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TForce | This site should read Teamsters only......

UPSF_GLAD TO BE NON-UNION said:
There it is....It finally came out....I knew it...but it was finally admitted by a teamster...or a teamster supporter.

and you even had the nerve to say you want us to join for our benifit...you care nothing about us....you just don't want us to be the cheap carrier undercutting the unionized force.


So right out of a teamsters mouth proves that the DVD UPSF put out is correct when they said our biggest compitition isn't the big union carriers...it is the non-union carriers.

I mean my mind was made up long before I came to "O",but this proves why you want us.

I allready knew it,but it was finally admitted.
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So, now that you know that "O" managment put the DVD out and your boss & Ceo did not authorize this but your boss & Ceo did authorize union votes, Where do you stand as far as your company having its best interests in you?
 
BusterNite said:
So, now that you know that "O" managment put the DVD out and your boss & Ceo did not authorize this but your boss & Ceo did authorize union votes, Where do you stand as far as your company having its best interests in you?
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I know that UPS authorized union votes in an effort to play nice with the teamsters with the upcomming contract with parcel.

I'm quite sure they hope we stay non-union...but they are not going to publicly say that....Is everone that nieve?

My position did not...and will not change!!
 
UPSF_GLAD TO BE NON-UNION said:
I know that UPS authorized union votes in an effort to play nice with the teamsters with the upcomming contract with parcel.

I'm quite sure they hope we stay non-union...but they are not going to publicly say that....Is everone that nieve?

My position did not...and will not change!!
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Untill you are so wronged that you have nowhere else to turn.
 
UPSF_GLAD TO BE NON-UNION said:
There it is....It finally came out....I knew it...but it was finally admitted by a teamster...or a teamster supporter.

and you even had the nerve to say you want us to join for our benifit...you care nothing about us....you just don't want us to be the cheap carrier undercutting the unionized force.


So right out of a teamsters mouth proves that the DVD UPSF put out is correct when they said our biggest compitition isn't the big union carriers...it is the non-union carriers.

I mean my mind was made up long before I came to "O",but this proves why you want us.

I allready knew it,but it was finally admitted.
Click to expand...

Glad,

It's nice to see that from my post you are only able to pull one small snipet and twist it totally to prove your entire case for staying non union. When I said that the ability to organize others would create a level playing field it also encompasses the fact that your job security would be increased. If I cared nothing about any of you I wouldn't have spent my time posting here, trying to point out the reasons I feel that you should vote for unionizing. But that's ok.....feel free to think what you want about me and my positions. If you don't think that I care if you make the same money for the same work, or have the same health and benefits at the same costs as me, then that is your perogotive. Since you admit your mind was made up long before this topic came into play, nothing I or my brother Teamsters say will make a difference with you.

Also bear in mind that the Teamsters position on growing the membership was never a secret. All anyone has to do is go to the Teamsters website and you will see that plain as day. The point is this, with a decline in a unionized workforce, goes a decline in middle class America. The middle class is the backbone of our society. Without the middle class and organizations like the Teamsters fighting to preserve or improve the quality of life of the working man, there would be nothing from stopping employers in all fields of work from turning the clock back and paying substandard wages to everyone, while working in pisspoor conditions and environments. Just remember the one big difference between us. You, are an at will employee, whereas I have a written contract and not an at will employee.


As far as not worrying about the big unionized companies, well All I can say is with YRC's market share and record earnings the past year, I would not be so complacent about not worrying. I remember years ago, when Roadway was spun off from it's non union companies they said we wouldn't last a year. Well 10 years later, Roadway is still here, still making gobs of money, and where are the nonunion companies that spun us? All are gone except Central freight, and they are in a precarious position. The others....Coles, Spartan, Viking, RPS, are all history or were acquired while on the brink of financial disaster.

By the way, a little bit of a sidenote...If you are wondering where your B,B,& B account went, it went to Roadway. We are making money with it and to show how "unflexible" a union carrier is, my terminal had to create a special start time just to service the account. I'm sure our other terminals had to do likewise. In my barn that time is 5am, and since 5am is not a recognized start time according to our contract, the driver gets paid overtime up front until his recognized starting time.

OVERTIME UP FRONT......WHAT A NOVEL CONCEPT!!!! :woohoo1:
 
UPSF_GLAD TO BE NON-UNION said:
I know that UPS authorized union votes in an effort to play nice with the teamsters with the upcomming contract with parcel.

I'm quite sure they hope we stay non-union...but they are not going to publicly say that....Is everone that nieve?

My position did not...and will not change!!
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Its ok we like to be attacked by so called people with valuable information......We are wrong and they are never wrong.:cool:
 
Johnnybegood said:
Its ok we like to be attacked by so called people with valuable information......We are wrong and they are never wrong.:cool:
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lol, don't think its an attack, kinda the equivalant of trying to pound sand into stone, might eventually get some through.:biglaugh:
 
Animo916 said:
Glad,

It's nice to see that from my post you are only able to pull one small snipet and twist it totally to prove your entire case for staying non union. When I said that the ability to organize others would create a level playing field it also encompasses the fact that your job security would be increased. If I cared nothing about any of you I wouldn't have spent my time posting here, trying to point out the reasons I feel that you should vote for unionizing. But that's ok.....feel free to think what you want about me and my positions. If you don't think that I care if you make the same money for the same work, or have the same health and benefits at the same costs as me, then that is your perogotive. Since you admit your mind was made up long before this topic came into play, nothing I or my brother Teamsters say will make a difference with you.

Also bear in mind that the Teamsters position on growing the membership was never a secret. All anyone has to do is go to the Teamsters website and you will see that plain as day. The point is this, with a decline in a unionized workforce, goes a decline in middle class America. The middle class is the backbone of our society. Without the middle class and organizations like the Teamsters fighting to preserve or improve the quality of life of the working man, there would be nothing from stopping employers in all fields of work from turning the clock back and paying substandard wages to everyone, while working in pisspoor conditions and environments. Just remember the one big difference between us. You, are an at will employee, whereas I have a written contract and not an at will employee.


As far as not worrying about the big unionized companies, well All I can say is with YRC's market share and record earnings the past year, I would not be so complacent about not worrying. I remember years ago, when Roadway was spun off from it's non union companies they said we wouldn't last a year. Well 10 years later, Roadway is still here, still making gobs of money, and where are the nonunion companies that spun us? All are gone except Central freight, and they are in a precarious position. The others....Coles, Spartan, Viking, RPS, are all history or were acquired while on the brink of financial disaster.

By the way, a little bit of a sidenote...If you are wondering where your B,B,& B account went, it went to Roadway. We are making money with it and to show how "unflexible" a union carrier is, my terminal had to create a special start time just to service the account. I'm sure our other terminals had to do likewise. In my barn that time is 5am, and since 5am is not a recognized start time according to our contract, the driver gets paid overtime up front until his recognized starting time.

OVERTIME UP FRONT......WHAT A NOVEL CONCEPT!!!! :woohoo1:
Click to expand...


The snipet I responded to was the important one...the one that people on the fence need to see.

If the teamsters truely cared about us,they wouldn't have vowed to put "O" out of business if they didn't organize the last time.

While it may be true that we would be better off being teamsters...I thought it valid to point out the reason you want us is for the betterment of your organization...not for the betterment of UPSF.

Yes,the other things you said may be valid...but this is the one I responded to,because it is the one I felt needed to be addressed.

As far as B.B &B...it is my understanding we lost the majority of that account due to "O"'s policy of "pack it high and tight"...and the damages were astronomical...which is something UPS has to(and I believe is)quickly address.

I think once we get the D&D down,we will have more freight than we can handle.
 
Glad,
1.4 million Teamsters didn't make that statement, so don't hold us all guilty of it. Besides, it was a rah rah macho statement that probably should never have been said. But that was then and this is now. Haven't we all said some things that we later wished we didn't?
You stated.... "While it may be true that we'll be better off being Teamsters"........ is what the fence riders might want to focus on at this point. You've just pointed out what many of us have been trying to relate to you guys.
Also, keep in mind that once you guys are in, assuming you will be, what makes us stronger will also make you stronger. Today's Teamsters realize too, that the Companies must make a profit for both sides to survive and are more flexible than you might know. UPSF would be fine as a Union Company.
 
Its my understanding that..

J.Hoffa Jr.,pressed UPS's C.E.O. for early negotiations of the package contract not due to expire till 2008,at the Vagas convention.
Also pressed our C.E.O. for approval of a card check for UPS Freight at the same time.

A card check which no one seems to know what its all about?

I'd say this sounds like J.Hoffa jr.backed our UPS C.E.O.into a corner because of the timing of the Teamster convention coming up just after the Overnite rebranding.

UPS doesn't want their famous brand disgraced with any of the Teamsters union negative organizing tactics.
After all they have to deal with this group in their package negoiations.

Our UPS C.E.O. is very smart individual,or he wouldn't be the head of the largest global transportation company in the world.
Just my opinion but I think he knows how to deal with the Teamsters union.
 
Apostolic said:
J.Hoffa Jr.,pressed UPS's C.E.O. for early negotiations of the package contract not due to expire till 2008,at the Vagas convention.
Also pressed our C.E.O. for approval of a card check for UPS Freight at the same time.

A card check which no one seems to know what its all about?

I'd say this sounds like J.Hoffa jr.backed our UPS C.E.O.into a corner because of the timing of the Teamster convention coming up just after the Overnite rebranding.

UPS doesn't want their famous brand disgraced with any of the Teamsters union negative organizing tactics.
After all they have to deal with this group in their package negoiations.

Our UPS C.E.O. is very smart individual,or he wouldn't be the head of the largest global transportation company in the world.
Just my opinion but I think he knows how to deal with the Teamsters union.
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Of course he knows how to deal with the Teamsters. He didn't become CEO of the largest trans co. in the world without know how to deal with them

John has a very good relationship with the Teamsters and wants to keep it that way. Without the Teamster UPS would not be the success it is today, period.

The convention has no bearing on either one of these issues.

Gordon and Leo are the biggest reason for the card check situation. They stepped on their Johnsons with the DVD. They overstepped their authority when it came to dealing with organized Labor within the UPS Family of companies.

The early negoitions have nothing to do with Overnite or the organization drive, it has to do with the Teamster pension and UPS trying to pull out of it. An early agreement means UPS can't pull out. Negative contract talks, early or not, will have a negative effect on UPS Centenial coming up.

Do you all really think this organization drive is critical to the Teamster's survival?

If you do I'd like to sell you some land. It's at the bottom of George's Bank. It has a lovely view.
 
I'd be willing to bet that at this point Leo and Gordon are not being allowed to do anything but collect a paycheck. UPS probably didn't get rid of them already so as not to appear that there is a major shakeup going on. As we speak they're probably just figureheads who will be severed as soon as UPS thinks it time to announce it.
 
stldude44 said:
I'd be willing to bet that at this point Leo and Gordon are not being allowed to do anything but collect a paycheck. UPS probably didn't get rid of them already so as not to appear that there is a major shakeup going on. As we speak they're probably just figureheads who will be severed as soon as UPS thinks it time to announce it.
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I think these guys have seen the writing on the wall. They don't have Union Pacific paying them to push their "you don't need the union" so we can prosper from your sweat to make a dollar message. Guys........we all work for a living. I work in a "right to work" state. I don't have to belong to the Teamsters. I didn't come from a Teamster household. I'm making over $21.00 per hour guaranteed for 40 hours per week. I don't know of anyplace in NC that pays that, without knowing someone on the "inside" or without a colleage degree. Everyone has their own opinion....but, I work to make the most money I can and retire some day to enjoy the rest of my life. I'm taking advantage of what I've got. I want everyone to have the same. DS.
 
UPSF_GLAD TO BE NON-UNION said:
The snipet I responded to was the important one...the one that people on the fence need to see.

If the teamsters truely cared about us,they wouldn't have vowed to put "O" out of business if they didn't organize the last time.

While it may be true that we would be better off being teamsters...I thought it valid to point out the reason you want us is for the betterment of your organization...not for the betterment of UPSF.

Yes,the other things you said may be valid...but this is the one I responded to,because it is the one I felt needed to be addressed.

As far as B.B &B...it is my understanding we lost the majority of that account due to "O"'s policy of "pack it high and tight"...and the damages were astronomical...which is something UPS has to(and I believe is)quickly address.

I think once we get the D&D down,we will have more freight than we can handle.
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Glad,

thanks for the honest reply.
While it may appear to you that increasing membership is just for the betterment of the Teamsters, it is also my heartfelt belief that it is to your personal betterment as well. As far as UPSF, I'm sure it will prosper whether union or not. But my concern is for the working man being able to prosper as well. We put in a lot of blood, sweat , and time into making our companies as successful as they are. Everyone else in the foodchain, .....stockholders, upper management, ceo's, all ride our backs to the bank. Without us (dock, city, & road drivers) doing the work, there really wouldnt be any company to speak of. We are the ones out there every day. We are the ones that actually make things happen. Isn't it time that the workers were treated more fairly and to a larger piece of the pie than they are getting now. I know that some companies pay close to union scale in wages and benefits, but many others still aren't close. The fact that I get paid to do things on my job that if you do, you do not receive the same compensation for, such as delays, giving up hours, working through lunch and breaks, or overtime...or having to pay weekly out of pocket for medical coverage which the Teamsters do not, doesn't any of this mean enough to you and your coworkers to take a united stand?

As far as the vow made during the strike, I tend to agree with Stldude44. Personally, I was never fond of the "Rally Cry". I thought it was demeaning and counterproductive, and in and of itself was probably the major reason for the organizing failure at that time. But as time changes, one gets to reflect and look back on past mistakes. Learning from our mistakes we tend to make wiser choices as time goes on.

As you have stated before, your mind was made up long ago, especially because of what happened during the last attempt. Just bear in mind that many rough edges have softened, and many people have a different outlook today than 5 years ago. While I have agreed that we are not perfect by any stretch of the imagination, I do believe that the advatanges far outweigh the disadvantages of being union, and that is what you and you coworkers should be basing decisions on and not personal gripes or feelings or misconceptions.
 
stldude44 said:
I'd be willing to bet that at this point Leo and Gordon are not being allowed to do anything but collect a paycheck. UPS probably didn't get rid of them already so as not to appear that there is a major shakeup going on. As we speak they're probably just figureheads who will be severed as soon as UPS thinks it time to announce it.
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Speculations are all these statements are just like a good contract it's all speculation.:duh: We would all be rich if we could tell the future........:smilie_132:
 
Johnnybegood said:
All i can say is you can Dress up a snake to look nice but in the end its still a snake....Food for thought.
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What kind of suits do Leo and Gordon wear?
I'm sure you know the color.
What color undies are they wearing today Johnny?
 
Teamster251 said:
What kind of suits do Leo and Gordon wear?
I'm sure you know the color.
What color undies are they wearing today Johnny?
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We all know what your colors you wear Mr. teamster. We all know how weak and feable your union is.:biglaugh: I say teamsters have about maybe 10 years left if you're lucky.
 
Skeeter said:
We all know what your colors you wear Mr. teamster. We all know how weak and feable your union is.:biglaugh: I say teamsters have about maybe 10 years left if you're lucky.
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LOL! And to think that only yesterday you were wanting to join up and get the UPS Parcel Contract! Remember....one Company, one Union?
 
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