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ABF | XPO Con-Way pay raise.

DCM_Doc said:
I said nothing about a pay cut. The topic was about how much better pay there is at non union lines. If I was starting over today I would still go to work for a union company. The benefits are much better here & having representation is difficult to place a value on.
If one is not satisfied with a union job the non union companies are hiring.
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I think the main difference between a Union job and a non-Union one ,....is that in the Union job, you get to retain at least a shred of your dignity,........and your manhood....

The dirty little secret that we all know,......Union and non-Union alike,.......is that in this day and age of Employment-at-Will laws, you are completely beholden to the good graces of your immediate supervisors for your continued employment.

You can play the tough guy all you want,.....but in the back of your head, you know you can be let go on a whim,......and there:s nothing you can legally do about it. Worst of all, your supervisor knows the same thing.......

So,......what kind of working environment does this create? A hundred years ago, in the steel mills around Pittsburgh, it was customary to...."tip".....your Foreman on Friday,.,....so you didn't get a lethal job,....like cleaning the lime pits.....on Monday.....

Anyone from the non-Union side want to enlighten us about the real eager beavers who are willing to go far beyond their job description,........ (.....or deep under the desk....).......to keep in the bosses' good graces?
 
To clarify for those who don't understand: Union collective bargaining agreements supersede Employment-at-Will laws.

Your First Amendment right of peaceable assembly and association gives people the ability to form Unions and Associations for mutual benefits and protection from discrimination.

That's why it's not illegal to be in a Union,.......although Lord knows some conservative politician in the pocket of the billionaires is probably secretly working on a Constitutional Amendment as we speak........
 
canaryinthemine said:
To clarify for those who don't understand: Union collective bargaining agreements supersede Employment-at-Will laws.

Your First Amendment right of peaceable assembly and association gives people the ability to form Unions and Associations for mutual benefits and protection from discrimination.

That's why it's not illegal to be in a Union,.......although Lord knows some conservative politician in the pocket of the billionaires is probably secretly working on a Constitutional Amendment as we speak........
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It is on the agenda right after our Second Amendment rights.
 
A Teamster only has to do his job & no more. If the supervisor doesn't like you so be it. I have had several supervisors over the years that would have fired me but they knew there would be a day of reckoning if they did which usually meant reinstatement & back pay. The disagreement was not if I was working. I believe in a days work for a days pay & a true Teamster will do just that. I don't approve of laziness on the job. I have seen many of management's boys do almost nothing & not be reprimanded. A favorite hangout for "The boys" is the boss's air conditioned office in summer months while true Teamsters were sweating & carrying the load. Also that same office is warm in winter months while work is being done outside in the cold.
I would be Teamster all over again even if the pay was no more than non union jobs. When that tail kisser gets a pay raise so do I.
 
DCM_Doc said:
A Teamster only has to do his job & no more. If the supervisor doesn't like you so be it. I have had several supervisors over the years that would have fired me but they knew there would be a day of reckoning if they did which usually meant reinstatement & back pay. The disagreement was not if I was working. I believe in a days work for a days pay & a true Teamster will do just that. I don't approve of laziness on the job. I have seen many of management's boys do almost nothing & not be reprimanded. A favorite hangout for "The boys" is the boss's air conditioned office in summer months while true Teamsters were sweating & carrying the load. Also that same office is warm in winter months while work is being done outside in the cold.
I would be Teamster all over again even if the pay was no more than non union jobs. When that tail kisser gets a pay raise so do I.
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The fact is that there are quite a few advantages to being a union worker. Some realize it and others don't and never will. Those of us who have worked under a union umbrella have a good feel for what we enjoy that others don't. The one thing that puzzles me the most is the man or woman who works in a non union shop and they feel like that is where we all belong. At will, working for less, no respect for work rules, no voice in how we are all treated. I could never understand how one who works for a living can have such low self esteem that they would feel like they are not worthy of making a living wage, the American dream, the picket fence in the back yard, two reliable automobiles, good enjoyable vacations. No, it is not what it used to be but nothing for the working man is. When we lose ground on what we have we have a right and an obligation to complain about it and to fight to effect a change for the better. Just sitting in our seats with our mouths shut is not going to make these changes.:soapbox:
 
And our current......"leadership"....,has fallen, hook, line, and sinker, for the old management lie that we have to accept less wages and benefits,........ to be "competitive"......

To be competitive with whom? The rat-ball carrier that doesn't pay overtime, barely pays minimum wage, and puts the public at risk every time a piece of their equipment rolls out of their property?

Either complicit or incompetent,..,.....the current IBT ........" leadership "......….has let us all down at a time when we have the most leverage .......the biggest hammer, as it were,.......to make great strides in our national contracts.

It should be a national embarrassment going into the Teamsters Convention in Las Vegas that the Union LTL carriers are the lowest paid drivers in the field.

Vote them OUT!
 
While I won't argue about the benefits of representation it's only as good as the people and infrastructure that supports it. The only benefit around Buffalo for going to a union shop is health insurance. YRC's work rules are virtually nonexistent up here. The NY pension is broke. I work with a few guys from red star who were to a little over a grand a month when they retire now getting letters saying their gonna possibly get $150. Saying fellow drivers have no spine does nothing to improve your situation or ours.
 
sabresfan said:
Saying fellow drivers have no spine does nothing to improve your situation or ours.
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You are right, the only thing that works anymore is burning, looting, and rioting and I don't see that happening anytime soon so I'll have to resort to complaining. Educating those who don't know or understand is our best tool right now.
 
ABFer said:
The fact is that there are quite a few advantages to being a union worker. Some realize it and others don't and never will. Those of us who have worked under a union umbrella have a good feel for what we enjoy that others don't. The one thing that puzzles me the most is the man or woman who works in a non union shop and they feel like that is where we all belong. At will, working for less, no respect for work rules, no voice in how we are all treated. I could never understand how one who works for a living can have such low self esteem that they would feel like they are not worthy of making a living wage, the American dream, the picket fence in the back yard, two reliable automobiles, good enjoyable vacations. No, it is not what it used to be but nothing for the working man is. When we lose ground on what we have we have a right and an obligation to complain about it and to fight to effect a change for the better. Just sitting in our seats with our mouths shut is not going to make these changes.:soapbox:
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sabresfan said:
While I won't argue about the benefits of representation it's only as good as the people and infrastructure that supports it. The only benefit around Buffalo for going to a union shop is health insurance. YRC's work rules are virtually nonexistent up here. The NY pension is broke. I work with a few guys from red star who were to a little over a grand a month when they retire now getting letters saying their gonna possibly get $150. Saying fellow drivers have no spine does nothing to improve your situation or ours.
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I agree with the point your making, but if us drivers all stuck together the guys at red star wouldn't be in this position....The big boys running these company's are getting compensated off our backs....
 
I've always said that the only time most non-Union drivers consider Union membership is a half-hour after they've been fired, and a week after they've retired,........in both cases, too late. Maybe I was wrong in saying they have no spine. Maybe it's just a case of no information. I'm sure in some cases, it's the "ostrich" syndrome...."If I don't aknowledge the facts, I don't have to think about them."

Would the pension in Buffalo be in that shape if most of the LTL drivers in the Buffalo area were contributing to that fund?
 
canaryinthemine said:
I've always said that the only time most non-Union drivers consider Union membership is a half-hour after they've been fired, and a week after they've retired,........in both cases, too late. Maybe I was wrong in saying they have no spine. Maybe it's just a case of no information. I'm sure in some cases, it's the "ostrich" syndrome...."If I don't aknowledge the facts, I don't have to think about them."

Would the pension in Buffalo be in that shape if most of the LTL drivers in the Buffalo area were contributing to that fund?
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Considering the fund is 28% funded as of last October I don't think there's enough drivers that could join now or years ago that could save it. When I moved back here in 2012 I asked drivers from yrc, new penn, Holland & ABF if I should go for it and the resounding answer I got was absolutely not. Not at your age with younger children. The instability of a slow down with layoffs and whether or not some of these companies will be there in years to come. I don't fault anyone for decisions they make where they work. The powers that be made decisions long ago company and union to not care about drivers anymore. Hoffa has made that clear as well as execs.
 
sabresfan said:
When I moved back here in 2012 I asked drivers from yrc, new penn, Holland & ABF if I should go for it and the resounding answer I got was absolutely not.
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Regardless of what you decided to do congratulations on making an informed decision and I hope all goes well for you.
 
ABFer said:
Regardless of what you decided to do congratulations on making an informed decision and I hope all goes well for you.
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I appreciate that. I'm sitting here in the hospital now with my son who just had a massive surgery. I carry the extra insurances that are only a few dollars a week that help meet deductible and max out of pocket expenses. Knowing I'm not on layoff right now is a God send. His condition just became known to us a month ago.
 
sabresfan said:
I appreciate that. I'm sitting here in the hospital now with my son who just had a massive surgery. I carry the extra insurances that are only a few dollars a week that help meet deductible and max out of pocket expenses. Knowing I'm not on layoff right now is a God send. His condition just became known to us a month ago.
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God bless you driver. I hope your son recovers completely and quickly!
 
So others here know I have worked for 2 different unions before. IBEW local 41 and UFCW local 1. Between the 2 I was laid off a total of 7 times. I have put years into organized labor. Not anytime begging the man for my job.
 
sabresfan said:
So others here know I have worked for 2 different unions before. IBEW local 41 and UFCW local 1. Between the 2 I was laid off a total of 7 times. I have put years into organized labor. Not anytime begging the man for my job.
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I can't see leaving an IBEW job for a Teamster job but I'm sure you had your reasons. Good luck with your son and have a happy and healthy retirement.
 
ABFer said:
I can't see leaving an IBEW job for a Teamster job but I'm sure you had your reasons. Good luck with your son and have a happy and healthy retirement.
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The building trades back in western NY in the 90's was a miserable time. Not many long term jobs.
 
canaryinthemine said:
I spoke to a friend of mine who works for XPO Con-Way who informed me that due to the ongoing threat of Union organizing, their company will give them a 50 cent an hour pay raise on April 3rd.

That will bring their rate to $25.90 an hour,.......pretty close to what FedEx is making.

YRC is the lowest paying LTL carrier,.......and we are the second-lowest paid,........and with our highly vaunted pension under attack,.....and YRC on a pension freeze,......and with no vacation for two years........tell me once again how ABF and YRC are going to attract new employees?

Good Job! Mess'rs Hoffa, Johnson, and Sweeton have pretty much ruined Union LTL for the future with the disastrous, putrid contracts,....... and the ongoing lack of interest and representation........

Maybe it would be better to decertify, and then immediately start an organizing campaign........It seems the only attention paid to LTL by the IBT is their ongoing quest for more dues money,........Maybe we would get better representation and attention iif we acted like we needed organized......

Of course XPO Con-Way will never organize.......Neither will FedEx.... They get better benefits and pay merely by the threat being out there.....plus the lack of availability of experienced LTL drivers ........Their upper management has concluded that paying drivers what they're worth is probably a better strategy for growth .....,...,as opposed to the strategy concocted by the.....,"management " at YRC and ABF,........and, of course,.....the Three Stooges at the IBT.
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Ok so they make a little more hourly. Our current rate of pay is $23.50 per hour with a 2% increase July 1.we also have a guarantee 8 hours when clocked in.Something that the non unions don't have. No lets talk about fringes.Currently in my supplement and probably yours too,the H&W contribution rate is currently $10.41 per hour and the pension is around $9.35 so if you add all those together that works out to be $43.26 per hour for your first 8 hours that the company is paying on your behalf! Then when the fringe contributions drop off after 8, now your overtime kicks in and now your rate of pay is $35.25 so tell me again how were the lowest paid In the LTL racket! Go ask a driver from O.D. R&L or Estes if they get paid premium time for working holidays,six punches or working over 40 hours let alone 8. Maybe I've been a Teamster to long (36years) I don't know,but I wouldn't have any other way!
 
sabresfan said:
I appreciate that. I'm sitting here in the hospital now with my son who just had a massive surgery. I carry the extra insurances that are only a few dollars a week that help meet deductible and max out of pocket expenses. Knowing I'm not on layoff right now is a God send. His condition just became known to us a month ago.
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Hang in there, sabre. I'm sure I speak for all when I say our prayers are with you.
 
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