Joe Scarborough Announces He’s Done With GOP On ‘Late Show’

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Magoo, Jul 12, 2017.

  1. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Not always necessarily true..... But I'll "play along"..... I'd venture to say the reason being is the available help from Social safety net programs......like the ones that " conservatives" want to eliminate....

    We are decaying from within, and I'm glad you recognize that fact, not from covering the needs of the average American people.....but because we are covering the wants of the already wealthy people and Corporations...more tax breaks for them...loopholes so they can get away with not paying anything in some cases...... That's more costly to society than a relative few that waste their money on $200 shoes instead of something more practical.... There will always be some abuse in any system....but eliminating it for everyone for the misdeeds of a few isn't logical...

    Yes....just like I outlined above as an example....

    I'm sure that's right in some cases.....just likes its just as probable that in some cases, people must choose between proper nutrition, or having enough to eat, or paying for Health Insurance......

    We both knew better than that...... ( I know you just being sarcastic)....

    I said, it shouldn't control it....and yes its possible....but that prospect should be addressed in the form of laws against Government bureaucrats being involved in deciding a persons medical needs.....
    Speaking of writing the check.....currently you have insurance companies writing the checks and they have say in what type of treatments they cover and how much (or how little) they will pay..... Some Insurance Company Bureaucrat shouldn't be involved in a persons medical care either..... I understand and share your concerns about that.... Which is why that concern needs to be addressed in any proposed change in the way healthcare is delivered..
     
  2. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    No....never said that.....just that they should be the single source of payment for medical care for everyone....through our collective taxes.....

    As far as Government doing things good.... Yes they can do some things very good.... How about the Police and Fire departments....most are very good....how about infrastructure such as the air traffic control the highway system... .... The postal service..... Social Security..... Lots of things the Government does, it does fine ..... Sure, there needs to be things adjusted to keep them running ....but that is a different topic..
     
  3. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    But health care is on the "chain"....

    But it is still essential......
     
  4. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    You have Insurance because you can afford it or it's provided by an employer, or whatever, but you have it because you recognize that healthcare is essential........something you don't want to risk being without...

    Health Insurance based on everyone paying according to their risk isn't how group insurance works.... Insurance works by spreading the risk out over a large number of people....while still being able to generate profits.......
    If you only have people paying based on everyone's individual circumstances or conditions, that would make insurance unaffordable for most people... That is NOT how Insurance works....
     
  5. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Actually, yes you should pay the same....(under the current system) Again, that's how Insurance is supposed to be.... That is how the risk is spread out....and why its less costly overall...... Charging you a lesser rate will raise the rate for others, likely to the point of being totally unaffordable to many others...

    The issue you raise would easily become a non-issue with a single payer system....
     
  6. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Yes providing a defense is in the Constitution....but that is quite different than the trillions needed for invading other Countries.... Regime changes.....rebuilding what we paid to destroy.... Bases all over the World as we act as a Global " police force"...
    Show me how that is "constitutional"....
    We were even warned by a Republican President about the dangers of a powerful military/industrial complex....

    Are the formation of Multi-National Corporations listed in the Constitution?.... Point being, a lot of things aren't in the Constitution.... But that doesn't mean that they are all " bad" things either.....and providing for healthcare for the Nation is not a bad thing ... It makes zero sense to deny health coverage on the excuse it wasn't put in the original Constitution....

    Here's another point to consider.... Can you think of any Country that has a Universal single payer system than has repealed it, or has tried to repeal it?....
     
  7. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Wars on anything don't work...... The reason we still have poverty is more due to the corruption and greed of Capitalism..... We need to address that cause and fix that...

    Just like the "war on drugs" doesn't work we don't address the cause of the problem..... Same with the "war on terrorism".... We don't address the root causes ..... Wars don't work...
     
  8. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    If so, its been reduced to that because of politicians, Democrats and Republicans, raiding the funds........
    If it was voluntary, I'd say that most people would overwhelmingly pay into the system based on how well its worked and is still working.... The vast majority of people love their Social Security....and so will you...... I think it's safe to say you will be collecting yours when the time comes....
     
  9. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Once again, universal single payer would eliminate the concerns you mention if done correctly..... Yes sick people cost..... If insurance companies spread their cost risk over a large number people, policy holders, then it only makes sense that spreading the cost risk over the total population and taking the for profit insurance companies out of the picture makes even more sense......

    Just keep in mind, while you may be young and healthy now, that doesn't mean it will always be that way .......
     
  10. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Hopefully they won't be coming back.....but those conditions do still exist in other Countries where American Corporations set up shop.......another, perhaps unintended, consequence of capitalism....
     
  11. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Well, there ya go..... The owned Politicians don't really want to fix the issues.....just give the illusion they want to....but shift the blame back and forth..... Such is the magic of the color coded political system.....
     
  12. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Yes that's true.....and if we continue on our present course, we'll be sharing "communal" toilets here as well...... We need to stop playing politics, and just do the right thing for the everyday people in the USA.... I think we all want the same basic things....but have a different view of how to achieve them .....
     
  13. Northern Flash

    Northern Flash Piss on our Flag, get a boycott against you.

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    The people in poverty here are living large compared the those in poverty in other countries. One difference here is that many of ours in poverty could actually work because their health is good enough and jobs are available, but they've chosen not to work.
     
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  14. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    That might be true for many, but again, you can't justify a low wage for workers here just because it's worse in some other Country..... Furthermore, if it wasn't for the social safety net programs we have, it would look a lot more like those other Countries here....which is apparently what "conservatives" want.....

    There are some that choose not to work, your right.....but that isn't true of most.... More people are working than not.... The sad reality is that many jobs today pay similar wages to what was paid in the early 80's.....while prices have risen well above those levels.... So its not just a simple matter of getting a job.... We have a huge class of workers called the "working poor" because wages have not kept up with the cost of living...

    The aphorism "The rich get richer, and the poor get poorer" is just as true today as it was in 1840...... In fact, its gotten to the point that, according the 2017 Oxfam report, (an international confederation of charitable organizations that focuses on the alleviation of global poverty), states that just "eight people own as much combined wealth as half the human race"...... Talk about insustainability......!!..
    But " Conservatives" love it!
     
  15. Northern Flash

    Northern Flash Piss on our Flag, get a boycott against you.

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    Great point.
    Why is it that the left thinks everyone should pay the same amount for their healthcare? If they drive a $500 dollar clunker and I drive a $60,000.00 truck, based on their mentality, shouldn't they be helping me pay for my $60,000.00 truck insurance also?

    It's called risk. The higher the risk of high insurance costs, the more you should have to pay.
     
  16. Bubba74

    Bubba74 Well-Known Member

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    also attack the greed of the "weathy" never mentioning the greed of the "poor"
    as for the shoe thing, its a lot more than you think
     
  17. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Health care and Health Insurance aren't the same thing..... The cost of health care is a very individual thing...... The cost of Health Insurance is spread out over a large pool of policy holders to make it more "affordable" for all the policy holders.... Generally, unless you're in a group such as employer provided insurance, as a person ages their Insurance goes up...because their care costs more.... So no, not every one pays the same......

    Yes....just as I explained to you above.... Older people pay higher Premiums.....and once again, the risk, or costs of insuring peoples health is less the bigger the pool of people.....so spreading the risk over the population in it's entirety, as Universal single payer would do, would make it more affordable for everyone....

    Insuring your vehicle is different than insuring your health...always has been.... Your example is like comparing apples to oranges....
     
  18. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Also defend the wealthy who have more wealth than they could ever spend in their lifetime.....and yet still want more........and always attack the poor because some of them bought a nice pair of shoes..... With all due respect, that sounds small and petty..... Besides, how do you that person you saw with expensive shoes didn't buy them with their own money from a job?..... Not all poor people don't have jobs....... ...
    The greed of the poor pales in comparison to the greed of the wealthy and Corporations...
    What power do the poor have compared to the power and influence of the wealthy?.... Who is "purchasing" politician's so they will "vote" the "right" way?.... The poor??? Not hardly, so spare me the defense of the wealthy saying that only the greed of the poor, because you saw a "poor" person with expensive shoes, is what's at the root of what is wrong with this Country.....
     
  19. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    Oh yes, I'm sure that every "poor" person buys $200 shoes and that's bringing this nation to ruin.....those darn greedy poor people.....

    Let's see......just a few hundred people owning and controlling more wealth than half of the Worlds population couldn't possibly be considered greedy.....or couldn't possibly be a much much larger problem and contributing factor in the Worlds issues.......

    The "shoe thing"??... Seriously?...
     
  20. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    One other point you obviously overlooked.... You don't know if that person, or persons, you see wearing expensive shoes didn't get them for a small price at a thrift store, such as Goodwill or the Salvation Army....
     

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