We Are All In The Same Boat Together!
- Thread starter UTR906
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Not really. Those already collecting got the slowly sinking boat. Anyone under 62 or so swims with the sharks and barracuda.
canaryinthemine
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Why sure!.....Why don't we divide it up by the amount of years worked? I got 41,.....how many you got?
Those "selfish bas---ds" are your fellow Teamsters.....the ones that negotiated and passed the pension plan......Not the ones that destroyed it. Many of those are....still working.
Go to a “Save our pension “ meeting Canary , and pay attention you’ll find out quick that the retirees will volunteer you for a cut in a heart beat . But if you say something about equal sacrifice they’ll turn on you like a bad dog ! A good man with 37 years was told he was “born late “ at one of these meetings . What I’m saying is true and you know it . Fellow Teamsters , yeah right . I stand by what I said . I’m surprised some retiree moderator hasn’t taken my message yet .
Its currently illegal to divide up the Pension. Plus it comes to a share of only a one time payout of approx $31,000 each. Not enough to retire on.
You've got ZERO in CSPF- so its irrelevant how many you have.
CSPF RETIREES “We ain’t takin no cuts “. Thomas Nyhan “ You will in 2025 like it or not “
canaryinthemine
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And what would prevent any other Teamster,...who's in the CSPF,....from using that same example? Is it still irrelevant?....or do you just want me to shut up?
Yes,.....they will.....if the PBGC is still solvent. And if it isn't, due to Congressional inaction,.....the "cut" will be ...zero. For everyone.....
As you know,...the Treasury Dept. rejected CSPF's rehabilitation plan.....Didn't cut far enough, they said.....
The Treasury Department conducted the vote count here in W. Penna. There were roughly 2,500 votes to cut the pension,...9,000 votes NOT to cut the pension,......
....and then under the...peculiar....... rules instituted by the Treasury Dept..........11,000 "did not vote"s.........which the Treasury "interpreted" as..."Yes"...votes....To cut the pension....
First time in history, I'll bet....that the non-votes,...people who didn't vote......determined the outcome of the elective choice......
Frankly,...many of us have a hard time accepting that 11,000 participants did not vote....This was a very hot issue in W. Pa. The Pension meetings were overflowing......
And those of us that have asked for the report from the Independent Auditor who supposedly conducted the vote,....were told we must file a FOIA request to get the report......
Does the Treasury Department have the participants of the CSPF's best interests at heart?,........or any Multi-employer fund's participants?
Rodbolt,....you're going to have to see past the anger.....The retirees,...(in any plan,...jimmy g...) helped negotiate these benefits,....were promised these benefits,....and,....until the financial collapse of 2008,....the Union allowing UPS to "buy-out",...and YRC to stop making payments......TWO unforseen occurrences that were created and allowed by Union leadership.......
.....the Fund was getting by,....and just like our Fund ,...was reasonably solvent...
..until all those(created) circumstances came together in a perfect storm,....to kick the legs out of the Funds.
Was it the retiree's fault? Was it the currently working employee's fault? Is someone trying to deflect your anger away from the...true culprits.....and onto your Teamster brothers?
Congress,...in MY Opinion,...was culpable in the 2008 financial collapse,.......The Teamster Leadership,....and UPS and YRC management conspired to create intolerable conditions for the CSPF......
....and we're being told that those "responsible"....are either the retirees,...or the currently working employees.
It might be relevant if a CSPF member said it, but illegal to do. It's against the law and against the contract. Basically I see almost all of your snarky lectures as irrelevant and normally factually wrong.
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If you'd actually read the MEPRA Rules, you'd know the member's votes mean nothing during a cut by the Treasury. Treasury has the right to overrule the vote, even if it was unanimous against cuts.
Canary I’ve been working , paying union dues 31 years . Retirees and Union officials keep telling me , hang in there , keep working , the government is going to fix the pension . Meanwhile the fund is being gutted , my contributions are paying retirees who are getting more retired than I am working . I think I’d rather have that $31,000 . Beats the hell out of nothing !
I guess I got too real , nobody has anything to say . This situation is outrageous and absurd . There are people who are responsible , accountable, but they won’t be punished. Look at history this has happened before . Please think , don’t just put your heads down and take it !
canaryinthemine
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Responsible and accountable people are few and far between....The point I wanted to make to you, Rodbolt,...is that the Treasury Department does not have your best interests at heart,.....nor does your employer, or the so-called "leadership" of the Teamsters, who allowed two of the major employers to quit funding the CSPF.....
The only group of people you can regard as ...allies..(inasmuch as everyone has their own interests at heart..).....are your current co-workers and your ...former co-workers. Both groups will be impacted by any sort of.........conspiracy....to cut the pension fund payouts.
Yes,....the fund is in trouble,....No,...the retirees didn't do it.......The Fund was....deliberately put into the position they're in,....by Government action,..."leadership" mismanagement..(..or not??).....and the banking industry trying to...break the backs of defined-benefit funds,....a goal they've been shooting for,...... for decades......Something about large blocks of stock,...held by the Funds....
There are people deliberately trying to...divide the Teamsters,..by creating hate and envy........Let's see through that subterfuge..
There is a general Labor shortage across the nation,...and a very acute specific shortage of licensed CDL drivers......Who do you think benefits, if pension cuts are enacted,....and guys delay retiring,...because they no longer can afford to?
Why are pension funds....defined-benefit funds,......doing so poorly?.....when the stock market posts record gains every month?
You are right,....don't put your head down and take it.......90% of this is politically driven,..in My Opinion,....either through direct Congressional action , or indirect lobbying behind the scenes, by the banking industry, and the employers.
In light of the.....grossly skewed...vote by the Western Penna. Pension Fund....conducted by the Treasury department,....in which people who DIDN'T Vote..........determined the outcome of the Pension cuts,.....(...or so they say....)....
....maybe you guys in CSPF dodged a....bullet ..for a bit.
Maybe a ....fairer...way of voting for a Pension cut will be legislated in the ...near future. Everyone is aware the Clock is ticking,......
Maybe they'll change the rules to say ONLY the people's votes, who DO Vote,....will count.
Maybe,....at that point,....a more honest assessment of the health of the CSPF will appear.
Good Luck, Brother.....as with all things,.....don't believe everything on social media is in your....best interests.
canaryinthemine
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Ahh,......Thank you for Imparting that Pearl of Wisdom.........May I ask an Impertinent Question then?.....
Why the Hell did they bother to have a Vote?
Read the MEPRA Rules. Treasury is required to HAVE a vote, but not required to follow the outcome. Treasury can and will overturn an election, as they determine whether or not they can deem the Fund savable.
You know all that. We've discussed it in the past, but you like retelling the story. Makes you seem like you're a victim.
canaryinthemine
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The MEPRA rules say that Treasury dictates the fate of any fund covered by PBGC.
Again......Why bother with a vote? Merely to have the ability in the future to say: " Well, you guys voted for it..."?
If the Treasury Department conducted this....mugging....in a dark alley,....it would be clear who the victims were.
My answer is- I don’t know. My guess would be that a symbolic vote had to be included in the Bill for it to gather enough votes to pass. Even though it passed, attached to the Must Pass Continuing Resolution End of Year 2014 Spending Bill. Politics in DC....
Treasury sometimes has to force thru unpopular cuts for funds to pay members beyond the current Retirees. All for One, One for All used to be the Motto...
canaryinthemine
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A fair answer. The symbolism , in this case, must be a legal need for the participants to "authorize" any cuts..........despite any sort of monkeyshines to get that authorization.......
I'm not saying there shouldn't be cuts.......Apparently,..there's an argument for them. What I am seeing is a distinct effort to.....blame one group of Teamsters(retired) for the problems of the Fund.
To hang the Albatross,...as it were,....around their neck.
Blame doesn't really mean anything,....after the fact. But,....since there is an ongoing dialogue about who to blame,.....I think it should be pointed out which groups.....Congress, Teamster Leadership, trustees,....had their respective fingers in this pie,......producing this result....
The effort to deflect blame away from the.....true culprits,...has always been, to me,....an effort to hide an...ongoing crime.
The suspicion that Treasury is...."cooking"....the vote counts, to get that...participant "authorization".......
........stinks,....on ice........
This, in spite of,...as you say,....Treasury's ability to impose their will, despite,....any vote.
Politics As Usual,...as you say. The Omnibus Bill was pushed through with 3 hours to spare for a Government shutdown in 2014,...Kline-Miller was authorized 2 days later,.....
There have been 14 votes under the MEPRA conducted by the Treasury department since 2016.......ALL 14 votes have had NON-PARTICIPANTS decide the outcome of the pension reduction vote.....
In ALL of the election,...the guys who DID vote.....voted OVERWHELMINGLY against a pension cut.
In ALL the elections.....somehow the Treasury Department found MORE Not Voting ballots,....than actual ballots sent in......
Does anyone think this is....suspicious?