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ABF | How will the pension be affected if YRC contributes more

Homesick said:
A couple of quick points, (1) the wall street journal is just a newspaper and doesn't speak for most businesses. They sort of (in a slanted, entertaining and biased way) report the unusual and out of the ordinary items. (2) Free markets and lazzeiz-faire capitalism never existed. Government has regulations regarding business for thousands (worldwide) of years. The Boston Tea Party is an example for America but European governments have regulated businesses since before the Roman empire existed.
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Some good points, Brother. The WSJ, in my opinion....has been a cheerleader for many of the trends on their opinion pages. Their factual reporting above and below the fold, are pretty accurate,....as are most respected newspapers.

This does not include the National "Enquirer"......any ...newspaper...with an editorial staff so intrinsically illiterate as to mis-spell their own masthead.....does not qualify as a..."news"...source....(..although I avidly read the Bat-Boy Lives! story!...)

The WSJ,...being a voice for the business community,....will sometimes editorialize a big business "wish list" of sorts,.........where us hoi-polloi in flyover country can sometimes get a hint of how those bankers and CEOs are thinking,...behind closed doors....

A "hint", mind you.......

And,........Of course Free markets and lassiez-faire capitalism doesn't exist..........Never will until they eradicate every lobbyist that ever existed and reduce the amount of legislative power money brings. Since the Citizen's United ruling,....we can forget about that happening anytime soon........

And since Money has now been quantified as the amount of attention legislators will pay to your various wishes,........it has now become.....the "coin of the realm"....literally.......
How much Free Speech can you afford?....and how much can the CEO of your company afford?

Of course,..when workers band together and join their voices and finances in something as ...arcane...as a Union.......to "afford" at least an equal voice with the CEOs,.....then you see the scrambling to defame, diminish, and de-popularize Unions....
This is the real reason Corporations hate Unions,.......They DON'T want workers banding together for an equal voice with CEOs....

So,......The most important job that Government has,.......any Government, nowadays,.....is to protect it's Citizens from rapacious Big Business...........From using Money to bend the laws to benefit corporations at the expense of.......US........

I think we're seeing a trend in Global Business....(no loyalty to any Flag or Country there..)......to reduce freedom around the world until there are only two maxims:.....
1. Freedom to do unfettered Business.....
2. Freedom for workers to...work and consume........or not.

Certainly nothing Lazziez-faire or Free Market about any of that.......
 
Elwood said:
There will be no increase in pension contributions to any existing fund, by YRC.

To believe so, after over Nine years, is rather silly.
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I think you may be right.
YRC sure snookered ol' Jimmy,...or ol' Jimmy snookered the YRC guys,...and the pension funds,......

Someone got snookered,.......and Good Ol' Jimmy still gets his (several) pensions.........
 
Elwood said:
There will be no increase in pension contributions to any existing fund, by YRC.

To believe so, after over Nine years, is rather silly.
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Brother Elwood, hope springs eternal when your options are limited. As with our pensions, we either get YRC to contribute or we have no pension. So here is to hope; but prayer may work better.
 
Homesick said:
Brother Elwood, hope springs eternal when your options are limited. As with our pensions, we either get YRC to contribute or we have no pension. So here is to hope; but prayer may work better.
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Well, hopefully, and prayerfully, the new legislation that is being worked on shall require by law that any company in operation that is a participant in these pension funds must pay full rates, especially any company that has gotten a break for 10 freakin' yrs!
 
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Homesick said:
I'm wondering how pensions like CSPF will be affected if YRC pays 50% to 100% into the pension starting in April 2019? The calculations for shutting CSPF down in 2025 are based on YRC continuing to pay 25% into the fund. YRC is buying so many new white road tractors that I find it extremely hard to believe they are not making a healthy profit (but I have not looked at their financial statements in 3 or 4 years).
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3500 tractors yrc are leased to own
 
Green$dawg said:
This means just pay it forward When the time comes to collect your money the members working will pay your pension The government took over central states when consent
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The Exact definition of a Ponzi scheme. Our government sponsored and allowed this ( where if anyone else came up with the same retirement plan the government would throw them in prison).Therefore I think the government should bail it out and make it whole.

It may not be fair to the taxpayers but it’s even more unfair to the people that are dependent on their pensions they were promised.

If YRCW contributed fully it would just kick the can down the road a few more years and does nothing for the next generation.If the government doesn’t approve the long term loan to the pension fund this November the fund is doomed without drastic cuts.

It’s especially unfair to ABF employees whose company has always paid in full contributions.All of your 25 and 30 year men and women would be millionaires if that money would have been put in account with your name on it, simply invested in mutual funds.
 
falconfan said:
The Exact definition of a Ponzi scheme. Our government sponsored and allowed this ( where if anyone else came up with the same retirement plan the government would throw them in prison).Therefore I think the government should bail it out and make it whole.

It may not be fair to the taxpayers but it’s even more unfair to the people that are dependent on their pensions they were promised.

If YRCW contributed fully it would just kick the can down the road a few more years and does nothing for the next generation.If the government doesn’t approve the long term loan to the pension fund this November the fund is doomed without drastic cuts.

It’s especially unfair to ABF employees whose company has always paid in full contributions.All of your 25 and 30 year men and women would be millionaires if that money would have been put in account with your name on it, simply invested in mutual funds.
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Well,....It was maneuvered into being a Ponzi scheme......These types of pensions were sustainable,.........(..and are , in other industries...).....as long as a normal flow of young new-hires and elderly retirees was maintained.

De-regulation in 1980 changed that. Companies were more than happy to hire the increasingly older employees from failed companies because that were far cheaper than training a new-hire. Eventually,...that mass of....increasingly older truck drivers jumping from job to job.......with their MEPF following them,.......reached critical mass,....and instead of jumping to a new job when the old one closed,....they are now retiring en masse.

Last contract talks in 2008, ABF admitted that 75% of their employees were within 5 years of retirement....That condition exists all throughout trucking,..Union or non-Union.....Why bother to set up an apprentice training program, when your next group of..."new-hires"....are coming from a recently shuttered trucking company? Who cares if they're older than a traditional new-hire? They're already trained and ready to hit the street. Saves a lot of money on training costs..........

NO trucking company CEO bothered to look at the ....burden they would put on the MEPFs,...if they held potential retirees until they became a...tidal wave of retirements.

Besides,....the more funds that fail,...the more elderly drivers must remain employed. We do have a driver shortage.........

Our fund here in W. Pa. was doing fine up until about 2006........then,...the increasing retirement figures started to put a crunch on the numbers,.......(coupled with no new-hire contributions to replace the retiree,........due to NO successful organizing..)......
The collapse of 2008 put a real bind on our Fund, as it did with many others..........
BUT!....We had weathered the "de-regulation" storm, and...if there had been no financial collapse in 2008,.......our Fund, and many others, including the CSPF,.....would've survived without any sort of pension cuts.

YRC's partial contributions to the funds were a kick in the groin........Didn't Mr. Hoffa see that?........UPS's buyout of CSPF was a second kick in the groin.....Once again, didn't Mr. Hoffa see that?
The heavily Republican lobbied for 2014 Omnibus Spending Bill, that allowed, for the first time since ERISA in 1974,.....pension funds to reduce benefits to retirees,..........that Mr. Obama signed into law, because he had to prevent a threatened government shutdown,......was the third kick to the groin,.......We're running out of testicles here, guys!

Not sure, though,....if the 25/30 year people would've been millionaires, though.....I started contributing to ABF's 401(k) as soon as it came available,.......there were about 3 or 4 "market adjustments",...where I lost half the value of what I had in there,.....

I think I ended up just about 10% more than if I had stuffed the money under my mattress......
 
falconfan said:
The Exact definition of a Ponzi scheme. Our government sponsored and allowed this ( where if anyone else came up with the same retirement plan the government would throw them in prison).Therefore I think the government should bail it out and make it whole.

It may not be fair to the taxpayers but it’s even more unfair to the people that are dependent on their pensions they were promised.

If YRCW contributed fully it would just kick the can down the road a few more years and does nothing for the next generation.If the government doesn’t approve the long term loan to the pension fund this November the fund is doomed without drastic cuts.

It’s especially unfair to ABF employees whose company has always paid in full contributions.All of your 25 and 30 year men and women would be millionaires if that money would have been put in account with your name on it, simply invested in mutual funds.
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Teamsters as tax paying citizens bailed out the Banking industry and the Auto industry which trickles down to every other work force in America that has any subsidiaries that are part of either of those two. We are not asking for a handout, we are asking for an equal break. I get tired of people saying they don't owe truckers anything. I told my buddy I did not want to pay hundreds of billions of dollars to bail out the auto industry so his wife could keep her job, but I had too.
 
canaryinthemine said:
Not sure, though,....if the 25/30 year people would've been millionaires, though.....I started contributing to ABF's 401(k) as soon as it came
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I agree with most of what you are saying but even after 2008 everyone has gotten their losses back and then some.Its just the pension fund had to continue making payments while our funds just sat until the market rebounded.

Think about this....With the money the company contributes to our fund weekly they could offer a 40% match up to $50,000.00 dollars per year or
a 29% match of up to $70,000.00 per year.

People would be lining up for miles for that job..If we were to get the money the company contributes on our behalf in our pockets no one would be talking about non union pay.

Imagine a company offering a 40% match up to the first $50,000.00 of your pay and it’s exactly what the company pays on our behalf.The non unions are burdened with a 4 1/2% to 6% match and yet people still try to compare it to us.

The math is simple to figure if anyone doubts.
 
Volnuck1 said:
Teamsters as tax paying citizens bailed out the Banking industry and the Auto industry which trickles down to every other work force in America that has any subsidiaries that are part of either of those two. We are not asking for a handout, we are asking for an equal break. I get tired of people saying they don't owe truckers anything. I told my buddy I did not want to pay hundreds of billions of dollars to bail out the auto industry so his wife could keep her job, but I had too.
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If the truth be known, Vol, just the billions in aid of all types this country gives out in probably 1 month to countries around the world, many of whom don’t even like us,it would fund CSPF for a long time....And then some.
 
TurnCoat said:
Well, hopefully, and prayerfully, the new legislation that is being worked on shall require by law that any company in operation that is a participant in these pension funds must pay full rates, especially any company that has gotten a break for 10 freakin' yrs!
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I would rather get wages back to where they should be and take care of my own retirement! But that's just me I know everyone is different! I just hate the idea of taking a big chunk of our raise in the new contract and sticking it into a pension that still might be broke in ten or fifteen years!
 
the5tolls said:
I would rather get wages back to where they should be and take care of my own retirement! But that's just me I know everyone is different! I just hate the idea of taking a big chunk of our raise in the new contract and sticking it into a pension that still might be broke in ten or fifteen years!
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We should have taken a bigger wage cut not give up the pension! The real question is why was UPS most profitable Teamster company allowed to leave the fund and where did the money go it used for the buyout $6 Billion poof it's gone on bogus junk investments I really think it went into the someones pockets? Since we were under government consent decree they should be responsible for what happened to the fund! Look at YRC's numbers the pay and pension is not coming back you are all delusional we calculated it lets see 15,000 Union employees times full weekly pension rate 350 x 52 = 18,200 x 15,000 = $274 Million thats just the pension not including 15% YRC lost too much revenue went from being almost a $10 Billion revenue company to $5 Billion they lost half of their freight.
 
Jaloc said:
We should have taken a bigger wage cut not give up the pension! The real question is why was UPS most profitable Teamster company allowed to leave the fund and where did the money go it used for the buyout $6 Billion poof it's gone on bogus junk investments I really think it went into the someones pockets? Since we were under government consent decree they should be responsible for what happened to the fund! Look at YRC's numbers the pay and pension is not coming back you are all delusional we calculated it lets see 15,000 Union employees times full weekly pension rate 350 x 52 = 18,200 x 15,000 = $274 Million thats just the pension not including 15% YRC lost too much revenue went from being almost a $10 Billion revenue company to $5 Billion they lost half of their freight.
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Zollars took YRCW down to half its size, all by himself....
 
falconfan said:
I agree with most of what you are saying but even after 2008 everyone has gotten their losses back and then some.Its just the pension fund had to continue making payments while our funds just sat until the market rebounded.

Think about this....With the money the company contributes to our fund weekly they could offer a 40% match up to $50,000.00 dollars per year or
a 29% match of up to $70,000.00 per year.

People would be lining up for miles for that job..If we were to get the money the company contributes on our behalf in our pockets no one would be talking about non union pay.

Imagine a company offering a 40% match up to the first $50,000.00 of your pay and it’s exactly what the company pays on our behalf.The non unions are burdened with a 4 1/2% to 6% match and yet people still try to compare it to us.

The math is simple to figure if anyone doubts.
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Speaking for myself, I'm starting on my second million,............... I gave up on the first, long ago.
 
Jaloc said:
We should have taken a bigger wage cut not give up the pension! The real question is why was UPS most profitable Teamster company allowed to leave the fund and where did the money go it used for the buyout $6 Billion poof it's gone on bogus junk investments I really think it went into the someones pockets? Since we were under government consent decree they should be responsible for what happened to the fund! Look at YRC's numbers the pay and pension is not coming back you are all delusional we calculated it lets see 15,000 Union employees times full weekly pension rate 350 x 52 = 18,200 x 15,000 = $274 Million thats just the pension not including 15% YRC lost too much revenue went from being almost a $10 Billion revenue company to $5 Billion they lost half of their freight.
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15% is/was maximum allowable per contract.
 
seabreeze said:
I think you and Wong need to take credit for that, Canary busted 9 companies and I got 1, you guys need to
share some responsibility,
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Hey! That's all mere circumstantial coincidence............I didn't intend on starting a career being the Destroyer of Companies.......

I'm sure my picture.....front and side view,........is on display in every trucking company boardroom, with the caption: " NOT Wanted".
 
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