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ABF | Central States Drops Pension Cut Bomb

ABFer said:
For a new member here you come out guns blazing, God's gift to us all, soothsayer of soothsayers. Seeing as you're from Louisville, KY you might already know how the UPS barns got railroaded down there. If that's not a demonstration that hope is lost with Hoffa and Co. nothing is. Tell us oh great one how they voted their stuff away like the 'vote 'til you get it right' folks at YRC did. And you can fight any fight you want, I'll pick the ones that I stand a chance of winning after I assess the situation. As for getting into it with you if I feel you are wrong I'll speak up. :notworthy:
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I came out with my guns blazing just because I stated an opinion as a new member and you sit there and talk about someone who thinks they are superior. You sir are the one that came out with the guns blazing but the only problem which you will soon find out is that they are loaded with blanks. You will also have to forgive me sir because I will also speak up if I feel you base your decisions on fear instead of rationality. Seeing that you work at ABF I wouldnt throw stones at UPS and talk of being railroaded and such.So lets put that need you feel you may have to put this newbie in place for having the nerve to give an opinion that you disagree with and discuss what you are really afraid of. Do you actually feel that the numbers are there between the freight division and parcel to vote Hoffa and Co. out?
 
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ABFer said:
Hey since you're in the know on everything maybe you have the skinny on the latest on our contract I've heard about. Just a rumor to me but I've heard that the IBT and ABF and/or YRC agreed to pay part time dock casuals more money than the contract calls for. No vote on our part just a gimme for people who aren't even employed by the company(s) at this time. Is this fact or fiction? Inquiring minds want to know.
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Well look at you, I come here and give my opinion and you want it make it look like Im a know it all. You sir need to grow up and atleast try to act accordingly.
 
ESP said:
I am stating the truth, If you watch the forum you will know I am not for any cuts at all. However reality is here, you may not know as most people who are not on here much did not know till the Central States Letter was received last week and then the follow up Town hall call from CS. I am still fighting the fight, letters to senators and the Congress. I do not believe much can be done about this, as new Laws are hard to cancel or change. There is a real problem with the pension fund, that is why the law was slipped in with the spending bill to pass. Real fast, no one knows what the cuts are or look like, we will all receive letters in June or July, detailing each ones personal cuts. The cuts can range from 60% for Orphans and 30% cuts for all other current retirees, 75 to 80 a sliding scale cut to max. 80 and over no cut. Disabled pension holders no cut. I can only assume those making less than 1200 will receive no cut or not much of one. I may have left some one out, sorry. I am fighting for equal cuts across the board to everyone. I know I have a snowball chance in hell of getting my way. I did not give up. I see reality, I am saying it would be better to receive a 30% cut than a 60% cut. We are all Teamsters, we are all Equal. We are all going to fix this thing,( because the law says we are ) no one else is going to bail us out. The Law is passed. Thanks for asking me. Jump on me anytime you want to. I have sent over 2000 letters and emails since December, how many have you sent? Thanks for joining trucking boards.
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Thank you for the welcome and If you are still fighting and not giving up, I apologize sir because that one post made it look otherwise. Everyday I run across members young and older that just dont have any fight anymore and it sickens me to see where our union is heading because of it.
 
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Hang around and read a lot and you will see who is for what. ABFer, is a good guy, there is a lot of tension in the pension talks right now. I suspect it will get worse. I post a lot on the YRCW links, I did not work there, I retired from a non existent company. I would be labeled an ORPHAN, some think we are the scum of the earth. I have 31 years paid in and some think I am not entitled to a full pension, because my company folded. :wtflol:
 
ESP said:
Hang around and read a lot and you will see who is for what. ABFer, is a good guy, there is a lot of tension in the pension talks right now. I suspect it will get worse. I post a lot on the YRCW links, I did not work there, I retired from a non existent company. I would be labeled an ORPHAN, some think we are the scum of the earth. I have 31 years paid in and some think I am not entitled to a full pension, because my company folded. :wtflol:
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Yeah that's not cool. I'm not even employed by a union line, but if you worked 31 years it's not your fault your former employer went belly up.
 
ESP said:
Hang around and read a lot and you will see who is for what. ABFer, is a good guy, there is a lot of tension in the pension talks right now. I suspect it will get worse. I post a lot on the YRCW links, I did not work there, I retired from a non existent company. I would be labeled an ORPHAN, some think we are the scum of the earth. I have 31 years paid in and some think I am not entitled to a full pension, because my company folded. :wtflol:
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I will give you my opinion which Im sure some will come here and accuse me once again of blazing guns a firing but you sir are entitled to a full pension just like everyone else and even more than some,you had no vote that you knew might have a chance of effecting your future benefits like some did. As for ABFer, being that I don't know him I can't say one way or another but the impression I now have of him is not so good because of the way he jumped on me for being a newbie and having the gull to post my opinion even when my reply wasn't meant for him. All I can say is that it doesnt make one feel too welcome when a moderator tries to jump all over your first posts as a new member. It kind of made me feel that I made a wrong turn and ended up in Mayberry.
 
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nounionfool said:
I came out with my guns blazing just because I stated an opinion as a new member and you sit there and talk about someone who thinks they are superior. You sir are the one that came out with the guns blazing but the only problem which you will soon find out is that they are loaded with blanks. You will also have to forgive me sir because I will also speak up if I feel you base your decisions on fear instead of rationality. Seeing that you work at ABF I wouldnt throw stones at UPS and talk of being railroaded and such.So lets put that need you feel you may have to put this newbie in place for having the nerve to give an opinion that you disagree with and discuss what you are really afraid of. Do you actually feel that the numbers are there between the freight division and parcel to vote Hoffa and Co. out?
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1) You came out with your guns blazing accusing everyone of giving up and not fighting a worthwhile fight. Your first two posts in ABF and YRC forums were attacks on posting users.
2) I threw no stones at UPS. I pointed out that they rejected their contract and that the IBT shoved it down their throat anyway. I thought that you, being from KY and being in the know on things, would know all about this action.
3) Your notion that I am afraid of your opinions is laughable at best.
4) No, I am a realist and I know that the minority that is UPS and Freight will never carry the weight to toss Hoffa into the history books where he should be.
 
Here's your first two posts as a new member here:
nounionfool said:
We are still a union company, its just that many of the members have traded their pride and honor for what they considered to be lucky enough to have a job. Dont blame the union for the union officials being able to scare the membership to the point where they would rather trade their soul for another week of work instead of having to fight and preserve what the union stands for.
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nounionfool said:
Sounds to me like you already gave up the farm. What makes you an expert at knowing what retirees can afford or not afford?
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And you posted these because of me?
 
ABFer said:
1) You came out with your guns blazing accusing everyone of giving up and not fighting a worthwhile fight. Your first two posts in ABF and YRC forums were attacks on posting users.
2) I threw no stones at UPS. I pointed out that they rejected their contract and that the IBT shoved it down their throat anyway. I thought that you, being from KY and being in the know on things, would know all about this action.
3) Your notion that I am afraid of your opinions is laughable at best.
4) No, I am a realist and I know that the minority that is UPS and Freight will never carry the weight to toss Hoffa into the history books where he should be.
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You get a reprieve so consider this your lucky day sir. Now I see the truth in what you said about only picking the fights you know you can win. Just so you can live with knowing what really happened because I can.
 
ABFer said:
Hey since you're in the know on everything maybe you have the skinny on the latest on our contract I've heard about. Just a rumor to me but I've heard that the IBT and ABF and/or YRC agreed to pay part time dock casuals more money than the contract calls for. No vote on our part just a gimme for people who aren't even employed by the company(s) at this time. Is this fact or fiction? Inquiring minds want to know.
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Fact. dock workers and casuals bumped up to 16 hr for life of contract. no member input. so why doesn"t the IBT call for the company to reinstate my vacation. seems the company is having trouble hiring anybody and goes to the IBT for help. The IBT just gives it to them without anything in return. could have at least got something out of it. maybe not vacation but how about bumping those breaks back up to what we had ? damn just try to get something for us and make it seem to appear the IBT is there for us. rant over
 
disgruntled teamster said:
Fact. dock workers and casuals bumped up to 16 hr for life of contract. no member input. so why doesn"t the IBT call for the company to reinstate my vacation. seems the company is having trouble hiring anybody and goes to the IBT for help. The IBT just gives it to them without anything in return. could have at least got something out of it. maybe not vacation but how about bumping those breaks back up to what we had ? damn just try to get something for us and make it seem to appear the IBT is there for us. rant over
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You are correct. They should have got something in return for this and if they couldn't get anything in return they should've just told ABF "We will look at it at contract time". The time for rolling over has come and gone. Of course I don't think Jr and friends see it the same way I do.
 
OT=$36/hr+-, casual dock worker $16+- =$20/hr savings to the company. Bigger bonuses are in order for the upper echelon at ABF. :guiness: Sure makes me proud to be a Teamster...
 
I would like to know how many members take their complaints and angrily show their displeasure to the local representation and international instead of just balling about it to other members. I see members all the time complaining to others but keep their mouths shut at the local meeting thats if they bother to show up at all.Sure they may ask a polite question or 2 then its back to the usual kissing up and that gentlemen is one of the main problems with the membership today.
 
nounionfool said:
I would like to know how many members take their complaints and angrily show their displeasure to the local representation and international instead of just balling about it to other members. I see members all the time complaining to others but keep their mouths shut at the local meeting thats if they bother to show up at all.Sure they may ask a polite question or 2 then its back to the usual kissing up and that gentlemen is one of the main problems with the membership today.
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While I agree with your theory. I've been there, done that got nowhere.
 
nounionfool said:
I would like to know how many members take their complaints and angrily show their displeasure to the local representation and international instead of just balling about it to other members. I see members all the time complaining to others but keep their mouths shut at the local meeting thats if they bother to show up at all.Sure they may ask a polite question or 2 then its back to the usual kissing up and that gentlemen is one of the main problems with the membership today.
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I'll even suggest that you try your hand at doing so. We can discuss which issues are our hot buttons, you can go the union meeting and 'angrily show your displeasure' and report back to us on how you make out.
 
ABFer said:
I'll even suggest that you try your hand at doing so. We can discuss which issues are our hot buttons, you can go the union meeting and 'angrily show your displeasure' and report back to us on how you make out.
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Hmmm, theres no need to get obnoxious, that is unless you feel guilty about something that you feel you dont have the courage to do and spite those that do.
 
nounionfool said:
Hmmm, theres no need to get obnoxious, that is unless you feel guilty about something that you feel you dont have the courage to do and spite those that do.
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I fail to see anything obnoxious about it. You made a suggestion and I followed up suggesting that you give it a try. What's the matter, you got cold feet? Or have you gotten caught suggesting that other people do something that you never did and/or won't try? And your defense is to accuse me?
 
ABFer said:
I fail to see anything obnoxious about it. You made a suggestion and I followed up suggesting that you give it a try. What's the matter, you got cold feet? Or have you gotten caught suggesting that other people do something that you never did and/or won't try? And your defense is to accuse me?
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I fail to see what me stating that I have already went well beyond what you have suggested would prove but will do so because I can say that theres no doubt in my mind that your claim of 'I've been there, done that got nowhere' was either wishful thinking on your part or a plain lie because if you had, you would of never said 'got nowhere'. So, why not just take your own advice at your next local meeting plus call each of the international representatives and then you come back here and tell us what the consequences and repercussions or your actions were. I will tell you this, you will first have to leave at least three messages making sure the last one is nasty enough for them to get irate enough to return your call which will be 2 or 3 days later. Then, you and I will have plenty to talk about once you do that.
 
I suppose that if I vouch for Brother ABFer and his active Unionism,...,.that will be viewed as a conspiracy... Oh, well.....I've been accused of worse,.........besides, outside of our friendship, I don't think Bro. ABFer wants me to fight his battles for him,,..I'm well aware he can do that on his own...But here goes.......Many of us are proud of our Union,....but deeply disappointed with our.......uh....."leadership",.....so,..many of us are working actively to try and take our Union back. But,......as any good general will tell you,....you need troops to follow you into battle. As a steward, I'm frustrated by many member's attitude. The idea of:"What's the use, you'll get nowhere." is playing right into the hands of our...." leadership ". That personally offends me.....If you're paying dues, you might as well get your moneys' worth,...and fight back. I just filed two grievances on Art.12,.....uniform policy,.... that went off like a stink bomb in a convent,.....I had filed two grievances over whether Holidays are voluntary, or could be forced,... partial victory,....guys paid properly, retained the right to grieve same issue in the future,.......No backing from the IBT on either issue,..,..luckily I have very good Local representatives..Keep fighting and doni give up.That's what they want.
 
I filed a grievance over a year ago on converting TimeKeeper revenues to Panther. Last I hear it was so serious an issue that it was in Hoffa's hands. I really don't expect to hear any more. Maybe nounionfool can give me guidance on my next step?
 
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