Is revolution hitting U.S. streets

[fartknocker]

You seem to misunderstand my point and that is this government don't care if you a good guy or a bad guy their ready to brake your head open . Do you agree with what they did to the Bonus Vets ? Apparently you agree with what happen in Oakland and that involved a twice served veteran, is he a moron ? I don't think so . Look again at that clip there was no problem the only problem was an over anxious cop that lost control of better judgment .

What do you consider "this government" who wants to bust heads? Whos government is it,Obamas? Oakland sure isnt full of Conservatives Ill tell you that.

[Woody]

Flash gernades were not distributed to police ?

[Toby]

In a Communist Country do you honestly think that these people would have the right to assemble the way they are? Do you honestly think that they would be able to remain as long as they have? In a communist country do you think that the government would react in a very different way ? Do you not understand that the police have acted with great restraint all over this country including Oakland to many of the provocations from these rioters... I suppose many on here do not take those things into consideration... Just as many do not take into consideration that the rioters were the ones that started throwing rocks, bottles, and paint at the police in the first place.. I guess the police were just supposed to sit there and take it... Be real you guys are getting goofy.. It is a shame this individual was hurt and he makes a great martyr for you because he is a vet and you guys needed a martyr , but you can bet in the ranks of the police all across this nation that more veterans serve there than in the ranks of the mob opposing them in OWS.

[Toby]

Almost exactly minus the tanks and military! One veteran that happens to be a protestor gets nailed and all of a sudden its almost exactly like what you desribed above,except without the tanks and military.

And the fact that it was General MacArthur that ordered the troops in top disperse the gathered vets and that Patton led the cavalry that came in .. Pup are you saying these to individuals along with Ike who was chief of staff were somehow the bad guys? Here learn a little more about that time period and the fact that congress did vote for an increase in pay but the Senate voted it down.. Look at the make up of these two body's at the time as well please.. Go into the internals of the story.. Learn that they were ordered to disperse and refused... No one denyed them there right to protest either, they overstayed the time just as these people at OWS have...

The Bonus Army

In 1924, a grateful Congress voted to give a bonus to World War I veterans - $1.25 for each day served overseas, $1.00 for each day served in the States. The catch was that payment would not be made until 1945.
Members of the Bonus Army
encamp within sight of the
Capitol, 1932
However, by 1932 the nation had slipped into the dark days of the Depression and the unemployed veterans wanted their money immediately.

The Bonus Army

June 17 was described by a local newspaper as "the tensest day in the capital since the war." The Senate was voting on the bill already passed by the House to immediately give the vets their bonus money. By dusk, 10,000 marchers crowded the Capitol grounds expectantly awaiting the outcome. Walter Waters, leader of the Bonus Expeditionary Force, appeared with bad news. The Senate had defeated the bill by a vote of 62 to 18. The crowd reacted with stunned silence. "Sing America and go back to your billets" he commanded, and they did. A silent "Death March" began in front of the Capitol and lasted until July 17, when Congress adjourned.

A month later, on July 28, Attorney General Mitchell ordered the evacuation of the veterans from all government property, Entrusted with the job, the Washington police met with resistance, shots were fired and two marchers killed. Learning of the shooting at lunch, President Hoover ordered the army to clear out the veterans. Infantry
Troops prepare to evacuate the
Bonus Army
July 28, 1932
and cavalry supported by six tanks were dispatched with Chief of Staff General Douglas MacArthur in command. Major Dwight D. Eisenhower served as his liaison with Washington police and Major George Patton led the cavalry.

[Toby]

Before the Million Man March, the Million Mom March or Martin Luther King, Jr.'s March on Washington, there was the Bonus Expeditionary Force (BEF): 45,000 WWI vets who, in 1932, swarmed Washington, D.C., in freight cars, crank-start jalopies, on motorcycles and even on foot from as far away as Portland, Ore., to demand payment of the bonus promised them at the end of the war. As Dickson and Allen show throughout this empathetic and well-researched volume, the BEF meant different things to a number of groups vying for power in the tumultuous political climate of the early '30s. Communist organizers saw the veterans as the shock troops of the emerging "American Soviet Government" —Publishers Weekly

[Toby]

Hey PUP how does OWS compare to the Bonyus Army DID these folks Serve in the military? Did all of them serve overseas? Are they entitled to things?? I am trying to get the comparison here... You may have a few vets intermixed in at OWS but I bet the vast majority never served in the military .. OH I get it they want something from others, the vets in the Bonus Army sure.. OWS just want everything for free.. thats about it.

[Toby]

COMMUNIST TACTICS AMONG VETERANS' GROUPS 1927

Mr. Pace. At the workers' camp in Farmington, Mich., and I was
made a membei- of section 7 of the Communist Party known as the
Ford section. Then I became a member of the district committee.

Mr. Mandel. Of what organization?

Mr. Pace. Of district 7 of the Communist Party in Michigan.
Later on I was made a member of the district bureau, and in 1932 I
was made the organizer of the Workers' Ex-Servicemen*s League of
Michigan.

Mr. Mandel. What was the Workers' Ex-Ser\ncemen's League?

Mr. Pace. It was the veterans' organization, organized and con-
trolled by the Communist Party,

Mr. Mandel. What was the unemployed council?

Mr. Pace. The unemployed council was the organization of un-
employed, organized and controlled by the Communist Party. I was
State organizer of the unemployed council in the State of Michigan.

Mr. Maxdel. Were you at one time active in the "bonus march"
of 1932?

Mr. Pace. I was.

Mr. Mandel. When did you leave the Connnunist Party?

Mr. Pace. In the early part of 1935, officially. I had ceased ac-
tivities in late 1934 and made the public announcement in 1935 through
the Detroit News.

Full text of "Communist tactics among veterans' groups (testimony of John T. Pace) Hearing before the Committee on Un-American Activities, House of Representatives, Eighty-second Congress, first session. July l3, 1951"

[Toby]

The FBI Analysis

After a month of camping on government lands, most of the veterans were malnourished, ill, and unprepared for such a battle. FBI files stated that many of the marchers had criminal records before coming to the Bonus March, but most were just regular citizens.

Furthermore, it was also stated that Waters “ordered defiance” when Patton’s troops came to remove them.



The FBI also thought that members of the Communist party had infiltrated the Bonus Army, not only to stir a riot, but also to try and use the march in their favor. Though Waters never acknowledges any association with communists, he did acknowledge that his Bonus army was more then just a group of protesters

In Waters’ book, The Bonus Marchers,he alleged that the Bonus Army’s march on Washington was a near coup attempt.

No matter what the reason, the Bonus March is a prime example of how quickly a peaceful protest can turn into a deadly riot.

The Bonus March – What a Non-Peaceful Protest Looks Like | Top Secret Writers

Oh I get it I see the comparison now It is the example of how quickly a peaceful protest can turn into a deadly riot thanks PUP!! I am sure we will see more examples of that over the coming weeks and months and have cheerleaders like Mags who will not go down there himself egging it on..

[Toby]

Hmmm Sound Familiar??

In June the House of Representatives narrowly passed the Patman bill, but the Senate defeated the measure with a lopsided vote of 62 to 18. Congress was scheduled to adjourn in mid-July, and about one-quarter of the veterans accepted the government's offer of free transportation home. Hoover had apparently won. Perhaps now he could concentrate on an economic recovery plan and the upcoming reelection campaign. But many of the marchers felt betrayed and disillusioned. With nowhere else to go, they decided to stay. Ominously, their disappointment festered in Washington's muggy summer heat. To complicate matters, at this point the American Communist Party saw an opportunity to cause trouble, and sent forth John Pace as the catalyst with instructions to incite riot. The degree of his success is uncertain and will be forever a matter of debate, but his presence alarmed the Washington power structure.


Historian Kenneth S. Davis theorizes that Pace may have had a hand in escalating the tensions, goading the angry veterans to become more aggressive. A more plausible explanation for rising tension may simply be that frustrations finally reached a boiling point. In any case, Secretary of War Patrick Hurley had had enough. On July 28 he ordered Glassford to immediately evacuate the occupied buildings, which were scheduled for demolition to make way for new government offices. The veterans stubbornly refused to budge. For whatever reason, Glassford and his police officers became the target of bricks and stones, and one officer suffered a fractured skull. As the melee got out of hand, an angry veteran, apparently feeling that Glassford had betrayed the Bonus Marchers, tore off the chief's gold police badge. Fearing for their safety, police opened fire, killing one veteran and mortally wounding another.

The 'Bonus Army' War in Washington

[Toby]

The President's accompanying statement and Mitchell's defense of the eviction came on the eve of the American Legion convention in Portland today. Administration supporters at the convention will atttempt to head off a resolution censuring the President for callling out Federal Troops to drive the B. E. F. from the Capital. Secretary of War Hurley flew to Portland to present the Administration's case.

Mitchell's report constituted the most severe atttack on the Bonus Army yet to come from official quarters.

Only 4,723 of the marchers were actually veterans of the world war, large numbers were "imposters," and several hundred had criminal records, Mitchell said.

Use of troops was justified, the Attorney General continued, to prevent "disorder and bloodshed." It is "intolerable," he added, that organized groups of men should encamp in the Capital and "attempt to live off the community like soldiers billeted in an enemy country."

C. B. Cowan, leader of the Cleveland contingent, and John T. Pace, of Detroit, chief of the so-called "left wing" elements, were charged by Mitchell with having criminal records. Mitchell dealt at length on the police and criminal records of the marchers to justify his assertion that "a very much larger proportion of the bonus army than was realized at the time consisted of ex-convicts."

CALLED IMPOSTERS

Out of men who were actually war veterans, 1096 had police records, and 829 had been convicted of major offenses.

The report said 877 men, or more than one-fourth of those registered on the muster role at the bonus-camp, could not be identified by the War Department. Mitchell added the "bulk of them were evidently imposters."

President Hoover summoned the troopers only after he had been informed the police could not control the situation, Mitchell said. The two bonus marchers slain were killed by the police and not the troops, it was pointed out. Death of a child following the disturbance was attributed to an intestinal disorder and not to tear gas thrown by the soldiers.

Meanwhile, the Justice Department is proceeding with its grand jury investigation by which it hopes to sustain charges that guns, ammunition and dynamite were found in the bonus camp.

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