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ABF | Driver-facing Cameras

mad trucker said:
Because they are telling the shop to put those in because the same Samara works off that camera. It is the sending device for the Samsara. If that camera is not in there then that unit will not work in that tractor you cannot use it.
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With the new city app they started using yesterday my pda is showing samsara has timed out several times a day, does they affect the camera?
 
mad trucker said:
I mean the camera that supposed to be facing us that’s taped up is connected to the Samsara . But if you don’t have that camera facing device in your truck your Samsara will not work in that truck
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That's interesting.......

Looks like Samsara has a fantastic salesman......

Anybody have any sort of word on how the negotiations about driver-facing cameras are going? If Ernie and Co. remain in Solidarity against surveillance technology,......that would be in the member's best interests,...for a change.

The news reporting about Facebook, Alexa/Amazon, and intrusion into private lives keeps growing weekly........As long as the trucking industry was able to keep driver personal surveillance...under the (non-Union..) radar......no one seemed to notice how "Big Brother"ish the trucking industry had become....

But, a big Union ruling,...either "for" or against driver-facing cameras will have large implications,.....Fourth Amendment-wise,...and future employment-wise. I'm sure that instructors in truck driving schools aren't telling students that,....the rest of your life will be on camera,...so we can fire you at will, by self-incrimination......

Yeah......right.

That ought to really boost applicants for truck driving jobs......Can't you just see hordes of new-hires begging to have their personal lives picked apart,....even while (potentially) in the sleeper bunk?
All to satisfy the company lawyer's quest to avoid any sort of company liability.......

Not "Safety"........in fact,...I think drivers should call "BS" on that company claim right now....This is all about company avoidance of liability,...by potentially calling even the ....smallest....action of the driver into question.....
That is a Trial Lawyer's Wet Dream,.....In front of a Jury,.....To portray the Driver as an evil stupid redneck bent on destruction.....

And the Company walks out of court......Liability Free........
 
canaryinthemine said:
That's interesting.......

Looks like Samsara has a fantastic salesman......

Anybody have any sort of word on how the negotiations about driver-facing cameras are going? If Ernie and Co. remain in Solidarity against surveillance technology,......that would be in the member's best interests,...for a change.

The news reporting about Facebook, Alexa/Amazon, and intrusion into private lives keeps growing weekly........As long as the trucking industry was able to keep driver personal surveillance...under the (non-Union..) radar......no one seemed to notice how "Big Brother"ish the trucking industry had become....

But, a big Union ruling,...either "for" or against driver-facing cameras will have large implications,.....Fourth Amendment-wise,...and future employment-wise. I'm sure that instructors in truck driving schools aren't telling students that,....the rest of your life will be on camera,...so we can fire you at will, by self-incrimination......

Yeah......right.

That ought to really boost applicants for truck driving jobs......Can't you just see hordes of new-hires begging to have their personal lives picked apart,....even while (potentially) in the sleeper bunk?
All to satisfy the company lawyer's quest to avoid any sort of company liability.......

Not "Safety"........in fact,...I think drivers should call "BS" on that company claim right now....This is all about company avoidance of liability,...by potentially calling even the ....smallest....action of the driver into question.....
That is a Trial Lawyer's Wet Dream,.....In front of a Jury,.....To portray the Driver as an evil stupid redneck bent on destruction.....

And the Company walks out of court......Liability Free........
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Very well put I totally agree.
 
canaryinthemine said:
That's interesting.......

Looks like Samsara has a fantastic salesman......

Anybody have any sort of word on how the negotiations about driver-facing cameras are going? If Ernie and Co. remain in Solidarity against surveillance technology,......that would be in the member's best interests,...for a change.

The news reporting about Facebook, Alexa/Amazon, and intrusion into private lives keeps growing weekly........As long as the trucking industry was able to keep driver personal surveillance...under the (non-Union..) radar......no one seemed to notice how "Big Brother"ish the trucking industry had become....

But, a big Union ruling,...either "for" or against driver-facing cameras will have large implications,.....Fourth Amendment-wise,...and future employment-wise. I'm sure that instructors in truck driving schools aren't telling students that,....the rest of your life will be on camera,...so we can fire you at will, by self-incrimination......

Yeah......right.

That ought to really boost applicants for truck driving jobs......Can't you just see hordes of new-hires begging to have their personal lives picked apart,....even while (potentially) in the sleeper bunk?
All to satisfy the company lawyer's quest to avoid any sort of company liability.......

Not "Safety"........in fact,...I think drivers should call "BS" on that company claim right now....This is all about company avoidance of liability,...by potentially calling even the ....smallest....action of the driver into question.....
That is a Trial Lawyer's Wet Dream,.....In front of a Jury,.....To portray the Driver as an evil stupid redneck bent on destruction.....

And the Company walks out of court......Liability Free........
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I agree with your post,First Canary,but anymore,everyone is a person of interest. Cameras in convenient stores,warehouses,offices,schools,hospitals,intersections,etc.etc.etc. You are being watched. Everywhere,and don’t forget everyone from age 7-100 carrying a phone video taping. Just sayin.
 
mad trucker said:
Because they are telling the shop to put those in because the same Samara works off that camera. It is the sending device for the Samsara. If that camera is not in there then that unit will not work in that tractor you cannot use it.
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We have been using the samsara app for a while now, we are on our 2nd version of the city app. Are you still using the mounted eld's?
 
GO40 said:
We have been using the samsara app for a while now, we are on our 2nd version of the city app. Are you still using the mounted eld's?
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some are some art we are still on the people net ELD for a few weeks I know for a fact out in the west Reno has been kicked out of people net and only using the samsara. By the end of the year will be off the people net from what I understand everywhere.
One more note if you do not know this already those handheld have a camera front and back so whether they’re able to turn them on to watch us from them I have no clue. But if you’re driving around put a bag over it. Just a heads up
 
mad trucker said:
some are some art we are still on the people net ELD for a few weeks I know for a fact out in the west Reno has been kicked out of people net and only using the samsara. By the end of the year will be off the people net from what I understand everywhere.
One more note if you do not know this already those handheld have a camera front and back so whether they’re able to turn them on to watch us from them I have no clue. But if you’re driving around put a bag over it. Just a heads up
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BRG can disregard this!
 
mad trucker said:
some are some art we are still on the people net ELD for a few weeks I know for a fact out in the west Reno has been kicked out of people net and only using the samsara. By the end of the year will be off the people net from what I understand everywhere.
One more note if you do not know this already those handheld have a camera front and back so whether they’re able to turn them on to watch us from them I have no clue. But if you’re driving around put a bag over it. Just a heads up
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Absolutely. I used to carry a small amount of electricians tape with me and an Exacto knife. Got pretty good at cutting the tape to precisely cover the camera lenses! Maybe I should’ve been a surgeon. A tape surgeon, that is.
 
BIG R GUY said:
I agree with your post,First Canary,but anymore,everyone is a person of interest. Cameras in convenient stores,warehouses,offices,schools,hospitals,intersections,etc.etc.etc. You are being watched. Everywhere,and don’t forget everyone from age 7-100 carrying a phone video taping. Just sayin.
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That's true,....but we got to this point in a slow and insidious way,....It's almost like we woke up one day,.....and cameras sprouted like mushrooms after a rain......
And all for our...."Safety",...too.....

I think there's a potential for truck drivers to make a stand here,....because the dash cameras are so..."in your face"...and rudely personal....
....and the company feels the driver "has no choice" about the surveillance......

If Union truck drivers can get some sort of...ruling on Personal surveillance,.....it might turn into some kind of "watershed" moment for other groups of workers.

I still think it's very important for each driver to give their employer a letter stating the company does NOT have the right to "View, Use, or Sell" your personal image,....without your express written consent, on a Per Incident basis,......

And,...especially not without Union representation, either......

I can see an addendum to the Weingarten Rights.......


Trucker 206 said:
Absolutely. I used to carry a small amount of electricians tape with me and an Exacto knife. Got pretty good at cutting the tape to precisely cover the camera lenses! Maybe I should’ve been a surgeon. A tape surgeon, that is.
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Hah!,......And now I have the Weird Al Yankovic song..."Like a Surgeon"....stuck in my head like an earworm.....
 
mad trucker said:
some are some art we are still on the people net ELD for a few weeks I know for a fact out in the west Reno has been kicked out of people net and only using the samsara. By the end of the year will be off the people net from what I understand everywhere.
One more note if you do not know this already those handheld have a camera front and back so whether they’re able to turn them on to watch us from them I have no clue. But if you’re driving around put a bag over it. Just a heads up
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I called help desk on Friday & the technician asked for the last 6 serial numbers of my PDA & he was able to get into it & move things around, so it is possible for them to see us....
 
GO40 said:
I called help desk on Friday & the technician asked for the last 6 serial numbers of my PDA & he was able to get into it & move things around, so it is possible for them to see us....
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But currently,....they can't admit that without violating the contract,.....And,...if you've given them a letter disallowing them to..."view" you,....you may have a personal lawsuit, also.

One of these days,....some low-level, bottom pay-grade technician is going to....slip up,...and admit that he can see you....
...along with all the other people in the tech room.......

I would hope that Ernie and Co. are preparing a massive, carved-in-granite, 10 foot tall grievance .....to drop from a great height,...on ArcBest management.....
.....in the event someone inadvertantly......"tells the Truth".....
 
XPO driver here. I've been operating with an inward facing camera babysitting me since the company installed them over 5 years ago. I'm not going to get into it with this post, but if any of you want to learn the ins and outs of these things I'll be happy to talk about it.
 
ScotchNeat said:
XPO driver here. I've been operating with an inward facing camera babysitting me since the company installed them over 5 years ago. I'm not going to get into it with this post, but if any of you want to learn the ins and outs of these things I'll be happy to talk about it.
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Thank you, Brother.......I have a friend who works out of the Irwin, Pa. terminal,..that has filled me in on ...camera observation. Several friends, actually.....
But, we can always appreciate a new perspective.

One thing that has come up,......It seems that local management at terminals that use...driver surveillance,....can use/abuse/not use cameras at-will,...and selectively,..on certain drivers,....Or not.

Have you had any experience with....selective camera viewing? Of course, you guys are working under the "Employee-At-Will" rules,...in which you punch in and...have to agree to any condition your employers impose....
....Or quit.....
Which puts you guys in kind of a tight spot.....

This isn't about Union vs. non-Union,.........It's about ALL driver's Right of Privacy,...personal surveillance, ..and potential Fourth amendment violations and Labor rights.

Selective discipline has come up as an issue......Have you seen any instances of this where you think the company might be..."picking"...on certain people?
 
canaryinthemine said:
Thank you, Brother.......I have a friend who works out of the Irwin, Pa. terminal,..that has filled me in on ...camera observation. Several friends, actually.....
But, we can always appreciate a new perspective.

One thing that has come up,......It seems that local management at terminals that use...driver surveillance,....can use/abuse/not use cameras at-will,...and selectively,..on certain drivers,....Or not.

Have you had any experience with....selective camera viewing? Of course, you guys are working under the "Employee-At-Will" rules,...in which you punch in and...have to agree to any condition your employers impose....
....Or quit.....
Which puts you guys in kind of a tight spot.....

This isn't about Union vs. non-Union,.........It's about ALL driver's Right of Privacy,...personal surveillance, ..and potential Fourth amendment violations and Labor rights.

Selective discipline has come up as an issue......Have you seen any instances of this where you think the company might be..."picking"...on certain people?
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If you're asking me if it's possible for local management to activate a camera at their discretion on a driver, the answer is no. The cameras are only motion activated and only if the forces in the motion exceed a certain acceleration threshold. As to selective viewing, any event that trips the camera is stored and first reviewed by a third party, only those events that violate the law or company policy are sent to a driver coach to be viewed so that the coach can have a one on one sit down with the driver. The only people I've ever seen fired over camera events are those who are caught using a cell phone without a blue tooth. And in that case they have to be caught three times first before they're shown the door. I didn't exactly understand that nature of your questions so I hope you found this response useful. On a positive note, since we've had cameras, we had one driver from my terminal exonerated from a potential lawsuit from a known ambulance chaser who purposely caused an accident with him. One last thing as to the Fourth Amendment. It's my understanding that it as well as the rest of the Bill of Rights is about defining the relationship between the federal govt and the individual, what the federal govt may not do to, do for, take from, impose upon, or otherwise harm the individual. Outside of that, if we agree to work for XPO, we agree to be randomly viewed while operating company equipment. If we had dock cameras it would be the same way and I, in limited capacity when it comes to law do not see any conflicts between cameras at work and the Fourth Amendment.
 
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