1275651509]
I can't seem to get a good explanation on the demerit point system at my terminal so I was hoping someone out here could shed some light. From my understanding, it seems to me that guy could point out quite quickly for a few minor incidents incurred over a short period of time.
[/quote]

I'll take a stab at it...
well, sort of...
the point system awards one half of one negative point for every year you go accident free. Accidents earn you points (positive) based on dollar amount of damages. However, my understanding is that the whole safety program (awards and punitive formulas) has been "under construction" for some time now. And, I know this may be hard for the non-drinkers in our audience (kool-aid) to comprehend, but there are drivers included on the advisory panel. The easiest and fastest way to the facts on this... once again, I'll type slow for the non-drinkers, would be to call the safety department.

I have never even heard of this. Are you talking about the DOT program where all accidents follow you around now from company to company, even the minor ones that do not involve the authorities or any other vehicles???

[quote author=ldgarrit link=topic=80782.msg835041#msg835041 date=1275651509]
I can't seem to get a good explanation on the demerit point system at my terminal so I was hoping someone out here could shed some light. From my understanding, it seems to me that guy could point out quite quickly for a few minor incidents incurred over a short period of time.
[/quote] From my understanding it is 1 of 2 ways. I am not sure witch 1 it is, it might depend on where you are at. 1. Points are "awarded" to you for any kind of preventable accident. This includes, the trailer just coming off of the 5th wheel and landing on the frame. It dose NOT even have to hit the ground. ! point is given to you from $0 to $500(?) and continues upward. Not sure of all the points vs dollar amounts. You can be let at 6 points I believe. 2. You get 1 point/accident. No matter the cost of it. I thought we were all going under the second 1, but I'm not sure. It has only been 2 years since the video was shown on it, so it may not even be in effect yet. I know the old cental was under the 1st and western was under the 2nd, south I have no clue on. To the best of MY knowledge this is correct, but then again I'm married so I may never be right on anything. I hope this helps.

Magicman, it was explained to me in a similar way as far as points being assessed based on monetary damages, but two questions I asked of my HR person weren't answered to my satisfaction. Is the system of passing out demerit points standardized across all of Con-way freight and when do the points reset? I was told that a driver gets 1 safety point, (good point) for every year he/shehas no bad points and 2 points in a time period where a driver has negative points on his/her company driving record. When I asked when negative points come off, I was told that for each negative point assigned, the date for getting good points resets to one year after the last negative incident. So for example, if a driver got 2 bad points in Feb. and then another bad point in December of the same year, he wouldn't have a chance at earning any positive points to offset the 3 bad points until Dec of the following year. Very confusing to me, for a company who is ISO......blah blah blah certified and is on the fortune 500.

This is what I know. For tripples, If you ditch a set of tripples it is grounds for termination. No extended point credit is given for pulling that third trailer. The whole point thing is confusing.

the point thing has given me a migrane :nono:

the guys have it right... negative points for accidents, positive ones for safe driving. I don't think it's standard across the system yet... our safety supervisor said that they are in the process of changing from the points system to the 3 accidents and your done. Doesn't matter if it's 3 rollovers, or 3 dents to a trailer, 3 and your done. I believe southern is this way. One of our guys hit the ditch and flipped the B box on it's side... RSM wanted to terminate, but they had to go points on it because the new system is not in effect yet. After you get your LOI explaining how many demerit points you are going to get, it can change. My personal example... I rear-ended a super B ( icy roads, and tired...). was assessed 3 demerit points in the letter. Brought me down to one positive. 3 months later, I asked the SCM to give me a points balance... he said I have a balance of -2, which means they added 3 demerit points after the fact. I wanted an explanation, and was told that they added the extra demerits because the cost of the repairs was more than they had assessed when the letter was issued. They never told me, never said a thing. So if someone is close to the 8 demerit mark ( when you can be terminated) This can really screw you. for your own curisosity, get your points balance and see if it matches what it should be.

Never heard of it

[quote author=upnorth link=topic=80782.msg835445#msg835445 date=1275791966]
the guys have it right... negative points for accidents, positive ones for safe driving. I don't think it's standard across the system yet... our safety supervisor said that they are in the process of changing from the points system to the 3 accidents and your done. Doesn't matter if it's 3 rollovers, or 3 dents to a trailer, 3 and your done. I believe southern is this way. One of our guys hit the ditch and flipped the B box on it's side... RSM wanted to terminate, but they had to go points on it because the new system is not in effect yet. After you get your LOI explaining how many demerit points you are going to get, it can change. My personal example... I rear-ended a super B ( icy roads, and tired...). was assessed 3 demerit points in the letter. Brought me down to one positive. 3 months later, I asked the SCM to give me a points balance... he said I have a balance of -2, which means they added 3 demerit points after the fact. I wanted an explanation, and was told that they added the extra demerits because the cost of the repairs was more than they had assessed when the letter was issued. They never told me, never said a thing. So if someone is close to the 8 demerit mark ( when you can be terminated) This can really screw you. for your own curisosity, get your points balance and see if it matches what it should be.
[/quote]

It is not a system...more of an evaluation.

One thing in this company is clear...nothing is consistent or dependable.

The points are little more than ammo to dismiss someone they don't want or desire to make an example of...

Its nothing more than documentation (which the lawyer types demand!) and another way to intimidate the drivers.

Points be damned...if they want you to stay you will...if they want you gone...then adios.

Its that simple.

Remember...this is a company with no published policy manual...making rules on the fly...to fit their needs...why should this be any different?

Rat

[quote author=Rat link=topic=80782.msg844088#msg844088 date=1278390896]
It is not a system...more of an evaluation.

One thing in this company is clear...nothing is consistent or dependable.

The points are little more than ammo to dismiss someone they don't want or desire to make an example of...

Its nothing more than documentation (which the lawyer types demand!) and another way to intimidate the drivers.

Points be damned...if they want you to stay you will...if they want you gone...then adios.

Its that simple.

Remember...this is a company with no published policy manual...making rules on the fly...to fit their needs...why should this be any different?

Rat
[/quote]

Yep, after seeing the system working at my SIC, I have formed the same opinion you just offered. So now I guess I'm trying how to figure out how where the "I" part of S.I.C.E figures in here. The company wants us to report every incident, no matter how small and yet I see where guys get demerit points for cosmetic damage that goes unrepaired. I mean the least the company could do is spend the money that they took away from the employee in the form of demerit points. The company suffers little or nothing in financial damage and the employee is a big step closer to losing his job, seems a bit disproportionate to me. They encourage us to be part of the team, but yet have a system of discipline in place which does little more than scare the hell out of everyone and produces everything except teamwork. Anyway, I think I've learned what I needed to know from this thread and I hope some other people have as well.

[quote author=ldgarrit link=topic=80782.msg844146#msg844146 date=1278421198]
Yep, after seeing the system working at my SIC, I have formed the same opinion you just offered. So now I guess I'm trying how to figure out how where the "I" part of S.I.C.E figures in here. The company wants us to report every incident, no matter how small and yet I see where guys get demerit points for cosmetic damage that goes unrepaired. I mean the least the company could do is spend the money that they took away from the employee in the form of demerit points. The company suffers little or nothing in financial damage and the employee is a big step closer to losing his job, seems a bit disproportionate to me. They encourage us to be part of the team, but yet have a system of discipline in place which does little more than scare the hell out of everyone and produces everything except teamwork. Anyway, I think I've learned what I needed to know from this thread and I hope some other people have as well.
[/quote]

You are right...they want you to report everything. At your expense.

Continuously threatened with the nonsensical videos of unreported damage being an automatic dismissal does exactly as you have described...it scares the hell out of people. That is by design.

It also gives the company the leverage to automatically decide everything is preventable...unless it is so blatantly obvious that is non-preventable that any court would over turn the decision.

The ability to ascribe fault to the driver gives the impression the organization is "safety minded"...when in reality the truth is quite different. Then of course there the reports given to the appropriate governmental agencies...

Automatically assigning guilt to the involved driver absolves the company from any real investigative responsibility. Then the burden comes upon the driver to prover his/her innocence.

All the while touting the grandeur of participation in the TDC...erstwhile doing everything they can to prevent such participation.

It is a dog and pony show...nothing more. Saying one thing and doing another...promoting a core value when in reality it is little more than a show. Safety at this company is nothing more than catch phrase...to sell to the public...to the governmental agencies...to the customers...it is a sales tool.

The "I" factor dissappeared long ago...never to return.

It has finally happened...they have become nothing more than just another carrier...

"Excellence" has become just another buzz word with no meaning...

Rat