The Federal Reserve Is Not The Problem, Wall Street Is The Problem

Discussion in 'Politics' started by larmar, Nov 8, 2013.

  1. larmar

    larmar Banned

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    So Twitter listed on Wall Street yesterday and a couple of Twitter Executives became instant Billionares.

    Wall Street was set up to be a market where businesses can sell stock to raise operating revenue.
    MintLife Blog | Personal Finance News & Advice | The History of the Stock Market

    But Twitter is already a multi-billion dollar, multi-national corporation and didn't need more money. Even though Twitter has never shown a profit, its not because they are not making money. It is because Twitter continually uses profits for acquisitions of other businesses.

    Today the Wall Street has become the haven of crooked bankers, and corporations supercomputers using advanced algorithms to trade stocks in milliseconds, "legally" stealing billions of dollars from 401k's. While your stock order sits around on somebody's computer for the end of the day transactions.
    Wall Street: The Speed Traders - YouTube

    What's the federal reserve's in the stock market? To follow orders from Wall Street keeping interest rate artifically low forcing investors into the stock market to seek higher returns.

    MARK CUBAN: Wall Street Has Lost Its Purpose - Business Insider
     
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  2. sharpshooter

    sharpshooter Well-Known Member

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    The Federal Gov't has also lost it's purpose, shut em both down
     
  3. AKDon

    AKDon Old acid hauler but not too caustic

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    I think that you have to distinguish between the stock and bond markets. Stocks are more regulated than bonds. CDOs, repos, asset-backed securities, mortgage-backed securities and by now likely a host of other good deals are there to skin the newbees; most are hardly regulated if at all. The Fed likes it way because the big players run the Fed. Check the movie, "The Big Short" or better yet, check the book.
     
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  4. Magoo

    Magoo You don't have to be Einstein to figure it out

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    Those with the gold make the rules
    then they tell us it;s good for us.
     
  5. Rastus

    Rastus ..MAGA.. AD-FREE USER

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    [​IMG]
    Just look at who gave this likes, that’s all you need to know.
     
  6. Rastus

    Rastus ..MAGA.. AD-FREE USER

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    If it sits around for the end of the day transactions and the market drops 500 points
    then they saved you the loss, jeeze.

    Again if anyone thinks the market is a bunch of crooks don’t put your money in it. That’s the great thing about America, it’s still sort of a free country.
     
  7. AKDon

    AKDon Old acid hauler but not too caustic

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    Thrasymachus said as much around 400 BC.

    Politics is difficult; thus messy. Here's a brief comparison: Time and again we see that truckers don't like bureaucrats especially those who read reports but who have not been run a year or so in a truck both around town and over the road. They resent it. Now back to those who have the gold. They too, don't want to have rules made for them by folks who couldn't put together a thousand or more dollars in a few minutes. But I don't want to say much more as our shared contention (do the miles, do the time) is a product of common sense. Nonetheless it isn't quite logical -- carried one or more steps further that would mean that only female doctors could treat females or we see that in some of the women's movements in which men are supposed to be excluded from all decisions about women.

    Of course, the comparison fails for several reasons:
    1. Locke thought that if a government ensures that property is private and protected, government has done its job. This is a common theme among Libertarians and that philosophy certainly has its rationale and adherents.
    a. But that raises the question, what of public resources. Do we go back to the workmanship ideal, i.e. something public becomes yours because you work it so long as you don't remove the benefits to others? Shades of the Enclosure Movement -- the creation of private property and the efficiency argument therefor -- many moons ago Socialism was knocked on its ass by the obvious, i.e. the tragedy of the commons.
    b. If so, does the benefit of reducing something to private property outweigh whatever economic (probably opportunity) and social costs can be assigned to the removal?

    2. Assuming that the government ensures that what you have is yours:
    a. Must that guarantee go to whomever you choose to succeed you? For instance, should there be social Darwinism (where at some point every able-bodied person starts out with a fixed sum if not ZERO? And assuming the government gets all of your assets on your death, what will the government do with it? Here I recall P.J. O'Rourke's comment to the effect that giving the government money is like giving your teenage son the car keys and a case of beer.
    b. As societies change should the concept of property change? We've seen something of this in the appropriation of private property in Chavez Ravine and then the construction of Dodger Stadium. We've seen this in some New England state in which the power of eminent domain was used to move folks off their property for a development -- strangely enough, those who were removed didn't get to enjoy any downstream benefits from this good deal they were given.
    c. Should we adopt a Rawlsian view that justice is fairness and that the more blessed are obligated to the less blessed (with brains, strength, mobility, agility, sight, hearing, etc.) and if so who will arbitrate what the more fortunate owe to the less fortunate? If so why have we no legal obligation to help an injured person with or without Good Samaritan Laws?

    There are other considerations but I have Christmas stuff to write.

    In the interim, feel free to check the book: Democracy Inc. by Sheldon Wolin (former WWII bomber pilot). And feel free to check any critique of the 08 Financial Meltdown.

    Again, you rightly state the obvious: The rich make the rules. However the cohort of the population that is rich changes.

    It seems that the immediate problem is the amalgam of the rich and the bureaucrats (the devil is in the details and bureaucrat/rich find or develop the details). Term limits on the bureaucrats are as necessary as term limits on office holders.
     
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  8. Magoo

    Magoo You don't have to be Einstein to figure it out

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    You going to have your prostate checked, which doctor do you want to do the exam

    This one
    • [​IMG]
    • or this one?

    • [​IMG]
     
  9. Rastus

    Rastus ..MAGA.. AD-FREE USER

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    Here’s your free Obamacare doc checking yours.
     
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  10. AKDon

    AKDon Old acid hauler but not too caustic

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    Before it was nuked out of me, my prostate was checked a lot. I cannot recall seeing the face, figure, or much else of the person behind my behind.
     
  11. Magoo

    Magoo You don't have to be Einstein to figure it out

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    Long elegant fingers are preferred over the fat short ones.
    Don't your just hate when they run out of finger and have to push parts of the hand in also?
     
  12. Rastus

    Rastus ..MAGA.. AD-FREE USER

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    Gay. (normal people just want to get out and not ever think about it)
     
  13. canaryinthemine

    canaryinthemine Retirement....The Job I Was Born To Have!

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    Very Good! Someone who at least knows who John Locke is.........

    But,.....many Libertarians base their views on Adam Smith and Milton and Rose Friedman,....neither of those two "groups" contemplated the instantaneous transfer of wealth in a 21st Century global economy. Nor did they imagine global corporations able to play off national Labor pools against each other in a quest for cheap labor costs at the expense of national interest. The Friedmans always imagined corporations tied to a landed base, and therefore having a shared political interest with their own workforce......

    I still think that Government's main,......and most important,.....job, is protecting their citizenry against rapacious Global Big Business..........Businesses big enough to buy and sell Legislative "interests"....

    John Rawls' philosophy becomes much more relevant in an age where there are two forms of "justice". Within the law, you can have a "justice system",....if you can afford it. For those that can't,.....there is a "legal system". Two completely different versions of...."justice".....based on money, and the ability to purchase...."justice".....

    P.J. O'Rourke is one of my favorite writers,..........A Conservative Republican with a brain,.......and a sense of humor. He also said : "Republicans constantly say Government doesn't work,.....and then they get elected, and prove it."

    And "Good Samaritan" laws? I think all the ambulance-chasing lawyers advertising on TV are in the process of dismantling that.......

    Thanks for the book tip. I will..... Many people don't understand that an entrenched bureaucracy always expands to exceed it's budgetary demands,.....and in that expansion, creates the need for an increased budget requirement. This is endemic to BOTH Parties.......An entrenched bureaucracy is anathema to a representative Republic.......How to juxtapose an honest Governmental Legislature with an established bureaucracy for the benefit,.....and protection!.......of the citizenry is a question for the Ages. Although Term Limits for all,....is a good start.

    Merry Christmas, Brother!
     
  14. AKDon

    AKDon Old acid hauler but not too caustic

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    I think Libertarians like Adam Smith's 4 canons of taxation:
    1. Government should take as little as possible
    2. If you make more you pay more (liberals love that one but Smith's explanation wasn't bad and recall that he was into moral philosophy).
    3. Government should collect money when folks have money.
    4. The taxpayer should know what he must pay ahead of time.

    Regarding Rose and Uncle Milton, my main takeaways are:
    1. Controlling the money supply is vital. And if you control the money supply, control all of it -- the shadow banking system exists by the unwillingness to control it and it will contribute disproportionately to the next crisis.
    2. The notion that we vote with our pocketbooks and feet in free markets.

    Regarding Rawls: I see his notion of justice as fairness distinguished from the laws that are enforced by bureacrats, cops et al. To me his theory is more like the common law concept of equity. Although hints of his "veil of ignorance" basis for fairness can be found in some of the Enlightment philosophers, less so the Scottish Enlightenment philosophers, many, (I'm one) thought that it was an innovative and comprehensive way of getting to the fundamentals of moral philosophy including what we know as political science.

    Regarding the book reference: The author was a dyed-in-the-wool liberal (he was the behind-the-scenes, intellectual giant of the Free Speech Movement at Berkeley -- by the way that free speech movement was much like the present free speech-like movements in that you're free to speak the party line.. I doubt that anybody could explain the history of political theory (to about the time of Eisenhower) better than Wolin. He's the first or second smartest man I've ever met. I'm sure liberals miss him.
     
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  15. AKDon

    AKDon Old acid hauler but not too caustic

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    Don't know. Never had that happen.
     
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  16. canaryinthemine

    canaryinthemine Retirement....The Job I Was Born To Have!

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    Milton Friedman's idea of control of the money supply was based on a nationalistic view of each countries' money supply primarily staying"on shore", so to speak,.......and as late as the'70's, when he and his wife wrote their economics textbooks,.........only a minimal amount of each countries ' money supply would be going to foreign trade. I think this is where he kind of missed the boat. Don't forget, the European Union wasn't even conceived yet,....it was only a gleam in some central planner's eyes.

    The tendency of corporations to remove entire manufacturing facilities from one country to another, was sparked by a revolution in technology that allowed manufacturing to become almost..."portable". Mr. Friedman based his economic theory in the idea that it was too cumbersome to move heavy manufacturing off-shore,.....in as much as building the factory, training the workforce, and having the "host" country providing the infrastructure meant,......in the'70's at least,......it would be decades before any manufacturer saw a positive return.

    Of course, there was quite a bit of global importing and exporting,.....always has been........But it wasn't the "driving force" behind each countries' economy. More of a sideline to the GDP.

    The explosion of a global economy meant that ALL workers now competed on the same playing field,......regardless of what sort of government was in power. I still think it's hilarious,....in an ironic sort of way,.........that our main trading partner,....and primary holder of our financial debt,.....is Communist China. That a totalitarian, state-run, state-controlled workforce,....who subsidizes both factories and the labor pool,..........can be more successful than a market-driven, "free" economy,.......(so much more successful that it now holds most of our debt),.........can only have Karl Marx rolling mirthfully in his grave. (....If Lenin would do that,...they could probably charge admission...).....

    I now have to admit a sad lack of education in that I have never heard of Sheldon Wolin. I certainly will have to fill that void. Maybe have something to read over Christmas.

    As a WWII bomber pilot, I wonder how Mr. Wolin felt about Joseph Heller's portrayal of the consummate mess officer Lt. Milo Minderbinder? I've made reference here, that since Mr. Trump's election,...our nation is now run by Milo Minderbinder. I fear the literary reference went over many peoples' heads.
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2017

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