2018 contract talks.

Discussion in 'ABF Freight System' started by canaryinthemine, Jan 9, 2017.

  1. Cab Lizzard

    Cab Lizzard Well-Known Member

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    Now remember when all of the NMFA companies just had to have more flexibility to compete with the race to the bottom crowd ?
    They got what they wanted and are still to stupid to use it to their advantage. A bunch of DMF's in management at all of the member company's IMO.
     
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  2. LTLAnonymous

    LTLAnonymous Active Member

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    God...I'm so sorry for you guys having to go through this. My last two years at Abf were the worst years of my trucking career, and it sounds like it's only getting worse. I'm really pulling for you guys to get a win on this contract.
     
  3. canaryinthemine

    canaryinthemine Retirement....The Job I Was Born To Have!

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    Thank you Brother. We're off to an early start on this only because, in my opinion, the IBT no longer takes contract negotiations seriously.

    Plus......(also in my opinion.....)..... the head cheeses in "leadership" positions in our Union........ may be a little distracted with Federal charges filed,..... and might not have their thoughts completely on contract negotiations.

    Wouldn't that be a great tactic? Labor Secretary Pudzner stall on pressing forward on the charges filed on Mess'rs Hall/ Aloise et al,.....Until just right before contract talks start........Real "good" publicity........Great way to lose sympathy from the public , and convince people those lyin' theivin' lazy Union truckdrivers are once again trying to beat up on those poor ,downtrodden CEO's...... who are just trying to provide food, clothing, and shelter to the masses at a reasonable cost,......And make a little profit, too.

    So it's best that we in the rank-and-file start getting our strategies in place,......long before the IBT starts to blunder into contract negotiations.....

    Me......I'll probably be gone by June,....... provided this incoming administration doesn't screw up healthcare so badly I can't afford to retire..... But I'd like to leave this Union in better strategic position for contracts than we were last time.,
     
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  4. LTLAnonymous

    LTLAnonymous Active Member

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    I just don't know if freight is ever going to come back. YRC (my starter union LTL outfit) is just weakening the entire sector with their ability to run cheap freight at non-union prices. I wish something would happen with them, one way or the other. Either fold or start giving their employees some of those concessions back. It's ridiculous, and as much as I want ABF to just scoff at them and proudly charge a profitable fee to run freight, the company still needs volume to stay afloat. Competing with YRC as they are is an atrocity.

    And the union leadership just couldn't be more useless. I'm lucky in working for a company that actually has a good working relationship with the union, but in general? Oh my lord, what hell hath Hoffa and Co. wrought?

    I have no answers for any of this, and it's frustrating.
     
  5. ABFer

    ABFer Super Moderator Staff Member

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    It sounds like you're counting on Bammercare for your health insurance for a bit. When I looked into it I found that I'd either be paying about $14,000/yr for good coverage or $5000/yr for coverage with a $5000 deductible and then 80/20 coverage after deductible. Either way I'd be paying out the wazoo for something that I wouldn't use that much of. But someone who had no income would get gubment subsidies and primo coverage for something like $600/yr. In my opinion it looked like I was to pay for the health insurance for those who didn't want to work.
     
  6. canaryinthemine

    canaryinthemine Retirement....The Job I Was Born To Have!

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    Many people work a very poorly paying non- Union job just for the healthcare. Some of those are our competition, and that drives our wages down, Labor-pool wise.

    As long as "healthcare" is controlled by employers,....... both availability and cost,.......Then you'll have a constant downward spiral for actual wages. Obamacare scared both the employers and insurers by offering a third option not tied to a captive labor pool..........One previously only available to those over 65 or the disabled.......Or, as employers call them: The worthless........

    This is the true reason the lobbying for repeal of Obamacare was so vehement. Employers saw a gradual loss of control over labor wages, and insurers saw an increase in competition,......Like all that car insurance offers you get on a daily basis in your mailbox.........

    That's why Congress had 60 votes over an eight year period to remove Obamacare.....And now we have two weeks for Mr. Trump to come up with something to replace it with......

    I fear that a new " Trumpcare" plan will push many retirees right back into the Labor pool..

    You want a good scare? Go read Paul Ryan's plan for Medicare.......
     
  7. ABFer

    ABFer Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I've been wrong before but I don't see healthcare getting yanked out from under us or seriously deteriorated anytime soon, Americans are already on edge and if something sets us off they'll fix it toot sweet (that means real quick where I come from). I do not see a lack of competition as the cause, or even a cause, of high insurance costs. I see the level of coverage as being responsible for that along with abuse by doctors and patients as well. When someone else is paying the bill it's easy to err to the side of safety rather than back off on that test, exam or procedure. And the cost of healthcare also represents the value that we put on life itself...save anyone/everyone at all costs and some of the waste that I have seen first hand is boggling. i e, kid falls off bike and brakes arm, gets medivaced to distant hospital when an automobile ride to the nearest hospital would have even been faster, not to mention $20,000 cheaper. Homeless person gets arm broken in physical attack, same thing. BTW, the kid lived in the ghetto and the homeless guy lived in the woods, who's paying for that? Ohhh but the level of healthcare is sacred ground not to be discussed.

    Then there's the outright fraud, particularly with medicare. And much of that is perpetrated by the health care givers themselves. Watch TV at 2 or 3 AM and check out the commercials. It used to be The Scooter Store, able to get you a Hoverround when you didn't think you qualified. Then they replaced those commercials with clips of the FBI hauling all their records out the front door and crime scene tape all around the place. Now there are commercials for back, knee and elbow braces with a striking similarity to those Scooter Store commercials..."At little or no cost to you". Then at the hospital or doctor's office they never let an opportunity to score several hundred dollars escape. I once had a doctor charge some $200+ for spending 10 seconds scraping the wax out of my ear with a tool when I was in there for a nasal infection. I haven't seen it first hand but second hand stories report an unknown doctor swinging by a hospital patient and signing his medical chart then charging for the unrequested, unwarranted 'visit'.

    In closing I'd like to submit my 'DNR' and just ask that you stick me in an old Cadillac station wagon and haul me to the hospital in my time of need. If I don't make it rest at ease that I will not be worried about it. :soapbox:
     
  8. canaryinthemine

    canaryinthemine Retirement....The Job I Was Born To Have!

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    I don't think Cadillac makes hearses anymore, let alone station wagons....... Guy up the street has an Oldsmobile Vista cruiser....... circa 1969...... in case you're planning on having a "need" soon......He just changed the oil.....

    So what you're telling me is that in your opinion , rampant greed and outright theft is the reason healthcare costs are so high? We'll, I'll heartily agree with you there , Brother.........

    Somehow our public perception of the healthcare ....." industry"......became just that,...... an "Industry"........ where profit and loss,,.......and the subsequent blurring of the ethical line between charging fairly and.... profiteering like Blackbeard the pirate,......... are now more important than actually curing and caring for people.

    I just went in for a ......"Wellness" ... physical, and in spite of my repeated instructions that I wanted no more than what was required,........ apparently the doctor snuck a few chargeable tests on me......( or maybe just billed me for them....I honestly don't know....).....

    After a few nasty go-rounds with the Insurance billing department, I was told to pay up, or go to collections.........


    Why do I feel like I've just done business with a Mafia loan shark?

    Do you think ...... "healthcare".......will get any better in the future? Or should I start cashing in my Kruugerands now?
     
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  9. ABFer

    ABFer Super Moderator Staff Member

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    My crystal ball is foggy on this one. In order for our healthcare system to 'heal' it would take a major effort by our government. However, I do believe that heavy handed fraud and misconduct sting would be cost effective. See...people are people and in many ways we are all the same. Almost all of us will do what we 'are allowed to do' (translates to 'get away with') and those working in our healthcare system go unchecked for a large part. And many times we don't even know we've been had, we just know that we have a hefty bill to pay. Other times we know or suspect that we've been had but have no way to deal with it. Once they get away with one thing they move onto another and before you know it what once was reprehensible behavior is a widely used and accepted practice.
     
  10. canaryinthemine

    canaryinthemine Retirement....The Job I Was Born To Have!

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    Hah! "Get away with....." If I showed that to my boss, he would say that's my average work day.......

    Since when did businesses become so amoral? Frick/Carnegie era?........... Or back further,.......like all the way back to Og the caveman cheating Luk out of clamshells on a routine business deal involving sabertooth tiger tusks?

    That was rhetorical..........I know the answer.

    But I still wonder why there's no such thing as an honest businessman,..........especially in healthcare. You figure that would be the one "industry" that would make an effort to be ethical.........I mean , it's not like ......trucking.........where a good cheating is an expected part of your day.......
     
  11. vongrimmenstein

    vongrimmenstein Well-Known Member

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    That is exactly right. Paying for the illegal alien walking thru the ER room with 2 kids in tow. By Federal law they can’t turn them away. The Affordable Care Act is the reason you need to pay that 10 grand a year to the Feds. Someone has to pay for mom & child, why not you?


    Like I posted earlier, my neighbor decided to pay the 1800 dollars to the feds. She has worked in the medical insurance field for the last 30 years & still chose to pay the fine. So much cheaper & her out of pocket expense for medical that year was less than 800.00. With a math answer like that I would have paid the fine also. Do you pay your mortgage? Or pay for mom & her two kids in the ER?
     
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  12. ABFer

    ABFer Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I wonder how Stoney's doing. :idunno:
     
  13. canaryinthemine

    canaryinthemine Retirement....The Job I Was Born To Have!

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    I did my nine year stint as an O/O back in the '80's.........People always ask me what it's like being an O/O,........ and I always tell them the same thing:

    It's cheaper and less painful to buy a ball-peen hammer and smack yourself in the forehead every time you think about owning a truck..........

    I hope he's doing well.........
     
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  14. canaryinthemine

    canaryinthemine Retirement....The Job I Was Born To Have!

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    Ah...........But the illegal alien is here because big business,........in defiance of the E-VERIFY act,..........wants people to work for less than minimum wage,...... with no benefits,.......... so the could make a billion-and-a-half, instead of just a billion. So,........As far as big business is concerned, it's up to us taxpayers to pay for their overhead so they don't have to provide benefits.........( or a living wage,....).

    Hey,......... we're truckdrivers....... we get the back door tour to hundreds of businesses in a year........How many meat-packing plants, nurseries, plastics plants, furniture factories, do we go to where everyone there is an illegal alien?..... not to mention landscapers, pool servicers, and roofers?

    All those flip home shows,........ where they're buying for $400,000 and selling for $600,000, after $20,000 worth of renovations,........Look real closely at the crew doing the work,....... quickly, because they never show them on TV for very long,.......... and tell me if you think they are here legally,......... or did the contractor go up to the parking lot of Home Depot, and pick up his temporary crew? Standard procedure across the country for most contractors nowadays......

    Most of these jobs used to be good family-sustaining jobs........... So,..........Who would be the culprit here? The Employer now making a billion-and-a-half, instead of merely a billion?...….....Or the illegal alien trying to feed his family on a fourth of what they would have to pay to an American,......... who feels lucky to get that fourth?

    If everyone remembers correctly, President Obama did say, about two years ago,........That if businesses really, really needed these illegal immigrants to make a profit,........ Let's make them legal, and subject them to American wage and benefit laws, and start taxing them for Social Security.

    Immediately, the Chamber of Commerce, and every other pro-business group,......, along with the usual suspects on conservative talk shows,........... started screaming about alien amnesty........ proving that businesses feel that you can have your cake and eat it, too............ provided you don't have to pay for it............
     
  15. canaryinthemine

    canaryinthemine Retirement....The Job I Was Born To Have!

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    Sonofagun! We're off-topic...

    And if I keep talking about politics, someone will accuse me of using "alternative facts".....

    Can't have that!

    I just think that pretty much all businesses in this country have degenerated into amoral, people-hating, money machines for just a few ........" Important" people........ and they use the power of the media to trick enough of us working schlobs into thinking the CEO's are the hurt, aggrieved people here.....

    And we fall for it......
     
  16. vongrimmenstein

    vongrimmenstein Well-Known Member

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    Ya nailed it.
     
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  17. BIG R GUY

    BIG R GUY Part time Coop Dispatch driver

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    So you are saying that if yrc went under, abf could raise their rates to make a better profit, and still compete with the non union companies with the non union rates as they are now? I doubt abf or anyone else could just say they are going to raise their rates , and not worry about shipper reaction...most shippers would just go with a different carrier....
     
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  18. Boilerpeddle

    Boilerpeddle Drawing found in trailer

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    Well I had a whole rant typed out here but as is often the case I reconsidered before hitting the button. I hope all those Yrc drivers continue to be employed. But if they didn't I think all the carriers would raise their rates. Capacity goes down rates go up.
     
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  19. BIG R GUY

    BIG R GUY Part time Coop Dispatch driver

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    You are correct on capacity affecting rates. But if yrc closed the doors today, the rest of the LTL companies could easily absorb the 40,000 bills per day they move right now. With things slow and a lot of companies having drivers sitting or laid off, there may be some issues for a few weeks, but rates will eventually retreat. A lot of the problems now with rates is that 3rd party's are controlling more and more freight, and that is litterly driving rates into a bidding war.
     
  20. LTLAnonymous

    LTLAnonymous Active Member

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    Don't take my post negatively. Up until my latest gig, Yellow was my absolute favorite job I'd ever had. I have some *strong* positive memories about them. They just...Ruined both companies when they merged them.

    Lower capacity affects freight cost, but then also lower *low-cost* capacity means the entire sector could start paying hardball with shippers a little easier.

    "Yeah, you paid that with YRC...And look what happened to them. Did you want to transport that product, or not?"
     
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