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TForce | Defeat LHD now while we still have a chance!

If there is to be a strike (and I dont think it will go that far) then I would only guess you would be forfeiting your insurance. A strike would only grow fed ex and other LTL Co. Upsf goal is to be the biggest and best. Yep I know they would increase their Non Union carriers but they would loose a lot of business in the process. Not many Co. want union trouble with their freight. Either way its always good to prepare for the worst as these things can go south very quick. Voting No would be the first step to victory. Remember this will be a message to the IBT also that enough is enough.
 
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Teamsta II said:
The agenda is the truth and facts.

You are already out numbered 2-1 just by the vote totals last June. You can't achieve your goals with the numbers you have. You can't make any case that you will have any stronger support than you did last June. The fact is without overwhelming support in numbers, any job action is doomed to fail. If you can get a 75% turnout at the meetings and the same percentage voting no and then to strike, you may have a chance, but that is highly unlikely. All the vitriol thrown my way will no change the facts.

There are 12000+ freight hourly employees.

Only 60% of the eligible employees voted by mail. Out of that nearly 2000 voted yes vs 4000+ no.

The other 6,000 didn't vote or aren't even eligible.

How do you combat those numbers?
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You might be right. But you keep forgetting one thing, if the union keeps holding hands with ups, and not listening and backing up their dues paying members, well those dues paying members will open up their eyes and close their wallets when it comes to paying dues in a RTW state. And with the great job Obama is doing there will be alot more red states in 2014. And that means more RTW states. I have been pro union my whole life, my father put 30 yrs at yellow, so i come from a union household. But in 2013 we r dealing with a differnt type of union ,this is not my fathers union. This admidastration wouldnt back up yrc like it once did in the 90s when my father went on strike. All we can do is vote no and hope others follow. All the name calling is unwanted stress
 
$outh$side $tre$$ said:
You might be right. But you keep forgetting one thing, if the union keeps holding hands with ups, and not listening and backing up their dues paying members, well those dues paying members will open up their eyes and close their wallets when it comes to paying dues in a RTW state. And with the great job Obama is doing there will be alot more red states in 2014. And that means more RTW states. I have been pro union my whole life, my father put 30 yrs at yellow, so i come from a union household. But in 2013 we r dealing with a differnt type of union ,this is not my fathers union. This admidastration wouldnt back up yrc like it once did in the 90s when my father went on strike. All we can do is vote no and hope others follow. All the name calling is unwanted stress
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The problem is that 50% didn't participate in the first vote. UPS see's that a overall weakness. This is all a numbers game. If only 20% show up to the meetings it will even weaken the negotiations potential more. Even if 90% vote no at the meetings. UPS will see the overall lack of concern by the employees about the contract. This all falls back on the members. If they are not involved, they are not concerned, leaving the overall position weak. UPS sees the vote this way:

12,000+ employees

2000 aren't even union members-16.7%

4000 union members didn't bother to mail a vote-33.3%

4000+ members voted no-33.3%

2000 members voted yes-16.7%

66% for or don't care about the contract

33% against the contract
 
Sorry Teamsta II, but your analysis is flawed. You cannot lump undecided votes into the 66% and call them FOR votes. This is basic political polling analysis. Nice try, but if you are going to try and skew the undecided vote with me you'll need to make a more concerted effort! The undecided's or don't care votes are just that - UNDECIDED!

Maybe there are places in the country where teamster votes can be coerced, but not where I am at.

You'd be great at producing political ads.
 
jdk1600 said:
Sorry Teamsta II, but your analysis is flawed. You cannot lump undecided votes into the 66% and call them FOR votes. This is basic political polling analysis. Nice try, but if you are going to try and skew the undecided vote with me you'll need to make a more concerted effort! The undecided's or don't care votes are just that - UNDECIDED!

Maybe there are places in the country where teamster votes can be coerced, but not where I am at.

You'd be great at producing political ads.
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I said. Don't care. . They decided not to care to vote.

Undecided is your political analysis. The fact is they didn't vote. Which equates to apathy.

That is how UPS is measuring our strength. 6000 out of 12000 are apathetic. Which is sad, but an undeniable fact.
 
I hate to say it, but we will never strike. Too many brand new pickup trucks and $250k mortgages. Blue collar men making $70k+ and still living paycheck to paycheck. It's pretty sad honestly.

I'm all for a strike. Let them shut the doors, I wouldn't care.
 
Then we can agree to disagree. As far as I'm concerned the pool of votes remains the same if not smaller given the fact that people will have to actually show up in person and vote. And if that is the case, as I assume it will be, the percentage breakdown will be very similar to the first vote. In the end no real change.

Any LHD language means a No Vote from me.
 
By the way .357, if this passes those people with big mortgages and big trucks will eventually lose them anyway because of their work going to the newly created LHD class of drivers.
 
It's all going to be OK. This is all going to come back to bite UPS where it hurts.

It is hard enough now to find drivers to work here because of the way they are treated.

Could you imagine drivers taking this for 42 cents a mile and $15.00 an hour.

Come to think of it we might get a lot more work because of the fast turn over...
 
Can anybody tell me is the IBT planning to release the entire proposal to us in advance? Or are they going to not even let us see the entire proposal, and just read it to us? Everything is hush hush.
 
I would hope that Sunshine Laws would apply? Giving me anything short of the full word-for-word contract will result in a No Vote from me!
 
.357 said:
Can anybody tell me is the IBT planning to release the entire proposal to us in advance? Or are they going to not even let us see the entire proposal, and just read it to us? Everything is hush hush.
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Was told by TDU that they would post a link to the new contract as soon as they get hold of it. That may be some time on or after Jan. 6th. You are correct everything is hush hush because the reality is the union/company don't want us to have a chance to read it or think about it. They just want an automatic yes vote.

Heard from my b.a. that the LHD language will still be in it so that is a guaranteed
:452: Vote from me...hope this info helps
 
Xperado said:
Was told by TDU that they would post a link to the new contract as soon as they get hold of it. That may be some time on or after Jan. 6th. You are correct everything is hush hush because the reality is the union/company don't want us to have a chance to read it or think about it. They just want an automatic yes vote.

Heard from my b.a. that the LHD language will still be in it so that is a guaranteed
:452: Vote from me...hope this info helps
Click to expand...

I appreciate the information. Hopefully we do get the tentative agreement on the 6th. I'll be voting no regardless of what's in it.
 
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