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Holland | Just a question.

(Not referring to you SS) But most of the greenhorns don't deserve to get to skip the pay progression process, and there are also some that have been there for a year or two that don't deserve to either, because they are not very good at what they do.
I've heard from two drivers, from the same company, that said that they were rewarded with skipping the pay progression process because of their experience and they proved that they were worthy of it in a short period of time.
 
Northern Flash said:
(Not referring to you SS) But most of the greenhorns don't deserve to get to skip the pay progression process, and there are also some that have been there for a year or two that don't deserve to either, because they are not very good at what they do.
I've heard from two drivers, from the same company, that said that they were rewarded with skipping the pay progression process because of their experience and they proved that they were worthy of it in a short period of time.
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When I started everyone was paid the same, everyone was doing the same job why shouldn't they get paid the same. The 2 tier pay scale was about nothing but saving money for the company. Before you talk about experience remember when your new you work much harder than someone with time on the job. So I will disagree with you on the greenhorns not skipping the pay progression progress. Everyone is doing the same job so everyone should be paid the same. If anything the members should try and have the 2 tier pay scale removed at the next contract. It was implemented in the early 80's if I remember correctly and only because the members didn't care about the new employees, one of the low times of the union imo.
 
30yearman said:
When I started everyone was paid the same, everyone was doing the same job why shouldn't they get paid the same. The 2 tier pay scale was about nothing but saving money for the company. Before you talk about experience remember when your new you work much harder than someone with time on the job. So I will disagree with you on the greenhorns not skipping the pay progression progress. Everyone is doing the same job so everyone should be paid the same. If anything the members should try and have the 2 tier pay scale removed at the next contract. It was implemented in the early 80's if I remember correctly and only because the members didn't care about the new employees, one of the low times of the union imo.
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Bingo.! I remember starting out at 70%, then going to 100% after your 91st day. I watched the red circle of senority, the double breasting of union company's. Now they have divided the men, lets lower the wages for all if we can and they are doing just that. We used our retirement and medical benefits to sign up new members to get a union vote. Now they act as if our pension is an expendable item..! The Mafia back then owned our IBT president. The more dues paying members the more they took, they were taking millions from our pension and general fund. Now this group of idiots have lost billion's and our fund is no more than a ponzi scheme.

At one time we stood together, now it is city vs road vs dock vs yard vs old driver vs new driver. I could never figure out that if we go on strike we will lose our freight....how can it be any different than missing pick up's everyday or setting freight in storage trailers for days. It's one company, one union go after the freight...not your employee's pay checks. They are not reinvesting into the company, it is only a matter of time until the pad locks come out. Then they will blame the lazy union workers for the closing.! Same old story, just a new name on the door.!

It seems to be a never ending battle with no relief in sight. Company's either grow or die...downsizing never works. I cannot recall a single company still in business that was involved in a give back or a down sizing. They had better do what they can to keep the work force intact...even a 30 year just retired guy knows more than these Kids about what needs to be done to turn customer service into the number one goal..!
 
Remember the good old boys are the ones that voted for the 2 tiered system. Everyone always remembers the old timers sticking together and blaming the new guys for ruining the company but it had to start by the old timers voting in the devisive 2 tiered system to begin with. Just being fair to the new guys cause i see the same thing going on now. A lot of 25 year plus guys voted for concessions just to make sure their time was finished to get their 30 years in and bending the younger guys over in the process. Just tired of the fingers always being pointed at our future. Without them there is no pension at all. Not blaming anyone but ourselves on this one.
 
30yearman said:
Before you talk about experience remember when your new you work much harder than someone with time on the job.
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You are correct on the new guys working harder than the veterans. The problem is that the goal at a job is to "work SMARTER, not HARDER." Veterans make the job look easy because they are usually more efficient than a greenhorn. Where a greenhorn runs around like a chicken with it's head cut off, and doesn't accomplish near as much because of their inefficiency.

So I will disagree with you on the greenhorns not skipping the pay progression progress.
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But let me make myself clear on this. Just because you could be new at a company, doesn't make you a greenhorn, if you have experience from another company and already know the system. A greenhorn is new to the industry.

If a true greenhorn gets to skip pay progression, there would be no point in having a two or three tier pay progression.
 
Northern Flash said:
(Not referring to you SS) But most of the greenhorns don't deserve to get to skip the pay progression process, and there are also some that have been there for a year or two that don't deserve to either, because they are not very good at what they do.
I've heard from two drivers, from the same company, that said that they were rewarded with skipping the pay progression process because of their experience and they proved that they were worthy of it in a short period of time.
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, there are definitely some greenhorns that don't deserve minimum wage but, they shouldn't have been hired to begin with lol. We have 1 that nobody would take with them for his week of training, he was, and is, a horrendous driver!! They didn't listen, and still put him on the road. IMO it's just a matter of time before he kills somebody and costs millions in lawsuits. The long wage progression keeps good drivers away IMO, among other things lol.
Have yet to hear what the new guy that killed 2 firemen in KY has/will cost the Co but, I'm sure it will be substantial
 
Northern Flash said:
You are correct on the new guys working harder than the veterans. The problem is that the goal at a job is to "work SMARTER, not HARDER." Veterans make the job look easy because they are usually more efficient than a greenhorn. Where a greenhorn runs around like a chicken with it's head cut off, and doesn't accomplish near as much because of their inefficiency.

But let me make myself clear on this. Just because you could be new at a company, doesn't make you a greenhorn, if you have experience from another company and already know the system. A greenhorn is new to the industry.

If a true greenhorn gets to skip pay progression, there would be no point in having a two or three tier pay progression.
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Disagree completely. The old timers at my barn will peddle circles around the new hires. The bottom of the list does nothing but complain about their loads, their tractors, their lack of hours, their forced overtime, they bring freight back because they just dont want to go to that stop, and a good portion of them have spent a part of their wage progression on work comp. Meanwhile the old timers keep plugging away.
 
yrc-atm said:
Disagree completely. The old timers at my barn will peddle circles around the new hires. The bottom of the list does nothing but complain about their loads, their tractors, their lack of hours, their forced overtime, they bring freight back because they just dont want to go to that stop, and a good portion of them have spent a part of their wage progression on work comp. Meanwhile the old timers keep plugging away.
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This old timer pulled the plug!!
 
yrc-atm said:
Disagree completely. The old timers at my barn will peddle circles around the new hires. The bottom of the list does nothing but complain about their loads, their tractors, their lack of hours, their forced overtime, they bring freight back because they just dont want to go to that stop, and a good portion of them have spent a part of their wage progression on work comp. Meanwhile the old timers keep plugging away.
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What did you do yrc-atm, just read the first two words then make your comment?(post #45) Go back and read the entire post again, and you'll see that we don't disagree at all. We completely agree. Go back and re-read it.
 
sharpshooter said:
Oh yeah, there are definitely some greenhorns that don't deserve minimum wage but, they shouldn't have been hired to begin with lol. We have 1 that nobody would take with them for his week of training, he was, and is, a horrendous driver!! They didn't listen, and still put him on the road. IMO it's just a matter of time before he kills somebody and costs millions in lawsuits. The long wage progression keeps good drivers away IMO, among other things lol.
Have yet to hear what the new guy that killed 2 firemen in KY has/will cost the Co but, I'm sure it will be substantial
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The tragedy that happened in KY, with the 2 firemen killed, I've heard different stories about that one. The most recent story was the driver was found not at fault after an investigation. Don't know if that's true or not. Either way he won't work in this industry again most likely.

We had another tragedy on a bridge not too long ago involving a senior man out of Indy. I haven't heard anything about that one lately.

My point is we are all one split second away every night, from a momentary lapse in judgement, a bad decision, or just a freak accident.

Every senior man is not a million mile safe driver, and every new hire is not a hack.
 
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