XPO | XPO Union Thread #2

I don't think people are paying attention to what's happening. They just hear "wage increase" and yell "yaaaaaaaay".

Companies starting paying more when they needed less people. I can now order my food on an app and it's ready when I get there. No need for cashiers. I can even have somebody walk it to my car. In the restaurant the person at the counter tells me to use the kiosk. If the ease of this isn't incentive enough, I get coupons and free stuff for bypassing in person ordering. Now, the restaurant pays 2 people 15/hr instead of paying 4 people 8/hr.

Supermarkets are no different. They have self checkout set up.. One cashier open and 10 self checkout lanes. You get accustomed to doing it yourself because nobody wants to stand on a line for 20 minutes if they don't have to.

Sure the companies will play ball while they have to, but they're getting rid of the jobs they don't need. The more employees cost them, the more they're faster they're looking to automate jobs and get rid of them. Consumers become accustomed to because they're offered free stuff and convenience.

Start all the unions you want. It doesn't change the fact that this country (if not the world) is run by big tech, big pharma, big retail, big banks and the military industrial complex. Nobody cares about little employees unionizing. They'll tolerate for now, but they shrinking their staff and doing it fast. What good is it to be an unemployed union member?
This might be the most obnoxiously stupid thing I've read today and that's saying something because I read a few paragraphs of Ayn Rand's slop earlier...

You're seriously making this argument? Or are you pulling my leg right now?
 
This might be the most obnoxiously stupid thing I've read today and that's saying something because I read a few paragraphs of Ayn Rand's slop earlier...

You're seriously making this argument? Or are you pulling my leg right now?

Which part of is wrong? I'm used to the childish deflections. It's common from the people that make your arguments. Never any facts or data, just name calling. Typical.
 
Which part of is wrong? I'm used to the childish deflections. It's common from the people that make your arguments. Never any facts or data, just name calling. Typical.
Actually on the previous page I responded more seriously because I thought maybe you were a serious person but instead of engaging with anything seriously you just devolve into animalistic libertarian grunting and shaking sticks at kiosks.

You aren't serious. You don't care. You told us you don't care. Why would I discuss it with you? Why are you even here with your weird ass doomerism?

At the very core of the automation argument lies the simple fact that it is, in the end, poison to a capitalistic system. You're suggesting that every company that can will replace its workers with kiosks (read: some sort of automation). But what happens then? What happens when all the burger flippers, order takers, waiters, cabbies, cashiers, factory workers, and, yes, truck drivers all become automated away? Who can buy the burgers sold by the kiosk and cooked by the automated spatula machine?

It's nonsense. It's buggy whip madness all over again.
 
Actually on the previous page I responded more seriously because I thought maybe you were a serious person but instead of engaging with anything seriously you just devolve into animalistic libertarian grunting and shaking sticks at kiosks.

You aren't serious. You don't care. You told us you don't care. Why would I discuss it with you? Why are you even here with your weird ass doomerism?

At the very core of the automation argument lies the simple fact that it is, in the end, poison to a capitalistic system. You're suggesting that every company that can will replace its workers with kiosks (read: some sort of automation). But what happens then? What happens when all the burger flippers, order takers, waiters, cabbies, cashiers, factory workers, and, yes, truck drivers all become automated away? Who can buy the burgers sold by the kiosk and cooked by the automated spatula machine?

It's nonsense. It's buggy whip madness all over again.

That's not what I said. I said that I'm not on either side of this and I do the best I can with the way this system works.

Who can buy the burgers is irrelevant because that wasn't what my initial comment was about. I said a barista at Starbucks doesn't need a union because it's not a permanent career. The kiosks and apps are proof of this. I remember walking into a McDonald's and seeing 4 cashiers. I don't see any today.

I remember McDonald's pulling their anti-minimum wage hike lobbyists in 2019.. They must've grown a conscious all of a sudden.
 
That's not what I said. I said that I'm not on either side of this and I do the best I can with the way this system works.

Who can buy the burgers is irrelevant because that wasn't what my initial comment was about. I said a barista at Starbucks doesn't need a union because it's not a permanent career. The kiosks and apps are proof of this. I remember walking into a McDonald's and seeing 4 cashiers. I don't see any today.

I remember McDonald's pulling their anti-minimum wage hike lobbyists in 2019.. They must've grown a conscious all of a sudden.
No, that was literally your point in the post I quoted.

Starbucks is a permanent career if people want it to be. It's kind of weird to insist that it isn't, tbh.

Any workers, all workers, should unionize if they want to. Even if it's at a job that they might only work at for a year or two. Working together gives them power. It gives them better work conditions, safety, benefits, better schedules, say in what happens and on and on.
A worker does not have to spend a career or retire at a company to make use of union representation, benefits, or conditions.
 
No, that was literally your point in the post I quoted.

Starbucks is a permanent career if people want it to be. It's kind of weird to insist that it isn't, tbh.

Any workers, all workers, should unionize if they want to. Even if it's at a job that they might only work at for a year or two. Working together gives them power. It gives them better work conditions, safety, benefits, better schedules, say in what happens and on and on.
A worker does not have to spend a career or retire at a company to make use of union representation, benefits, or conditions.

No, it wasn't. My point was that certain positions are becoming obsolete because they are. The push for "power to the workers" in these positions will expedite that because it will.

Continue with the personal attacks and arguing against what you claim I said (that I never said). I see that's all you have+the union rhetoric. No facts or data. Just accusations and personal attacks.
 
Continue with the personal attacks and arguing against what you claim I said (that I never said). I see that's all you have+the union rhetoric. No facts or data. Just accusations and personal attacks.
I have a secret to tell you... come real close so you can hear me...
Just pointing at kiosks and saying, "this will get worse." is, in fact, not data, nor is it facts.
 
I have a secret to tell you... come real close so you can hear me...
Just pointing at kiosks and saying, "this will get worse." is, in fact, not data, nor is it facts.

This is true. But as our union leadership used to tell us in the day. We can not have our heads in the ground. Lets be real. These companies are not going to allow things to become antiquated. We ain't pulling horse and buggy around, as you mention. And in time there will be more job obsolescence. Of course there will. You can say it isn't a fact until it happens all you want. But that's just a bit ridiculous. First it was machine. Now it's machine learning. The future is only a day away.
 

How does your broken brain actually make sense of what you wrote here? Lmao.

Was Biden the guy who ****ed up your McFish, or what? Lol.
Well I like to thank you for proving my point. You article was great at showing the biggest jump in corp profits were under the watchfully eye of democratic presidents Obozo and sippy cup joe. You know the one for the working man
 
Bottom up is the only way to fix it. Unions and community organizing are the single best way to check both corporate power and federal/political power.

Good luck going the other way.
You mean the same federal/political power the union was in bed with back in the day when the fed controlled freight pricing
 
Supermarkets are no different. They have self checkout set up.. One cashier open and 10 self checkout lanes. You get accustomed to doing it yourself because nobody wants to stand on a line for 20 minutes if they don't have to.
I have a secret to tell you... come real close so you can hear me...
Just pointing at kiosks and saying, "this will get worse." is, in fact, not data, nor is it facts.

I remember back in the day when cashiers at grocery stores were union. when you had to type in the price in the resister and know what was taxed and what wasn't, count cash and make change. Now those same stores have 10+ self checkout and 1 or 2 non-union or part time cashiers that just run you stuff over a scanner. Oh and who pay cash at a grocery store any more no cash to count or giving change.
Now add to the fact that you can sit at home click you grocery on a screen pay for them have then delivered or pick them up at these same stores, for no extra charge, that use to have union cashiers. Not just grocery stores almost every store out there will do this for you.
Is that a kiosks???
 
Well I like to thank you for proving my point. You article was great at showing the biggest jump in corp profits were under the watchfully eye of democratic presidents Obozo and sippy cup joe. You know the one for the working man
I didn't share that article. But it's still some potato brain nonsense to be like "LOOK WHO WAS IN OFFICE - **BLERGH**"
 
I remember back in the day when cashiers at grocery stores were union. when you had to type in the price in the resister and know what was taxed and what wasn't, count cash and make change. Now those same stores have 10+ self checkout and 1 or 2 non-union or part time cashiers that just run you stuff over a scanner. Oh and who pay cash at a grocery store any more no cash to count or giving change.
Now add to the fact that you can sit at home click you grocery on a screen pay for them have then delivered or pick them up at these same stores, for no extra charge, that use to have union cashiers. Not just grocery stores almost every store out there will do this for you.
Is that a kiosks???
I refer you to previous talk about buggy whip mania.
 
I guess we can't edit posts past a certain point, but just to clarify the potato brain comment above:

- I'll make a larger argument here rather than just calling you a potato brain.

The reason why this argument is so fundamentally and tragically bad is that it is 100% a correlation/causation issue AND it completely and utterly removes any nuance or, if we are being honest, any sort of basis in reality from the conversation. If a full grown adult is failing to understand the correlation/causation problem and leaving out all nuance and reality of the situation, then how can this be a serious argument?

Presidential terms are one of the most difficult to judge things we have in this regard because the swearing in of a new human doesn't wipe the slate clean. Biden inherited Trumps tax plan, Obama inherited little Bush's, who inherited Big Bush's, who got Reagan, abd so on etc. And this includes basically every policy and issue we have in this country. Not to mention that people in here keep referencing pandemic years as some sort of baseline normality to judge from like that isn't pure rhetorical nonsense. To say "so and so was in office so there" is, I'm sorry to say, just fundamentally a dumb argument. It's never that simple.
 
This might be the most obnoxiously stupid thing I've read today and that's saying something because I read a few paragraphs of Ayn Rand's slop earlier...

You're seriously making this argument? Or are you pulling my leg right now?
Took the words from my mouth … I immediately thought of Rand
 
I guess we can't edit posts past a certain point, but just to clarify the potato brain comment above:

- I'll make a larger argument here rather than just calling you a potato brain.

The reason why this argument is so fundamentally and tragically bad is that it is 100% a correlation/causation issue AND it completely and utterly removes any nuance or, if we are being honest, any sort of basis in reality from the conversation. If a full grown adult is failing to understand the correlation/causation problem and leaving out all nuance and reality of the situation, then how can this be a serious argument?

Presidential terms are one of the most difficult to judge things we have in this regard because the swearing in of a new human doesn't wipe the slate clean. Biden inherited Trumps tax plan, Obama inherited little Bush's, who inherited Big Bush's, who got Reagan, abd so on etc. And this includes basically every policy and issue we have in this country. Not to mention that people in here keep referencing pandemic years as some sort of baseline normality to judge from like that isn't pure rhetorical nonsense. To say "so and so was in office so there" is, I'm sorry to say, just fundamentally a dumb argument. It's never that simple.
These guys disregard the fact that most other economies are feeling the same economic strain in this post the pandemic period .If you listen to them it’s solely in American problem brought on by the current administration. Somehow we’re to believe that If only Trump was in control things would’ve been much different. Lol
 
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This is true. But as our union leadership used to tell us in the day. We can not have our heads in the ground. Lets be real. These companies are not going to allow things to become antiquated. We ain't pulling horse and buggy around, as you mention. And in time there will be more job obsolescence. Of course there will. You can say it isn't a fact until it happens all you want. But that's just a bit ridiculous. First it was machine. Now it's machine learning. The future is only a day away.

That's my point in all of this. Employees at these jobs pushing for more is pointless because it's only a matter of time until the job no longer exists or exists a smaller more meaningless level. That's why I pointed to McDonald's pulling their lobbyists from Washington in 2019. They already have a plan in place and they're executing on it.
 
That's my point in all of this. Employees at these jobs pushing for more is pointless because it's only a matter of time until the job no longer exists or exists a smaller more meaningless level. That's why I pointed to McDonald's pulling their lobbyists from Washington in 2019. They already have a plan in place and they're executing on it.
It actually makes me a little sad to see you just grab your ankles like this and sob out a "Thank you!"
 
Took the words from my mouth … I immediately thought of Rand
Meanwhile unionized SF airport foodservice workers had a 3 day strike, got 29% raise.

They would've been smarter to not bother because GESTURES WILDLY AT A KIOSK
 
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