ABF | Latest Rumor from 003 KC

[GO40]

What ABF said they would do versus what they would do if the vote goes south is a good question. Surely, it won't be business as usual. I wouldn't rule out a lock out. A no win is strike authorization. The supreme test of gladiators. FedEx pilots struck back in the 80's or so but called it off when Smith shut down some long haul routes and parked aircraft in the desert. The pilots settled for less then what was offered originally.

Or will they follow thru with the threat of closing terminals. That wouldn't hurt senior drivers or dock too much. YRC already stated they are not interested in buying ABF. If they did change their mind about it the can't just walk in and pay the current stock price. Who would accept an offer of just $7.00 a share especially if they paid more. Especially knowing YRC would pay a premium for ABF. How much they are wiling to pay is the question. McReynolds recently bought more ABF stock my inside sources say. She stands to make big money if it does happen. A deal would benefit YRC more then ABF. ABF will still be there but nowhere the size they are now

So be it, lock us out at least we could collect for the summer & im sure we are more than qualified to find the same job if not better then the one we have now....Like I said before whats done is done & the big wigs will get theirs & we will be left looking for a job either way the vote goes....

 

[Roadrunner73]

ABF is going to make some changes either way. They just delayed it so it wouldn't hurt their chances of this pathetic T/A passing. You can say you heard it here first.

When you hear take this or we are gonna do that, take it to the bank, that is gonna happen after you vote yes.

 

[GO40]

When you hear take this or we are gonna do that, take it to the bank, that is gonna happen after you vote yes.

Just like they said about yrc AT THIS TIME we are not interested in the offer....

 

[Black Hawk]

So be it, lock us out at least we could collect for the summer & im sure we are more than qualified to find the same job if not better then the one we have now....Like I said before whats done is done & the big wigs will get theirs & we will be left looking for a job either way the vote goes....

You never know what may happen when you turn down an offer. I doubt Judy thinks it's a good offer because there was no way she ever wanted to put a good offer on the table. This is a good offer as far as she is concerned. Judy is playin to win. She seems the kind of woman who if she was playing third base and her mama was rounding third with the winning run she would trip her up. What woman plays fair? What may happen is since you've rejected her good contract a strike is authorized and that is what you will do. If you chose to picket for the entire summer and work else where is up to you. But as far as the big wigs sweating a strike, that is very unlikely

 

[Homesick]

Yes, as in any company, there are differences in revenue, net income, profit and EBITDA. The point is to compare the like with each company. Papajohn, go through the income statement of any of our competitors and compare any one of these financial measurements to ABF and you will clearly see there is a big hole in the boat at ABF when compared to our non-union competition. And since they are our "competition," it absolutely matters if you want to have a job in the long run.

Nothumbleenough, we disagree on most things but I enjoy reading your postings. I would like to ask you how this T/A fixes the “hole in the boat?” I see it as kicking the can down the road at the expense of the employee’s. And I don’t want my standard of living, the stand or living of my family, and the stress of having to do this every five years to continue. Lets fix it now or go home!!!!

 

[Homesick]

ABF is going to make some changes either way. They just delayed it so it wouldn't hurt their chances of this pathetic T/A passing. You can say you heard it here first.

Sorry ABFer but I can’t say I “heard it here first.” I listened to the ABFS 4th quarter conference call and heard Judy say it then. I believe it was back in February. Anyway, if you want to hear it for yourselves Google ABFS conference calls or go to Seeking Alpha and find the printed copy.

 

[nothumbleenough]

Nothumbleenough, we disagree on most things but I enjoy reading your postings. I would like to ask you how this T/A fixes the “hole in the boat?” I see it as kicking the can down the road at the expense of the employee’s. And I don’t want my standard of living, the stand or living of my family, and the stress of having to do this every five years to continue. Lets fix it now or go home!!!!

Fixing the hole in the boat:

Looking at ODFL NET INCOME in 2011 139 million, EBITDA in 2011 325 million.
ABFS NET INCOME IN 2011 6 million, EBITDA in 2011 82 million.
Difference of- 133 million, 243 million.

ODFL NET INCOME IN 2012 169 million, EBITDA in 2012 396 million.
ABFS NET INCOME IN 2012 -8 million, EBITDA in 2012 71 million.
Difference of- 177 million, 325 million.

Fixing the hole doesn't mean we equal the profitability of ODFL but the emerging trends must stop or there will be no place ABFS in the ltl marketplace. The concession brings ABF an additional 30-40 million the first year and decreases from there going forward. ABF also believes congress will pass some sort of pension relief that will allow them to keep roughly 60 million of the 120 million paid into teamster pensions. This brings all total an extra 100 million to the table and greatly reduces the margins above but by no means surpass the profit of ODFL.

BTW, I believe if congress doesn't reform our pensions, ABF will be back for additional concessions before the end of the next contract!

 

[Deleted member 5115]

Sorry ABFer but I can’t say I “heard it here first.” I listened to the ABFS 4th quarter conference call and heard Judy say it then. I believe it was back in February. Anyway, if you want to hear it for yourselves Google ABFS conference calls or go to Seeking Alpha and find the printed copy.

I'll snoop around when I get a chance but I recall hearing that there would be major changes if they did not get the contract of their choosing, not even after it passed.

 

[Homesick]

Fixing the hole in the boat:

Looking at ODFL NET INCOME in 2011 139 million, EBITDA in 2011 325 million.
ABFS NET INCOME IN 2011 6 million, EBITDA in 2011 82 million.
Difference of- 133 million, 243 million.

ODFL NET INCOME IN 2012 169 million, EBITDA in 2012 396 million.
ABFS NET INCOME IN 2012 -8 million, EBITDA in 2012 71 million.
Difference of- 177 million, 325 million.

Fixing the hole doesn't mean we equal the profitability of ODFL but the emerging trends must stop or there will be no place ABFS in the ltl marketplace. The concession brings ABF an additional 30-40 million the first year and decreases from there going forward. ABF also believes congress will pass some sort of pension relief that will allow them to keep roughly 60 million of the 120 million paid into teamster pensions. This brings all total an extra 100 million to the table and greatly reduces the margins above but by no means surpass the profit of ODFL.

BTW, I believe if congress doesn't reform our pensions, ABF will be back for additional concessions before the end of the next contract!

I agree and the last sentence is my point. I don’t believe congress is going to pass any pension legislation. ABFS is relying on the government for a bailout in the form of pension relief. If they don’t get it, then ABF will be back for more concessions. That is exactly why I voted NO, why I will not change my vote, and why I believe you and every other ABF employee should vote NO. Fix it now, in this contract, or let’s go home!!!!!

We don’t have to beat or match O.D. there are a lot more players on the field. There is a lot of room in the LTL market and ABF has a good nitch.

So, in your opinion, if the hole that is the multi employer pension where fixed would ABF still need us to take these concessions?

 

[papajohn]

You never know what may happen when you turn down an offer. I doubt Judy thinks it's a good offer because there was no way she ever wanted to put a good offer on the table. This is a good offer as far as she is concerned. Judy is playin to win. She seems the kind of woman who if she was playing third base and her mama was rounding third with the winning run she would trip her up. What woman plays fair? What may happen is since you've rejected her good contract a strike is authorized and that is what you will do. If you chose to picket for the entire summer and work else where is up to you. But as far as the big wigs sweating a strike, that is very unlikely

Do you work for ABF? If so what do you do?

 

[papajohn]

Fixing the hole in the boat:

Looking at ODFL NET INCOME in 2011 139 million, EBITDA in 2011 325 million.
ABFS NET INCOME IN 2011 6 million, EBITDA in 2011 82 million.
Difference of- 133 million, 243 million.

ODFL NET INCOME IN 2012 169 million, EBITDA in 2012 396 million.
ABFS NET INCOME IN 2012 -8 million, EBITDA in 2012 71 million.
Difference of- 177 million, 325 million.

Fixing the hole doesn't mean we equal the profitability of ODFL but the emerging trends must stop or there will be no place ABFS in the ltl marketplace. The concession brings ABF an additional 30-40 million the first year and decreases from there going forward. ABF also believes congress will pass some sort of pension relief that will allow them to keep roughly 60 million of the 120 million paid into teamster pensions. This brings all total an extra 100 million to the table and greatly reduces the margins above but by no means surpass the profit of ODFL.

BTW, I believe if congress doesn't reform our pensions, ABF will be back for additional concessions before the end of the next contract!

You still haven't explain to us about these SEC filings for "confidentiality agreements" that hide certain accounts from the public's eye. You really haven't explained anything. You have a 1 track mind and that is to just give the company concessions, which not very many believe it needed. What position do you hold in management.

 

[Homesick]

You never know what may happen when you turn down an offer. I doubt Judy thinks it's a good offer because there was no way she ever wanted to put a good offer on the table. This is a good offer as far as she is concerned. Judy is playin to win. She seems the kind of woman who if she was playing third base and her mama was rounding third with the winning run she would trip her up. What woman plays fair? What may happen is since you've rejected her good contract a strike is authorized and that is what you will do. If you chose to picket for the entire summer and work else where is up to you. But as far as the big wigs sweating a strike, that is very unlikely

How do you know Judy so well? And you are wrong about big wigs sweating a strike. There are a lot more employee jobs than C-level jobs. And a lot of C-level pay is in bonuses. How many bonuses do you get if we go on strike?

 

[Homesick]

Fixing the hole in the boat:

Looking at ODFL NET INCOME in 2011 139 million, EBITDA in 2011 325 million.
ABFS NET INCOME IN 2011 6 million, EBITDA in 2011 82 million.
Difference of- 133 million, 243 million.

ODFL NET INCOME IN 2012 169 million, EBITDA in 2012 396 million.
ABFS NET INCOME IN 2012 -8 million, EBITDA in 2012 71 million.
Difference of- 177 million, 325 million.

Fixing the hole doesn't mean we equal the profitability of ODFL but the emerging trends must stop or there will be no place ABFS in the ltl marketplace. The concession brings ABF an additional 30-40 million the first year and decreases from there going forward. ABF also believes congress will pass some sort of pension relief that will allow them to keep roughly 60 million of the 120 million paid into teamster pensions. This brings all total an extra 100 million to the table and greatly reduces the margins above but by no means surpass the profit of ODFL.

BTW, I believe if congress doesn't reform our pensions, ABF will be back for additional concessions before the end of the next contract!

A mathematical question for you:

ODFL earnings divided by EBITDA
2011: 139/325=42.7%
2012: 169/396=42.6%

ABFS earnings divided by EBITDA
2011: 6/82=7.3%
2012: -8/71=-11.2%

What happened to ABFS? Revenue went up but EBITDA went down? Revenue went up at ODFL but the percentage of income to EBITDA stayed the same so. What happened at ABFS???????

 

[nothumbleenough]

.

So, in your opinion, if the hole that is the multi employer pension where fixed would ABF still need us to take these concessions?

No need for concessions if the pension liability is fixed.

 

[nothumbleenough]

A mathematical question for you:

ODFL earnings divided by EBITDA
2011: 139/325=42.7%
2012: 169/396=42.6%

ABFS earnings divided by EBITDA
2011: 6/82=7.3%
2012: -8/71=-11.2%

What happened to ABFS? Revenue went up but EBITDA went down? Revenue went up at ODFL but the percentage of income to EBITDA stayed the same so. What happened at ABFS???????

Expenses went up as did the revenues. Didn't the Panther purchase show on the books for 2012? Mystery solved!

 

[nothumbleenough]

You still haven't explain to us about these SEC filings for "confidentiality agreements" that hide certain accounts from the public's eye. You really haven't explained anything. You have a 1 track mind and that is to just give the company concessions, which not very many believe it needed. What position do you hold in management.

Executive Vice President in charge of Popcorn Sales. Could I interest you in a trade? Maybe cheese popcorn for a yes vote? Do you prefer butter popcorn? Okay, you drive a hard deal, I am willing to trade one of my very rare cinnamon, cheese and butter mixed decorated cans.

 

[nothumbleenough]

I agree and the last sentence is my point. I don’t believe congress is going to pass any pension legislation. ABFS is relying on the government for a bailout in the form of pension relief. If they don’t get it, then ABF will be back for more concessions. That is exactly why I voted NO, why I will not change my vote, and why I believe you and every other ABF employee should vote NO. Fix it now, in this contract, or let’s go home!!!!!

We don’t have to beat or match O.D. there are a lot more players on the field. There is a lot of room in the LTL market and ABF has a good nitch.

So, in your opinion, if the hole that is the multi employer pension where fixed would ABF still need us to take these concessions?

I agree about fixing the pension but that will take an act of congress and right now neither party would **** on the other even if their hair was on fire so cooperation is not likely. The only other solution is for PBGC to deem the Central States Pension insolvent. At 52% funded we really are not to far off from that point.

 

[Black Hawk]

I agree about fixing the pension but that will take an act of congress and right now neither party would **** on the other even if their hair was on fire so cooperation is not likely. The only other solution is for PBGC to deem the Central States Pension insolvent. At 52% funded we really are not to far off from that point.

Pension help from the government is unlikely other then extended time to recoup pension losses which was already granted. The fact that teamster pensions have no cost to taxpayers if it becomes insolvent leaves any help from the government out of the picture other then the rules about funding it properly etc. I think what is very unlikely is those who have earned a pension (orphans) will forfeit their pension so others may keep theirs. To suggest blowing off orphans or retirees to benefit ABF is not going to happen.

What is extremely unlikely is that for the PBGC to declare the Central States Pension Fund insolvent is a solution. If that happens it would be a failure. An irreversible disaster. Retirees would take a 50% cut but future retirees would get air, nada, work till you die. The CSPF trustees will make the decision if and when the fund is insolvent. That day is when they announce they don't have enough money to pay all retirees for the entire year. ABF is proposing to not pay any increases in pension contributions for next 5 years in this contract. It is likely pension contributions will be more negotiable in any future contracts

 

[papajohn]

I agree about fixing the pension but that will take an act of congress and right now neither party would **** on the other even if their hair was on fire so cooperation is not likely. The only other solution is for PBGC to deem the Central States Pension insolvent. At 52% funded we really are not to far off from that point.

You sure are willing to give up everything. Is there anything you would fight for that is not for the company?. And as usual you refuse to answer questions. Just what I would expect from management......

 

[papajohn]

You still haven't explain to us about these SEC filings for "confidentiality agreements" that hide certain accounts from the public's eye. You really haven't explained anything. You have a 1 track mind and that is to just give the company concessions, which not very many believe it needed. What position do you hold in management.

Executive Vice President in charge of Popcorn Sales. Could I interest you in a trade? Maybe cheese popcorn for a yes vote? Do you prefer butter popcorn? Okay, you drive a hard deal, I am willing to trade one of my very rare cinnamon, cheese and butter mixed decorated cans.

Explain to us about these SEC filings for "confidentiality agreements" that hide certain accounts from the public's eye.