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ABF | Start the Picketline

Songremainsthesame said:
I agree, but it happens all the time. It happens in nonunion companies too, not going to deny that, but the “protections” a union contract with no production expectations or machinery for discipline for dereliction of duty fosters this type of behavior. Human nature, it sucks, but not all of us are as ethical as we should be.
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Of course there is production expectations in Union companies, Brother. That would be the workforce itself. You are presuming Union workers are attracted to Union jobs merely to...”skate”...as you put it.
Union workers are looking for the highest pay, best pension and healthcare,......because they regard themselves as top shelf workers.
Non-Union companies seem to have no qualms whatsoever about hiring Union guys who have lost their jobs. It would seem they recognize the work ethic is just as high,.....if not higher,.....than any other truck driver asking to be hired......In fact, it seems that non-Union companies kind of like to “crow” about getting a ....Union guy...

The ..........” myth”.......that all Union guys are “ lazy”....is blatant, out-and-out propaganda on the face of it...........designed to make the non-Union guys feel better about losing their First Amendment rights when they punch the time clock.

Oh.........you say you didn’t lose your rights?
Go tell your TM that you think Unions are a good idea. The right to organize is protected by Labor law stemming from decisions based on Supreme Court rulings argued from the First Amendment......
I’ll bet that , once you’ve stated that Unions are a good idea........you’ll get an economic “answer” that will be.....ethically unfair........based on your performance as a good employee.

Is that fair? Your........opinion.......should have nothing to do with your standing as an excellent employee, right?
But,........it would seem that merely speaking an opinion would negate your hard work,.......and make your employer regard you differently.

There is no employee,......Union or non-Union,......who goes to work thinking: “ How can I do as little as possible today?”.........Human pride in oneself is the overriding factor.........
 
Songremainsthesame said:
I agree, but it happens all the time. It happens in nonunion companies too, not going to deny that, but the “protections” a union contract with no production expectations or machinery for discipline for dereliction of duty fosters this type of behavior. Human nature, it sucks, but not all of us are as ethical as we should be.
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Many are familiar with UPS Package. The outlier. Union but profitable. Teamsters but with rules that keep you working...and working...and working.

Yes , they are not LTL but they are an example of a counterpoint to your argument Song. I can say this having worked there ( happily but hard ) years ago.

As a P&D driver for a non-union company , I long for the discipline an order that I had at UPS. Also the fair policing of coworkers ( at my location anyway ) I've made the argument before , that non-union companies protect and harbor more lazy , good-for-nothing , sorry ass wastes of time people than ANY union place I've EVER worked. I've been a Teamster , in an automotive manufacturing union , city union , and state government law enforcement union.
 
Songremainsthesame said:
Anyone can keep their :::shit::: together for 30 days, then it becomes MUCH harder to weed out the bad apples...
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Who said anything about 30 days? It’s up to the Tm to decide if & when you start your 30 days. I went almost 7 months until I made the list, now at days he could even wave that period it depends how desperate they are....
 
canaryinthemine said:
Of course there is production expectations in Union companies, Brother. That would be the workforce itself. You are presuming Union workers are attracted to Union jobs merely to...”skate”...as you put it.
Union workers are looking for the highest pay, best pension and healthcare,......because they regard themselves as top shelf workers.
Non-Union companies seem to have no qualms whatsoever about hiring Union guys who have lost their jobs. It would seem they recognize the work ethic is just as high,.....if not higher,.....than any other truck driver asking to be hired......In fact, it seems that non-Union companies kind of like to “crow” about getting a ....Union guy...

The ..........” myth”.......that all Union guys are “ lazy”....is blatant, out-and-out propaganda on the face of it...........designed to make the non-Union guys feel better about losing their First Amendment rights when they punch the time clock.

Oh.........you say you didn’t lose your rights?
Go tell your TM that you think Unions are a good idea. The right to organize is protected by Labor law stemming from decisions based on Supreme Court rulings argued from the First Amendment......
I’ll bet that , once you’ve stated that Unions are a good idea........you’ll get an economic “answer” that will be.....ethically unfair........based on your performance as a good employee.

Is that fair? Your........opinion.......should have nothing to do with your standing as an excellent employee, right?
But,........it would seem that merely speaking an opinion would negate your hard work,.......and make your employer regard you differently.

There is no employee,......Union or non-Union,......who goes to work thinking: “ How can I do as little as possible today?”.........Human pride in oneself is the overriding factor.........
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I think you're confusing freedom of speech for acceptance of speech. The First Amendment ensures your freedom to express yourself and the government can do nothing to stop you from doing so. But that doesn't guarantee the expression of your opinions will be accepted and embraced. Sure, I could go in and express a view to my terminal manager that is pro-union; but to what end? Why would I do that? I know what his views on unionism are, and they probably don't differ all that much from your former manager's views. I'm not going to change his mind. If I were to express a positive union sentiment it would be more useful and effective to do so with my coworkers. They would be the ones signing a card or ratifying a contract, not the manager. My views, positive or negative have no bearing on my work ethic or job performance.

Nor do I believe all workers that choose to work in a unionized environment are lazy or wish to skate. I've met and am friends with several men that work for union freight lines, they work hard and are good guys, ethical folks that I am proud to call friends. But to say that the rank and file police themselves as far as production is ludicrous. The oath clearly states that 'I will not knowingly harm another member'. What action can you take against a fellow brother and not harm him? Have a talk with him? Like as not he will tell you to mind your own business and go on about his, or lack of business, as the case may be. Sure, human pride is tied into work ethic, but human nature is sometimes stronger. And human nature is flawed. When you see the same truck parked under a tree with a napping driver an hour after you drove by it the first time, and it carries the flag of a company under a Teamster contract, well the proof speaks for itself. Unless there are stipulations in place to punish said driver for his actions, if he is so inclined to continue to behave in this manner, well, nothing can be done. It happens in non-union outfits, I won't argue that. And most times the driver in question gets away with it there too. I can't explain why.
 
icuicp said:
Many are familiar with UPS Package. The outlier. Union but profitable. Teamsters but with rules that keep you working...and working...and working.

Yes , they are not LTL but they are an example of a counterpoint to your argument Song. I can say this having worked there ( happily but hard ) years ago.

As a P&D driver for a non-union company , I long for the discipline an order that I had at UPS. Also the fair policing of coworkers ( at my location anyway ) I've made the argument before , that non-union companies protect and harbor more lazy , good-for-nothing , sorry ass wastes of time people than ANY union place I've EVER worked. I've been a Teamster , in an automotive manufacturing union , city union , and state government law enforcement union.
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Yes, I agree, there is a lot of protection for lazy, good-for-nothing guys in non-union companies. I worked at Con-way as you do (or did before XPO came along) and there were several drivers that seemed to get away with murder. The funny thing was that none of them were suck asses or management favorites. They were generally disliked by management, and by those of us who had to carry more weight because of their laziness. But they were still allowed to skate. I didn't get it then, and I don't get it now. But yes, UPS is the exception that doesn't prove the rule. The company is allowed to discipline employees and expect quite a lot out of their employees. Those guys need union representation for sure. But there is a reason to their profitability. There is little competition in the parcel market. FexEx really their only real competitor. I don't know how well FedEx competes as to service, but their ground service seems to be slacking as they have further separated themselves from the contractors that do the work. I'm seeing a lot more shoddy equipment in parcel cars as well as tractors in their linehaul operation. UPS is worldwide too, which further separates themselves from competition. I know FedEx is as well, but I think only on the next-day air market. I'm not sure if they offer ground service worldwide. Deregulation has ruined LTL trucking, at least on the union side. When all the major players were union, everyone got paid the same, and the companies only competed on service. Rates were controlled. Inefficiencies were passed on to customers. Times have changed. Not necessarily for the better, but these are the times we find ourselves in.
 
canaryinthemine said:
Of course there is production expectations in Union companies, Brother. That would be the workforce itself. You are presuming Union workers are attracted to Union jobs merely to...”skate”...as you put it.
Union workers are looking for the highest pay, best pension and healthcare,......because they regard themselves as top shelf workers.
Non-Union companies seem to have no qualms whatsoever about hiring Union guys who have lost their jobs. It would seem they recognize the work ethic is just as high,.....if not higher,.....than any other truck driver asking to be hired......In fact, it seems that non-Union companies kind of like to “crow” about getting a ....Union guy...

The ..........” myth”.......that all Union guys are “ lazy”....is blatant, out-and-out propaganda on the face of it...........designed to make the non-Union guys feel better about losing their First Amendment rights when they punch the time clock.

Oh.........you say you didn’t lose your rights?
Go tell your TM that you think Unions are a good idea. The right to organize is protected by Labor law stemming from decisions based on Supreme Court rulings argued from the First Amendment......
I’ll bet that , once you’ve stated that Unions are a good idea........you’ll get an economic “answer” that will be.....ethically unfair........based on your performance as a good employee.

Is that fair? Your........opinion.......should have nothing to do with your standing as an excellent employee, right?
But,........it would seem that merely speaking an opinion would negate your hard work,.......and make your employer regard you differently.

There is no employee,......Union or non-Union,......who goes to work thinking: “ How can I do as little as possible today?”.........Human pride in oneself is the overriding factor.........
Click to expand...
Nailed it.
Most of the out bound crew I work with work. One exception. Always gonna be one or two. Always.
No matter who I work for I go to work and work. I didn't start working for a union company until I was 30 years old. My work ethic was set.
Long before I went to work at the union company. I worked in the oil field for awhile and we worked as a crew. Fracking wells. When we got set up we all set up and no one sat around. Because we all got done and screwed off together. If you were caught sluffing off you would get doped. Doped meant you were chased down by everyone and a swab that greased the pipe was loaded with grease and stuck down your pants. When your in the middle of no where you don't want to be doped. You'll carry it all day. And maybe night. I was never doped. Lol.
But. We had a good crew. We had fun. Played football and blackjack on our downrime. Slept if need be. The latter being what was done most.
So. Lumping in all union men as being lazy is truly unfair. And definitely not true.
I'm sure the non's have just as many "lazy" people and union barns.
Not trolling. Just commenting. And it's just my opinion and a comment.
 
Songremainsthesame said:
When you see the same truck parked under a tree with a napping driver an hour after you drove by it the first time, and it carries the flag of a company under a Teamster contract, well the proof speaks for itself.
Click to expand...
Unless he was told to wait for instructions, nobody is sleeping without somebody knowing it, everybody has an electronic leash of some kind. For you to assume the Union driver is stealing time is ludicrous and shows your bias.
 
U.S. cities are financially screwed
Raising their borrowing costs and starting trade wars won’t help


Angelo Young
June 16, 2018 3:00pm (UTC)

From a bird’s-eye view, the U.S. economy is looking very expansionary. The jobless rate is at near record lows while gross domestic product is rising. Retail sales are up while a measure of confidence among small business owners just hit a 34-year high.

But as the adage goes, all economics is local. One part of the country can enjoy the fruits of national economic growth, while another languishes in opioid addiction, poverty and falling wages.
 
ABF should have followed JCP.
JCPenney is selling its three private jets to cut costs after its CEO flees .
 
joes bar and grill said:
Unless he was told to wait for instructions, nobody is sleeping without somebody knowing it, everybody has an electronic leash of some kind. For you to assume the Union driver is stealing time is ludicrous and shows your bias.
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Well-said, joe. Hell... I’ve sat for as long as 2.5 hours (in the winter) waiting for an assignment. Took my lunch and breaks in that time frame, so nothing much else to do but wait as it was an out-of-town route and my dispatcher didn’t wanna bring me in too early and miss a pickup in case one was called in.
 
destroyed-city.jpg
 
U.S. cities are financially screwed
Raising their borrowing costs and starting trade wars won’t help
destroyed-city.jpg
 
roadboss said:
Say thank you ,to president Trump
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I don't think we are suppose to talk politics on here, but because you brought up the topic, it does seem like the cities with the greatest financial problems are in very liberal states such as California and Illinois. Say thank you to Democratic Governors and Congress People, I don't think it has changed much in the short time Trump has been President. Places like Chicago have always had their financial problems long before Trump even thought about running for President and will long after Trump leaves office.
 
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