ABF | Wages

Homesick - sorry for so many questions but I just had another one about wages - what are casuals Combo starting out now and once you’re hired full time is it still 24.63 an hour or has that changed with the new ratification?
 
Homesick - sorry for so many questions but I just had another one about wages - what are casuals Combo starting out now and once you’re hired full time is it still 24.63 an hour or has that changed with the new ratification?
As far as I know UE (utility employees) what you are calling combo (work both road and dock) are at 90% for the first year and top pay is now $24.93. Here is the wrinkle, if you are doing UE work or bid a UE position, you get a $1.00 per hour premium pay. UE drivers are very seldom hired off the street because UE position pay premium (normal pay is now $24.93 and premium pay is $25.93). Sorry it took so long to answer but I'm on a scuba diving trip in Fl.). And no worries, I'm willing to help anyway I can : )
 
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As far as I know UE (utility employees) what you are calling combo (work both road and dock) are at 90% for the first year and top pay is now $24.93. Here is the wrinkle, if you are doing UE work or bid a UE position, you get a $1.00 per hour premium pay. UE drivers are very seldom hired off the street because UE position pay premium (normal pay is now $24.93 and premium pay is $25.93). Sorry it took so long to answer but I'm on a scuba diving trip in Fl.). And no worries, I'm willing to help anyway I can : )


Scuba diving in Florida, eh? I just drove a thousand miles to get to Florida, and you didn't tell me you were underwater..........

Oh, well..........You missed me,...or I missed you.......One way or another....

I would've even let you buy me a steak dinner.........
 
Brother, if I had known you where anywhere near me I would have bought you a steak and a couple of beers. I was at PC beach scuba diving at st. Andrews state park and 2 offshore drives. Hopefully we can have a meal and a couple of beers sometime in the future.
 
I was down in Jacksonville visiting my son who was training for Navy stuff. TDY....as he is assigned to a DDG in Spain.

Been years since I drove down I-77 and I-95......Enjoyed the drive, but I noticed a....slight...increase in mentally-impaired, stupidity-assisted, oblivious-to-disaster driving,........

In some cases,...truck "drivers", even........Can you believe it?
 
I was down in Jacksonville visiting my son who was training for Navy stuff. TDY....as he is assigned to a DDG in Spain.

Been years since I drove down I-77 and I-95......Enjoyed the drive, but I noticed a....slight...increase in mentally-impaired, stupidity-assisted, oblivious-to-disaster driving,........

In some cases,...truck "drivers", even........Can you believe it?
Yes. I can believe it.

I've laid on the airhorn on the highway several times to try and get a "professional" CDL driver to look up from their phone , laptop , or tablet. And even with that some STILL don't look up from their device...it's more important than driving and holding a lane.
 
Yeah.......don’t bother getting on the CB to ask them how the view is with their head stuck up their........
They don’t use radios.......

They do use Google map........and every morning on the local news we see reports of large trucks on small streets knocking down telephone poles......

This is the natural result of “modernizing” trucks to the point that any one-armed parapeligic can drive one.......

A few years and you can mentioned Duplex transmissions......and you’ll get puzzled looks.......
 
I think you're mistaken in saying the Teamsters...."Beat, coerce, and violently force"..people into joining Unions. There could've been incidents of that in the distant past,.....and corporations would like many people to believe that Unions can only organize in a ...thuggish,...manner,........

But for sheer out-and-out violence,...let's start with the Haymarket riots in Chicago,...started when City policemen beat to death 4 strikers,.....and then we'll go to the Battle of Homestead,...where Pinkerton strikebreakers fought a pitched battle with Ironworkers, when Henry Clay Frick decided to hire an armed force to break the strike,.....

And here in W. Penna,........Everyone knows of the brutality of the Coal and Iron police,....who actually could kill indiscriminately,...and get away with it......

Because there has been violence in the past around organized Labor,.....(....much,...if not all of it started by company instigators...),...
Corporations love to spread the rumor that the only way Unions can attain new members,..is by violence. 10 minutes of research on the internet,...or even better,...an afternoon spent in a library, looking up labor violence,....would dispel that rumor.

If you want something more topical,.....watch the movie "Silkwood",...based on the whistleblower Karen Silkwood, and her violent death at the hands of an immoral corporation trying to hide their misdeeds. That just happened in the '70's........

The amount of ....coercion, threats, discrimination, and intimidation in a Union organizing campaign,.....could be found in looking at the '90's Union campaign to organize Ovenite.........

The company pulled out every dirty trick in the book,.........beat people up,...broke into cars,....fired guys just to intimidate the remaining people.....After several years of thuggish company intimidation,...the Overnite campaign just about failed, with maybe two barns out of several hundred nationwide signing cards to join......

The proof of corporate intimidation? Two years later, UPS bought Overnite.........UPS had a "card-check" agreement in their contract, which said that any new purchase by UPS could join the Union by merely having a majority of the employees sign a card.

Overnite ORGANIZED nationwide in FOUR months with a card-check,.....because the company wasn't allowed to interfere..(Nor was the Union....Heavily watched by the NLRB.....I know because I volunteered to work on that campaign...)......

Ask the UPS Freight guys,.......Anyone from the Overnite days could tell you all about company "dirty tricks"......There's a UPS Freight board on TB......Go over and ask.....

Please don't fall for the company propaganda about brutish Union organizing....Education is the key, Brother......
I worked for Overnite/UPS Freight for 39 years. I started in August of1977 and retired in August of 2016. I worked through all the Teamsters organizing campaigns. I don't recall any out right violence carried out by the company. They held meetings to tell us how bad things could get if we voted the union in. As a matter of fact, the company actually treated us better during the organizing campaigns. We had cookouts and food at the terminals. They gave out all kinds of goodies to keep us on their side. We also got better raises during those times.
 
I worked for Overnite/UPS Freight for 39 years. I started in August of1977 and retired in August of 2016. I worked through all the Teamsters organizing campaigns. I don't recall any out right violence carried out by the company. They held meetings to tell us how bad things could get if we voted the union in. As a matter of fact, the company actually treated us better during the organizing campaigns. We had cookouts and food at the terminals. They gave out all kinds of goodies to keep us on their side. We also got better raises during those times.


Thank you for your insight. I think that your testifying to many Teamster campaigns to organize Overnite,...speaks volumes to Overnite's management having an effective strategy to keep guys from organizing.

But,...I have to reiterate my point that,...once the "reins" had been handed to UPS, and there was no more Overnite management to forestall an organizing effort,...AND there was a card-check agreement in place.........
Overnite organized within four months.........

Same group of guys,...many of them long-term employees just like you. Why was the..."sea change".... so sudden?
I suspect that the subtle threat of job loss, health insurance loss, discrimination at the dispatch window,...and other tactics like that,.....were very effective at Overnite,....and continue to be very effective at all other non-Union companies.....

Now,.....Overnite probably didn't have to apply those tactics to ALL of their employees,......Just the ones they deemed susceptible to Union "propaganda".........Most guys at non-Union companies are probably just like you.......a good employee just trying to do his job and feed his family,.....and not wanting to get involved in any complicated Labor issues.
In most cases, just treating those employees well,...will win their hearts and minds.....and votes.......

But,....you've got to remember that company management places a VERY high premium on control of the Labor force,....and will do ANYTHING to retain that control. Labor costs in any industry, are the driving force of pretty much ALL of their policies. They DO NOT want any employee having a collective bargaining right to "sit at the table", and negotiate wages commensurate to the profits of the company..

The Labor employees .....PROVIDE...the profit........and Management feels THEY should decide who gets what...with no input from the very people who make the profits available to the company.....
.....(....How many upper management people hold a CDL?).....
You and I know how hard the job is,.........I think it's only fair that WE should have a voice in how the profits WE made for the company should be distributed.

I do not believe in "Benevolent Management". They are "Benevolent" only if it ...pays...them to do so.

For years, I've said that most non-Union people only think of Unionization and organizing just...twice in their career....

Once, when they've been fired,...and again after they've retired...In both cases, way too late.

....(...I base the "retired" part on the Teamster pensions,........which are under attack now, and may no longer be a negotiating point.......They are under attack because of a steadily shrinking Union base to the point that CEO's, and financiers smell blood in the water, and can finally see their way to eliminating good pensions,...to further control the aging workforce,...)....

....(...And,....a steadily shrinking Union base,....is the rise of non-Union Employment-at-Will companies,.......which was caused by guys refusing to....organize...).....
 
And for those who don't think it's....necessary,....to negotiate wages and benefits,.......

How many non-Union companies announce a pay raise,.....and then within a few weeks, announce that "health care costs" have risen,...and they have to raise "health care co-pays".....thereby negating the raise...?

When your employer controls your..."health care",.....and you allow them to charge you a ...surcharge... to MAINTAIN your "health care" plan............they are CONTROLLING their Labor costs!

Want proof?..........Next time they claim health care has "risen", and they must increase the amount of co-pay that comes out of your check.............tell them that, from now on, you'll pay that "increase" directly to your health care provider, instead of them taking it out of your check......

You know how far THAT will go.......

And,.....why should your employer be a "third-party" collection agency for health care costs?
 
I was down in Jacksonville visiting my son who was training for Navy stuff. TDY....as he is assigned to a DDG in Spain.

Been years since I drove down I-77 and I-95......Enjoyed the drive, but I noticed a....slight...increase in mentally-impaired, stupidity-assisted, oblivious-to-disaster driving,........

In some cases,...truck "drivers", even........Can you believe it?
I hope you enjoyed your time with your son. Some of the best times I had in life was when I was on TDY. No one seemed to know what you could and couldn't do (within reason).
 
I hope you enjoyed your time with your son. Some of the best times I had in life was when I was on TDY. No one seemed to know what you could and couldn't do (within reason).


Uhh,.....yeah. I was in the military in the early '70's. Never left the States,.......the only battle I fought in was the one with the Shore Patrol in New Orleans during Mardi Gras......

If i remember correctly,...I lost......

Stationed in Texas and Florida,....TDY in Georgia,....Not so good of a time......
 
Thank you, what’s the probation period on city p/d? It’s not a casual position it’s full time

If they hired you as full time, then your probationary period would be 90 days.

It is VERY important that you know the status of your hiring classification. Your steward should reiterate this with you and at least verbally confirm it with management.

As you probably know, there are several hiring classifications, each with different pay scales and qualifying periods. Get it made clear which one you're in. If you are on the probationary/new hire scale, then your name should be added to the bottom of the seniority board. That affects your pension and H & W contributions and eligibility as that establishes your seniority date.

As a probationary/new hire, you can be fired without recourse as long as your dismissal is related to job performance, and not discriminatory or punitive related to Union activity. You still have access to the grievance procedures.....they will start taking out full Union dues.

You are a full fledged member,......and if you are reasonably competent, you will breeze through the 90 day probationary period.
 
If they hired you as full time, then your probationary period would be 90 days.

It is VERY important that you know the status of your hiring classification. Your steward should reiterate this with you and at least verbally confirm it with management.

As you probably know, there are several hiring classifications, each with different pay scales and qualifying periods. Get it made clear which one you're in. If you are on the probationary/new hire scale, then your name should be added to the bottom of the seniority board. That affects your pension and H & W contributions and eligibility as that establishes your seniority date.

As a probationary/new hire, you can be fired without recourse as long as your dismissal is related to job performance, and not discriminatory or punitive related to Union activity. You still have access to the grievance procedures.....they will start taking out full Union dues.

You are a full fledged member,......and if you are reasonably competent, you will breeze through the 90 day probationary period.
Thank you very much for the information! I was with Holland for 10 years but on the road side. Does it take 90 days to get heath insurance also?
 
In the southern conference probation is 30 days. I'm road but the city people tell me it is the same for them (I have no reason to disagree with them).
 
Different Supplements have different qualifiers. As Bro. Homesick said above,....it would behoove you to talk to the steward and get the exact probationary period.

And I misspoke.......The probationary period here in W. Penna. is also 30 days. I got confused with the casual language that says any casual working 90 days shall be added to the list of probationary/new hires........

Terrible to grow old and senile........Luckily, I am incredibly good-looking to offset the senility thing.......

Health insurance in our Supplement is,...once you are on the seniority list, there is a one month qualifying period, a one month waiting period,.and you get your health care on the first day of the third month.

Check your Supplement, though......
 
Different Supplements have different qualifiers. As Bro. Homesick said above,....it would behoove you to talk to the steward and get the exact probationary period.

And I misspoke.......The probationary period here in W. Penna. is also 30 days. I got confused with the casual language that says any casual working 90 days shall be added to the list of probationary/new hires........

Terrible to grow old and senile........Luckily, I am incredibly good-looking to offset the senility thing.......

Health insurance in our Supplement is,...once you are on the seniority list, there is a one month qualifying period, a one month waiting period,.and you get your health care on the first day of the third month.

Check your Supplement, though......

And in some supplements you get health insurance if you work the qualifying number of days even if you are not on the seniority list.
 
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