WHO SHOULD PAY AND HOW MUCH?

Discussion in 'Central States Pension Fund Discussion' started by Bubba Gump, Jun 18, 2016.

  1. ABFer

    ABFer Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Who likes what tells you a something about people, no doubt. I don't know what his gig is but I find that if I just ignore those who make no sense and let them talk to themselves it makes this a more enjoyable place...for all.
     
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  2. nounionfool

    nounionfool Banned

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    Yes, just ignoring those who make no sense and let them talk to themselves is logical but in my opinion it doesn't make this a more enjoyable place for all. And don't get me wrong, confronting those individuals with the childish bickering back and forth sure doesn't make it a more enjoyable place for all either. On one hand, you have those who are acting on pure logic and the other hand you have those who are acting on their own moral principles. I deal with people the same way I deal with problems and ignoring a problem doesn't make it go away. Just like in Bubba's case, he was being ignored on Papajohn's thread and we all saw how he trashed that thread with his numerous, intentional nonsense posts, all by himself. There will always be those who will not just go away on their own free will when ignored, especially those who's sole purpose is to antagonize and disrupt, like I believe is true in his case. And in such a case, I will relentlessly confront those individuals even if that means it comes to my own demise as well on a forum. Is it logical and reasonable, no, but it is my way.

    After all the arguments from both sides of this debate on the two threads, there is no possible way that either side will acknowledge the other's point of view and that is a logical conclusion. So there is nothing left except for this meaningless, childish bickering to continue. In my opinion, we can atleast try and contain it to this thread since the author felt it necessary to jump from one thread to specifically start this thread to continue this childish bickering. After all, he personally stated that he started this thread in his post from the first thread. And he also even purposely changed the topic in the middle of his own thread and if that isn't being unbalanced, nothing is.

    And this post just isn't to condemn Bubba either, I'm sure that he really believes he is doing what he feels he must, being for deceitful reasons, just being unbalanced or any other reasons. Am I just as guilty as Bubba and some others about disrupting the forum in this exchange, your darn right, there will never be any argument from me there. I will always take on the responsibility and be held accountable of my own actions.

    So, like I said before, I will always respect those who can just ignore those who make no sense along with those antagonistic and childish replies but I never was one to believe in turning the other cheek.
     
  3. Bubba Gump

    Bubba Gump Active Member

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    united mine workers rally at 11:00 A.M. 9-8-2016. go to UMWA web sight, It will take you to live steaming on youtube starting at 10:30 A.M.
     
  4. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I received my pension reduction formula letter in my mail box yesterday.
    I will be getting $186.28 less starting July 1,2017,however the letter also states.
    If the fund runs out of money I'll still be under what is called a PBGC Guarantee Benefit,which is a corporation guaranteeing something.
    This reduces my reduced amount another $72.22,so I'll still be getting some money every month if the fund goes belly up.

    My wife & I are working to pay down the debt we have so the cut won't hurt so much.
    I understand by the letters I've received from my local that this is the way its going,& thats that.
    There is no sense looking back to the past errors made in running the fund.
    I see this is the way its going to be like it or not,we retired teamsters just have to adjust & move on.

    I myself feel bless that I'm going to at least get something,better than nothing.
     
  5. papajohn

    papajohn Banned

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    You sure should feel blessed that you are able to pay down on your debt. How many others can't?. You are going to lose 30%+ and you just accept it. Big deal Others in the Central States Pension Fund is going to lose up to 70% Sounds to me that you are ok with the new mob destroying the middle class without question or any fight. then I say to you the cut... you deserve to lose it. I myself do not and will not accept thievery. You may feel that a corrupt Congress and Wall street is ok, but I will not accept it without any fight. I can tell from your post that you have no problem just closing your eyes and pretending that it never happened. But I guess that is just how you are.
    We will continue to fight for our pensions, and If you and others are so willing to give up yours then why not just return the money now... Why wait for July 1, 2017, do it now to help the ones make more.
    NO PENSION CUTS PERIOD.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2016
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  6. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    If I like it or not,which by the way of course I don't like it.
    According to the letters I've received from my local,the cuts & date has been set in motion.
    Theres nothing anyone can do to stop it.
    Because of the underfunding with the fund as it is,fixing to bleed out in the next few years.
     
  7. papajohn

    papajohn Banned

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    WOW, are you serious? Well you are right if everyone in your fund thinks like you then there is nothing that can do. It will be a done deal, and you have to take the blame for what has happened.

    Central States Pension fund would have been a done deal to except the Retirees stood up for something they believed in and did something instead of just saying there is nothing we can do about it. That’s sad… That says a lot about one's character If that is the way you feel then you all deserve to lose it and should be put into the PBGC. But according to you then you’re ok with that too. My question is what are you going to do when the PBGC goes broke? My guess is you will just accept that too.

    I don’t feel one bit sorry for you if you can just turn your cheek and just accept anything that is told to you, then you deserve it. I have to wonder how in the world people can just accept what is told to you and do nothing.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2016
  8. SAC75

    SAC75 Well-Known Member

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    If CSPF didn't have 400,000 participants across 3/4 of the nation congressmen nor our senators would even bat an eye. If he is in the fund I think he is in they got 40,000. Our law makers laugh at that. I feel sorry for him really.

    I'm thinking the Maybrook NY local fund?
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2016
  9. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    The only way I can see to receive the money that we earned during our working years, from a pension fund that is hem-merging.
    Is to recrute more members to pay into it,other than that solution,I'm open to see others.

    Yes papajohn you may be disappointed in the defeatist attitude you think I have.
    However with the fund running out of money, with so many retiring & the lack of funds going into it.
    Do you have any solid solutions other than more criticism of those of us who are excepting our fait?
     
  10. papajohn

    papajohn Banned

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    You think this is criticism? This is disgust that someone who is about to lose part of their pension or anything that can alter their life is not even willing to do anything but just accept it.

    The miners don’t have that many people either. They are fighting for solutions to fix the Multi-Employer Pensions. You would be surprised what you can do if you all stuck together rather than just accept defeat. Our groups just marched with the Miners in Washington DC showing solidarity and will fight for any group that is willing to fight for their rights.

    Tell me when is your Pension Fund supposed to run out of money?
     
  11. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I'm in a fund with 9 locals,what leverage would so few have against our fund.
    Who have been warning us for many years that are fund is in critical condition.
    Till what they have set forth for a settlement for all of us drawing a monthly payment.

    Where would the money come from to award all of us with what we have coming for our years of service in the LTL industry?
     
  12. papajohn

    papajohn Banned

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    Did your fund file with Treasury for Pension Cuts? and when is it proposed to run out of money?
     
  13. papajohn

    papajohn Banned

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    We are working with Congress on solutions... Not Bailouts. This is and has been a Multi-Employer Pension problem for years... Not a Teamster problem. the Government has made the rules and laws, and now it's time they come up with a Solution.
     
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  14. SAC75

    SAC75 Well-Known Member

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  15. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Well there you go,this letter states among other issues,there is a negative cash flow.
    The pension is in a draught,so we'll take what is available,like it or not.
    You can lobby who every you want,however if the well is drying up,what support will you receive.
    Oh my I feel like I'm beating a dead horse with these posts.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2016
  16. SAC75

    SAC75 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not bitching. Just posted it to show papa. Sorry if u took it wrong.
     
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  17. papajohn

    papajohn Banned

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    Did your pension fund applied fo the Treasury Department under MPRA, and if so when?
     
  18. Bubba Gump

    Bubba Gump Active Member

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    Dear Docker, Your comments to Apostolic went way over the top. He is quite correct that there is nothing that can be done to stop the cuts. That is erisa, pbgc law. All the whining, kicking and screaming"calling your elected representatives" will change nothing. Have a blessed day DOCKER.
     
  19. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Argument....what argument?
    I have already stated I never argue,nobody ever wins in an argument.
    I thought we were all discussing this thread topic?
    There is a difference between arguing & discussing,as in a discussion all opinions can be offered in a civil manner without any anger involved.
    I'm willing to discuss any given topic I have knowledge of,however when it becomes an argument thats when I'll agree to disagree & have no more comments.

    Now back on topic.
    My faith is Apostolic Pentecostal,Christian,I serve a higher power.
    I also feel very blessed to have been free born in America,with all of its short comings it is still the best nation in the world.
    I know our government is slowly taking over all of us,as with the many laws that have been passed without voter approval.
    It is becoming very hard to be a law abiding citizen.

    I am also a realist,as far as the Teamsters pension fund I've earned during my working years,& have been receiving since my retirement in 2008.
    Every year I have received a letter from my local fund that the Teamsters pension fund is in so many words going broke.
    The first of this year the letter stated there would have to be cuts to keep it alive.
    My fund appointed an advocate on behalf of everyone eligible for pension payments.
    He went to meetings where a plan was devised to make cuts according to age & years of service,along with the starting date for the cuts to begin.

    In an earlier post I posted what my cut will be & starting date.
    I have also posted many comments of the realism I have viewed on the fund& cuts.
    I know the Teamsters pension fund started really failing when so many union LTL's were going bankrupt.
    There wasn't enough money going in for all of the members who were retiring,until this point in time,when the fund is in real trouble.

    So yes I have excepted my cut & Thank God it is better than nothing.
     
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  20. Bubba Gump

    Bubba Gump Active Member

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    Dear DOCKER, If you read the letter posted referring to Apostolic pension fund teamsters 707. You would know that it is insolvent, that the pensions were reduced under ERISA law that was superseded by MPRA. Under either law his pension would be reduced, no whining, kicking or screaming "calling ones elected Representative" would alter that fact. I'm sorry you had to hear it from me DOCKER but $35.75 a year is the max benefit when CSPF goes insolvent. I'm praying DOCKER that you find the wisdom to know what is changeable and what is not. Have a blessed day DOCKER.
     
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