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XPO | Xpo Union Thread.

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icuicp said:
XFK and XCN had to have Director of Operations ( regional manager ) roll through due to unionization efforts. This is the St. Louis region. XFK is Florence Kentucky and Cincinnati Ohio.

In recent times Cincinnati has had organizing efforts with rallies outside of terminal. Florence has been a dumpster fire for awhile.
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Have heard a lot of rumors. But from unreliable sources. Time will tell.
 
highspeeds said:
And now you are twisting and turning and trying to give scenarios where you could be right. And this is the first step to accepting that everyone else you are arguing with is saying a lot of things right.
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I believe that I said the ONE thing I know is right is that our "successorship" article mandates that whomever purchases this company must accept the contract and the union. This article makes "Burns" irrelevant. "Burns" becomes an issue only when there is no article in the contract to define what happens when a company is bought out.

For the rest of what Fly and others have been posting, I am not an attorney and therefore do not pretend to be able to interpret NLRB rulings and laws that change constantly. You may know that the recent appointments to the labor board have changed the latest rulings to be more favorable to business. So, when I don't know an answer to a particular scenario, I try to find out.

As an example, if Old Dominion purchased XPO, in terminals where there is no union contract, Old D could do whatever they wanted to do. In Miami, they would be forced to accept the Teamsters and the contract in place. I am trying to find out how exactly that would work, but common sense says that they would NEED nearly all the Miami drivers to accommodate the expanding levels of freight now available to them. ( THE FOLLOWING IS MY OPINION )

A rational person could not expect 60 drivers to do the work of 120 drivers. There will certainly be some overlap, but my guess is that most of the current XPO drivers would be brought on board under their current union contract. Should Old D choose to fire all the XPO drivers and proceed to hire replacement drivers, they would be violating the law. Every fired driver would eventually be "made whole" and get their jobs back.
 
Fly-by-night said:
Yes you are correct. In your example of the Ridgewood case they kept the place open and ran it the same way. I saying if someone bought XPO and had a terminal in the same area as say yours could by right they came lay every off at you place and have no need or requirement to hire any of you at there current location. To walk around saying that we are union and untouchable is not 100% correct.[/QU

Let's say, for example, that OD purchased XPO. They already have a terminal in Miami. All of the XPO Miami freight would then be directed to the OD Miami terminal. Do you think that the current OD drivers could handle all the new freight coming in? Of course not! They would be mandated to bring most of the XPO drivers into their barn. A few on the bottom might be laid off due to over lap, but I believe that most of the current XPO drivers in Miami would put on a green uniform and go to work.

Should OD decide to lay off ALL the XPO staff and hire new drivers, that would be a violation of the law. Charges would be filed immediately and all those laid off would eventually be made whole and get their jobs back.
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Hollywoodz said:
I believe that I said the ONE thing I know is right is that our "successorship" article mandates that whomever purchases this company must accept the contract and the union. This article makes "Burns" irrelevant. "Burns" becomes an issue only when there is no article in the contract to define what happens when a company is bought out.

For the rest of what Fly and others have been posting, I am not an attorney and therefore do not pretend to be able to interpret NLRB rulings and laws that change constantly. You may know that the recent appointments to the labor board have changed the latest rulings to be more favorable to business. So, when I don't know an answer to a particular scenario, I try to find out.

As an example, if Old Dominion purchased XPO, in terminals where there is no union contract, Old D could do whatever they wanted to do. In Miami, they would be forced to accept the Teamsters and the contract in place. I am trying to find out how exactly that would work, but common sense says that they would NEED nearly all the Miami drivers to accommodate the expanding levels of freight now available to them. ( THE FOLLOWING IS MY OPINION )

A rational person could not expect 60 drivers to do the work of 120 drivers. There will certainly be some overlap, but my guess is that most of the current XPO drivers would be brought on board under their current union contract. Should Old D choose to fire all the XPO drivers and proceed to hire replacement drivers, they would be violating the law. Every fired driver would eventually be "made whole" and get their jobs back.
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But this all leads back to the bigger topic. Do you think that will actually happen ? And I think the answer is, probably not. You would, and we would, all be very lucky if it did end that way for the XPO LTL - former Con-way.
 
highspeeds said:
And now you are twisting and turning and trying to give scenarios where you could be right. And this is the first step to accepting that everyone else you are arguing with is saying a lot of things right.
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This isn't saying any of us knows any better than the rest. It's saying we are all guessing and hoping for the best. Because the odds are not in our favor at all. North/South or East/West or union/nonunion. We are all dangling in the wind and we know it.
 
icuicp said:
This is a good point.

If XPO Logistics is broken up and separate parts are sold off , what part is left with the enormous debt that's been racked up?

Whichever part of XPO that would be left with the overwhelming debt will most likely be put out of business by that debt.
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He has said in the interviews. That he would use the sale of the business units to increase liquidity in the LTL. Which is the part he intends to keep. So, the answer is.... us. Old Con-way. But hopefully, his book cooking reduces some of that debt load. Hard to say. And we will find out soon enough.
 
highspeeds said:
$5 billion in debt. And he sold all the terminals off. Ours on Jan 2nd. Jacobs goes to the share holders with great numbers and cooked books. But HE KNOWS THE TRUTH. Just saying.
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When you say he's sold all the terminals...do you mean he sold the land/buildings and then leased it back? He's done that with some of the corporate buildings but I hadn't heard about the terminals.

Then again, a lot of the XPO office buildings are just leased floors in public buildings.
 
icuicp said:
If XPO Logistics is broken up and separate parts are sold off , what part is left with the enormous debt that's been racked up?

Whichever part of XPO that would be left with the overwhelming debt will most likely be put out of business by that debt.
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Buyers aren't stupid - they're not going to accept the debt if it comes with the deal. So anything sold off will be sold off debt-free. Spun off to a separate public company may be a different matter but then the public markets will value it accordingly, which will be self-defeating if it's not attractive or is overloaded with debt.

Banks are also not stupid - there are debt covenants, etc. If XPO sells 4/5s of the company, that money will pay off the debt. XPO can't just raise billons, shift the debt to entities that can't pay it, and walk away.

Keep in mind that a chunk of that is Con-way long-term bonds, etc. that pre-date XPO and that is likely tied with LTL until retired or refinanced.
 
survy9 said:
Buyers aren't stupid - they're not going to accept the debt if it comes with the deal. So anything sold off will be sold off debt-free. Spun off to a separate public company may be a different matter but then the public markets will value it accordingly, which will be self-defeating if it's not attractive or is overloaded with debt.

Banks are also not stupid - there are debt covenants, etc. If XPO sells 4/5s of the company, that money will pay off the debt. XPO can't just raise billons, shift the debt to entities that can't pay it, and walk away.

Keep in mind that a chunk of that is Con-way long-term bonds, etc. that pre-date XPO and that is likely tied with LTL until retired or refinanced.
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Excellent points. What company really wants to ‘buy’ debt of that size? And are any of the XPO family of companies worth $5 billion as a stand-alone? I think not. Sounds like B.J. is in a little bit of a financial pickle.
 
survy9 said:
When you say he's sold all the terminals...do you mean he sold the land/buildings and then leased it back? He's done that with some of the corporate buildings but I hadn't heard about the terminals.

Then again, a lot of the XPO office buildings are just leased floors in public buildings.
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Yes. Most big companies lease their buildings. For a variety of reasons. He has done that with the LTL terminals. Shows an influx of cash up front with the purchase price. And then accounting wise. They don't have to claim depreciation or whatever. Also not an accountant. Just a truck driver. Following along.
 
survy9 said:
Buyers aren't stupid - they're not going to accept the debt if it comes with the deal. So anything sold off will be sold off debt-free. Spun off to a separate public company may be a different matter but then the public markets will value it accordingly, which will be self-defeating if it's not attractive or is overloaded with debt.

Banks are also not stupid - there are debt covenants, etc. If XPO sells 4/5s of the company, that money will pay off the debt. XPO can't just raise billons, shift the debt to entities that can't pay it, and walk away.

Keep in mind that a chunk of that is Con-way long-term bonds, etc. that pre-date XPO and that is likely tied with LTL until retired or refinanced.
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Of course buyers aren't stupid. That's why we haven't been sold yet. It's also why XPO stock isn't the $200 a share Jacobs wants it to be.
 
Trucker 206 said:
Excellent points. What company really wants to ‘buy’ debt of that size? And are any of the XPO family of companies worth $5 billion as a stand-alone? I think not. Sounds like B.J. is in a little bit of a financial pickle.
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Maybe not one BU all by itself, but overall I think XPO - LTL > $5bn.
 
highspeeds said:
But this all leads back to the bigger topic. Do you think that will actually happen ? And I think the answer is, probably not. You would, and we would, all be very lucky if it did end that way for the XPO LTL - former Con-way.
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I don't really know if that will actually happen or not. When I say I think it might happen, I base that opinion on the fact that Jacobs has ZERO interest in running the companies he acquires. He buys them, cuts costs to the bone, inflates the stock price by any means necessary and then, sells at a great profit. It's his M.O. over the years. Will he do that again? Maybe...maybe not? I do agree that we would be lucky for it to end that way. I've had just about enough.
 
survy9 said:
Buyers aren't stupid - they're not going to accept the debt if it comes with the deal. So anything sold off will be sold off debt-free. Spun off to a separate public company may be a different matter but then the public markets will value it accordingly, which will be self-defeating if it's not attractive or is overloaded with debt.

Banks are also not stupid - there are debt covenants, etc. If XPO sells 4/5s of the company, that money will pay off the debt. XPO can't just raise billons, shift the debt to entities that can't pay it, and walk away.

Keep in mind that a chunk of that is Con-way long-term bonds, etc. that pre-date XPO and that is likely tied with LTL until retired or refinanced.
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Considering that there are other companies in LTL with very high debt and a very low stock price , we don't have to speculate.

Just look at recent history to see what can and does happen. The biggest difference between XPO and other LTL companies with high debt and low stock price is the economy.

Thankfully the overall economy has been in a ten year+ growth cycle. According to the CEO ( Bradley Jacobs ) the LTL industry experienced a recession in 2019. If a recession of the overall economy were to happen , it stands to reason LTL companies in bad positions financially may not make it.

If tough times do come , there won't be a lot of things that Bradley Jacobs can do to tighten the belt so to speak , because he's already doing those things now. One of the last moves would be a wage cut to the workforce and benefit reduction.

Let's hope the doom and gloom is just gossip and entirely wrong.
 
icuicp said:
Considering that there are other companies in LTL with very high debt and a very low stock price , we don't have to speculate.

Just look at recent history to see what can and does happen. The biggest difference between XPO and other LTL companies with high debt and low stock price is the economy.

Thankfully the overall economy has been in a ten year+ growth cycle. According to the CEO ( Bradley Jacobs ) the LTL industry experienced a recession in 2019. If a recession of the overall economy were to happen , it stands to reason LTL companies in bad positions financially may not make it.

If tough times do come , there won't be a lot of things that Bradley Jacobs can do to tighten the belt so to speak , because he's already doing those things now. One of the last moves would be a wage cut to the workforce and benefit reduction.

Let's hope the doom and gloom is just gossip and entirely wrong.
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Exactly. How's that YRC stock looking ? Jacobs is doing a lot of the same things with this company that those guys are doing. And how many trucking companies folded last year ? And quite a few decent size LTL. A turn in the economic climate would be a vicious reality check.
 
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