What's new

XPO | Xpo Union Thread.

Status
Not open for further replies.
ED FORCE ONE said:
Many people live check to check even missing 1 day messes them up so its difficult to stand together if there was stand together pay 2 million drivers would be on srtike and 1 year before a contract is up the union should take 100 bucks per check and put in an account so you have 5k and when contract is approved return the dough
Click to expand...

When I worked at package they said they had a strike fund and could weather a storm. I am guessing UPSF doesn't have such a fund.
 
highspeeds said:
I probably shouldn't bother responding. Because you just don't get it. But I will try.

It's not an insult to disagree. It's not an insult to express displeasure. It's not an insult to say that you missed the point and completely ignored the point. Those are not insults. I didn't call you any names. Or cuss you out.

Yeah, people are unhappy. And then they quit. And then they call and tell us how happy they are now. And then more people quit. It's true. This is happening at XPO LTL.

At UPSF. The company forced the union in. They use the union as a means of control over the rank and file. And they offer the pay and benefits necessary to keep them the best available job in the industry to keep drivers in the seats. That company will chew you up and spit you out. They offer motivation to be there and want to stay there. It's how they are set up. It has nothing to do with negotiations. As you can see from their last negotiations. They offer what they intend to. If you don't want it. To bad.

You take everything personally. And over react to it. All the time. All the time. All the time.

I am not anything close to a company cheerleader. Your insistence that I am your enemy is misguided. I ask you simple questions and you run off in some ridiculous direction and then blame me for you being lost. I didn't do that. You did that. Self driving vehicles are being banned everywhere. And even if they get some approved for highway use in how ever many years. They will never replace a P&D driver. It's not going to back in off the street. It's not going to get out and hand unload. It's not going to pallet jack things to the tail. None of us are saying that. You are saying that.

What battle ? What war ? The union is disintegrating. It's disappearing. It's dying. They have no leverage. No strength. They don't stand strong. They don't stand together. None of the rhetoric is reality. None of it. UPS just proved it. That just happened. For real. It really happened.
Click to expand...
UPS and FedEx are the only companies that can really empty their system and still be in business. LTL is a secondary service and its treated as such. Any other LTL primary company tries this and the doors will close most likely. That's the issue YRC will be told again. Very sad to see all these companies where they are now from when I started 20 years ago.
 
highspeeds said:
Of course there are things they have that I want. There are things they HAD that they STILL WANTED and DON'T HAVE any more.

These guys keep telling us that going union is the path to more. But the union guys keep taking less.

They say that if you stand for nothing that you will fall for anything. UPS just voted yes on the same exact contract that they voted down because the company closed shop and dared them to strike. What good is the " threat " of strike if the company isn't scared ? What good is solidarity if it means that you all do exactly as the company told you ?

What is the difference ??? That they got to vote yes or no ? We cast our vote when we clock in. First cold day of the year. Lost 7 dock hands. This ain't worth it for what they pay to be in those conditions. 7 men voted no. Eventually the disposable employee model will start closing businesses. And until it does, things won't change.
Click to expand...
If the members aren’t willing to stick together that’s their own fault. Union is only as strong as the members regardless of what your leadership does.
 
Hollywoodz said:
It's not really free, Fly. Everyone pays into the system in the form of higher taxes. The savings are realized by 3 things. Full participation , reducing administrative costs and standardization of costs for services and fees.
Click to expand...
You just said the main reason that any govt run system will not work. Everyone does not pay into the system. Hell not everyone pays taxes. Per The Market Watch in 2016, 45% of Americans pay no federal income tax. So who then will suck up these higher tax??? When I retire can I go to the local union hall and get a pension payment even though I never paid a dime into it. That's whats happening now with the ACA, SS, and Medicare. The are more drawing on it then putting in. We need to get rid of ALL the deduction on taxes and go to as flat tax were EVERYONE pays

Would you agree that those who pay taxes are the only ones that can vote in election? If not why? Why couldn't I vote on the UPS union contract? Oh I know it doesn't effect me. Well those elected officials spend the tax money we pay in so why should someone who does pay taxes get a vote?
 
Hollywoodz said:
Henry Ford understood that it was pointless to build cars that his employees couldn't afford to buy.
Click to expand...
Also Ford did away with having to hire very skilled employees with higher pay to build his cars and hiring no skilled labor to do one or two thing on the line driving his cost down and his profit up.
 
sabresfan said:
UPS and FedEx are the only companies that can really empty their system and still be in business. LTL is a secondary service and its treated as such. Any other LTL primary company tries this and the doors will close most likely. That's the issue YRC will be told again. Very sad to see all these companies where they are now from when I started 20 years ago.
Click to expand...
UPS i would say yes, but for FedEx I think not. UPSF is not listed on it own in their quarterly reports it's listed with the supply chain division. So what's the real revenue and cost of UPSF is really unknown to the public and investors. Were as FedEx list freight as it own division showing all revenue and cost.
In the first quarter UPS supply chain and Freight revenue was 3.4B but how much was supply chain and how much was freight.
Were FedEx Freight showed a 1.959B in revenue just in the freight division
 
Fly-by-night said:
You just said the main reason that any govt run system will not work. Everyone does not pay into the system. Hell not everyone pays taxes. Per The Market Watch in 2016, 45% of Americans pay no federal income tax. So who then will suck up these higher tax??? When I retire can I go to the local union hall and get a pension payment even though I never paid a dime into it. That's whats happening now with the ACA, SS, and Medicare. The are more drawing on it then putting in. We need to get rid of ALL the deduction on taxes and go to as flat tax were EVERYONE pays

Would you agree that those who pay taxes are the only ones that can vote in election? If not why? Why couldn't I vote on the UPS union contract? Oh I know it doesn't effect me. Well those elected officials spend the tax money we pay in so why should someone who does pay taxes get a vote?
Click to expand...

How much in taxes should a person pay if they are earning 15,600.00 per year, basically minimum wage ? 45 % of Americans don't pay any taxes because they don't earn enough money to do so. In the late 1950's, corporate taxes were paid at 91% under the Eisenhower administration. Kennedy/Johnson lowered that rate to 75% and eliminated all the loopholes the companies were using to avoid paying their fair share. Now, corporate rate is at 25%. How can government provide any services if they can't collect enough taxes to pay for them. That's why our infrastructure is falling apart, our schools are dangerously underfunded and and Medicare and Social Security are facing shortfalls. Taxes are the price of admission to a civilized society. We should be proud to pay taxes to live in this country.

In a democratic society, it's one person , one vote. That's how it works.
 
highspeeds said:
I probably shouldn't bother responding. Because you just don't get it. But I will try.

It's not an insult to disagree. It's not an insult to express displeasure. It's not an insult to say that you missed the point and completely ignored the point. Those are not insults. I didn't call you any names. Or cuss you out.

Yeah, people are unhappy. And then they quit. And then they call and tell us how happy they are now. And then more people quit. It's true. This is happening at XPO LTL.

At UPSF. The company forced the union in. They use the union as a means of control over the rank and file. And they offer the pay and benefits necessary to keep them the best available job in the industry to keep drivers in the seats. That company will chew you up and spit you out. They offer motivation to be there and want to stay there. It's how they are set up. It has nothing to do with negotiations. As you can see from their last negotiations. They offer what they intend to. If you don't want it. To bad.

You take everything personally. And over react to it. All the time. All the time. All the time.

I am not anything close to a company cheerleader. Your insistence that I am your enemy is misguided. I ask you simple questions and you run off in some ridiculous direction and then blame me for you being lost. I didn't do that. You did that. Self driving vehicles are being banned everywhere. And even if they get some approved for highway use in how ever many years. They will never replace a P&D driver. It's not going to back in off the street. It's not going to get out and hand unload. It's not going to pallet jack things to the tail. None of us are saying that. You are saying that.

What battle ? What war ? The union is disintegrating. It's disappearing. It's dying. They have no leverage. No strength. They don't stand strong. They don't stand together. None of the rhetoric is reality. None of it. UPS just proved it. That just happened. For real. It really happened.
Click to expand...

Well, you're right about one thing...I don't get what you're trying to say. I never said you were my enemy. We simply disagree. To say I take things personally and over react is just ridiculous. I ask you to repeat your simple question, and you refuse, assuming I am unable to answer it to your liking.

I am not lost. I know exactly what I am saying and why I am saying it. It's really simple. Union drivers are better compensated than non union drivers. They have better health care. They have a grievance and arbitration process that effectively negates "at will" employment. They have contracts that both parties are must adhere to. And as a result of all these benefits, I would argue that they are more productive than non union drivers simply because they are happier with their working conditions. This is only my opinion, of course.

In the future, if you have a simple question, you only need to ask and I will do my very best to answer without annoying you. That's the best I can do right now.

By the way, 2 more petitions for certification today; Indianapolis, Indiana and Rockaway, New Jersey. The unions are not disintegrating, nor are they dying. In fact, union membership is on the rise again, albeit much slower than would suit me, but there is life in the old boy still. You may not like that, but it's a fact.
 
upnorth said:
I’m paying 40 percent of my wage to taxes. It’s socialism. Plain and simple. Your thought process doesn’t work.
Click to expand...

Following is a good article, comparing tax rates in America and Canada. Both have progressive tax systems and the difference is not as broad as you imply. The "catch" referred to in the title is the vast difference in services provided to Canadians for the taxes they pay.
It's democratic socialism for sure and, I don't mind paying taxes because I don't want to live in a country filled with poor, uneducated people.By the way, 33% of Canadians payed NO taxes in 2017. Seems they didn't make enough money either.
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/07/canadians-may-pay-more-taxes-than-americans-but-theres-a-catch.html
 
Last edited:
Hollywoodz said:
Following is a good article, comparing tax rates in America and Canada. Both have progressive tax systems and the difference is not as broad as you imply. The "catch" referred to in the title is the vast difference in services provided to Canadians for the taxes they pay.
It's democratic socialism for sure and, I don't mind paying taxes because I don't want to live in a country filled with poor, uneducated people.By the way, 33% of Canadians payed NO taxes in 2017. Seems they didn't make enough money either.
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/08/07/canadians-may-pay-more-taxes-than-americans-but-theres-a-catch.html
Click to expand...
And those 33 percent who didn’t contribute a dime to the system, got full access to all the services the 66 percent are paying. What happens when you kick out one leg of a three legged stool? It can’t support itself.
 
upnorth said:
And those 33 percent who didn’t contribute a dime to the system, got full access to all the services the 66 percent are paying. What happens when you kick out one leg of a three legged stool? It can’t support itself.
Click to expand...

I agree. It seems like a tenuous situation, yet it seems to work in every developed country in the world. I'm making an assumption here, but I believe that those 45% here in the US and those 33% up there in Canada find themselves in one of a few difficult situations. Some are working for minimum wages and simply have no money left over to pay taxes. Some are either disabled or too old to work. Some are poor children from a single parent household. Some are foreigners taking advantage of the situation. And some are simply grifters.

As stated. in 1960, top rate for corporations was 91%. These companies still made hundreds of millions of dollars in profit, every year. CEO's typically earned 10 times the highest salaried employee in the company. Now, some earn 5000 times the employees salary. Everybody made a good living. Fathers went out to work and mothers stayed home to raise the kids. Typically, a college student could work a summer job to pay for their education.

We are a consumer based economy. These tax policies, along with union labor, built the middle class because families had disposable income. They could afford to buy a new car every few years. They took vacations and most bought every new electronic household gadget available, beginning with radios, tv's, refrigerators, etc.

Now, fathers work two jobs and mothers work another and still, there's nothing near the disposable income our parents enjoyed. The taxes that used to pay for our schools and infrastructure are no longer available as the tax burden has shifted from the ultra wealthy to the middle class. As we know, poor folks don't pay any taxes. The shift in wealth in this country is obscene and unsustainable. Something has to give.
 
Same old song and dance , blame the poor and empower wealthy .

It’s ok if a wealthy corporation starves society buy avoiding paying taxes through loopholes but dammit let’s focuse on poor for pulling us all down.
 
puk8EKH.jpg
 
ED FORCE ONE said:
What good is being a rich person in a poor country trapped in your gated mansion because all the tax breaks you got and did not need wiped out regular working folks
Click to expand...
Are you now the great arbiter
ED FORCE ONE said:
What good is being a rich person in a poor country trapped in your gated mansion because all the tax breaks you got and did not need wiped out regular working folks
Click to expand...
So you now are the great arbiter of who needs a tax break and how much that break will be? Brad Jacob's as majority owner of XPO got a tax break. Was I as you say wiped out? No, not really. I got a pay raise. My health care benefits have increased in value. I too got a tax break at the same time as Jacob's. I do not think I wiped out any working people. When I read your post I read greed. You are upset that some people have a lot more than you. ( more than me too) The difference between you and me is I do not envy those with more than me or resent them for their accomplishments. Neither do I pity the poor working man and feel a need to give them the fruits of someone else's labor.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top