If it is not bulk packaging and is for domestic transportation you don't need placards. A tote is bulk packaging and thus requires placards for class 9, reflecting the UN #.
ODFL | HAZ-MAT ISSUES.....
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If it is not bulk packaging and is for domestic transportation you don't need placards. A tote is bulk packaging and thus requires placards for class 9, reflecting the UN #.
I just looked it up. Must have been multiple totes. I never knew how much a single tote would weigh after translating from gallon capacity. I just know when I have them listed on my paper work, and how they feel in my trailer ...
Grumpy O' Man
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Tote capacity is usually around 500 -550 Gal's.Average tote weight in a plastic/ aluminum frame average around 3000 pounds or so.The stainless totes that have paint will weigh a little more for sure.Never seen one tote that was 8000 pounds.Had to be more than one for sure.
Grumpy O' Man
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And that has just changed back couple years ago when they made us get a tanker endorsement.Only Tankers had to have Class 9 Placard.The Product has to be labeled with Class 9 Placard's.But,there was no need to placard trailer's
Grumpy O' Man
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And to clarify my weights.All depends on product.I have had some totes that weight alot less.Just wanted to clarify before someone tries to prove a point.
We haul some class 9 in totes. Bulk is anything over 109 or 119 gallons, not necessarily a tanker. Even empty weighing next to nothing requires UN ID numbers unless the packaging has been purged. We see that also. The totes we get at XPO are usually environmental hazard. Our handheld placard wizard makes lots of errors. Some are input errors at the time of pick up, I try to know the rules, but look things up when not sure. People (supervisor or otherwise) are unreliable at best so as you all have said, it's on you once you are out on the road so it's best to be sure!
Running the Penna Turnpike, we definitely have to be aware of the rules because the PA Turnpike Commission places their own restrictions on what you can or cannot take through the tunnels. In order to understand the Turnpike's rules, you need to understand some basic hazmat rules and definitions, like what bulk packaging means, etc... Unfortunately, some drivers still refuse to educate themselves even though they run the Turnpike.
So, we get all kinds of hazmat. I've pretty much pulled it all, bulk and non-bulk packaging, Table 1 and Table 2 materials. Bulk constitutes more than just anything over 119 gallons, you've also got the rule about the net weight of the container weighing 882 lbs or more. And yes, that rule about a container needing to be washed out is a real pain. It really sucks when you have to take a hazmat route that's over an hour out of route simply because of an empty tote with residue.
And don't forget about that nifty 8820 rule, where you have non-bulk packaging of hazmat with the same UN # that in total weighs 8,820 lbs or more, from the same shipper, with no other freight (hazmat or not) on the trailer. You need UN #s on the outside of that trailer, but it's still not considered 'bulk packaging.' You placard those trailers according to class and also have the UN #.
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I did not know ......net weight of the container weighing 882 lbs or more filled with a solid hazardous material is considered bulk shipment.. ...Thanks I work for Saia and we have the same problems that you all have pertaining to hazmat.
yeah, there are a lot of rules, that's for sure. I try to educate myself but it's tough to know everything. Reading the first 50 pages of that haz mat book we all carry is a good idea. I do know the 8820 rule. That happens when a driver picks up a load of drums, but I take the ID numbers off when I add to the trailer. Never heard of the 882 thing. Is that a Pa thing? The DOT in Ct an Ma are a pain, though the scales I go by are usually closed early morning when I go by them. We do have a couple spots that the DOT hammers trucks on in Ma, if you are placarded there is a chance you'll get pulled over. I'm sure it's the same with you guys, they don't bother us much for inspections, just once in a while to make sure we're paying attention!
No, the 882 lb net weight of a container is a DOT reg, not state specific. It's in your Compliance Pocketbook under the bulk definitions section.
Those totes we carry are 119 to 500 gallons and can weigh upwards of 3500 lbs. Class 9 hazmat is a bit different when it comes to needing placards. No placards are needed for any amount as long as it travels by ground and stays in the country. This includes bulk and tankers. It's a consumer commodity or ORM-D and not considered hazardous to the public.
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True dat!!
Again, get our OD Driver Trainers more involved with Training not just on the road but in-house also. A lot of Driver Trainers want to be involved and enjoy teaching/educating others in aspects of Safety, Inspection, Accident Prevention, Haz-mat, ROI, etc.....
As they say, " SAFETY STARTS AT HOME".
As they say, " SAFETY STARTS AT HOME".
I don't know this, maybe somebody can chime in, but my criticism with training is that it is not consistent among trainers. Do they all have some sort of checklist they can follow?
Not that it was surprising by any means, but I saw a trainer pull in the other day with his trainee in the truck, and hand over a set of bills with a hazmat enforcer still sealed. The trailers were relays and I was waiting on them. I got the paperwork from dispatch right after the driver handed them through the window. So it's just one form of neglect that's being passed on from trainer to trainee, and the cycle continues. Chances are this trainee will probably not bother opening his enforcer and checking the shipping papers once he goes solo unless something happens to him, or somebody takes the time to tell him about it.
Even then, if somebody tells him about it, that doesn't mean he'll understand the gravity of the situation and become responsible with his handling of hazmat - that's on him then.
Yes, there are guide lines and a check sheet that Trainers are suppose to follow.
When I train, I even give them per say things that they need to read in FMCSR, Haz-mat and Drivers Handbook. Have them do the log book and recap (this is checked daily). You ask why recap and not just 34hr restart? Because there are times you can run more than 8 days a week.
Come on Drivers......
Open the envelope with the red bars on it, the Haz-mat tracker is NOT always correct.
Example: a Driver last night got a relay trailer and the Haz-mat tracker showed Flammable 3 only, opened envelope and found 4 IBCs at over 9,000lbs (IBCs are TOTES aka BULK). The pickup Driver signed for TOTES, but the body of the bill said, IBC no bulk words written on BOL. By the way out side of red envelope was had written, " no placards needed" REALLY!
For sure no placards on trailer in yard.
What do you think the fine would be for this mistake if DOT stopped this set going down the road?
Open the envelope with the red bars on it, the Haz-mat tracker is NOT always correct.
Example: a Driver last night got a relay trailer and the Haz-mat tracker showed Flammable 3 only, opened envelope and found 4 IBCs at over 9,000lbs (IBCs are TOTES aka BULK). The pickup Driver signed for TOTES, but the body of the bill said, IBC no bulk words written on BOL. By the way out side of red envelope was had written, " no placards needed" REALLY!
For sure no placards on trailer in yard.
What do you think the fine would be for this mistake if DOT stopped this set going down the road?
That's a bad one there. Most of the mistakes I catch are differences in weight, which sometimes does impact whether the trailer needs placarding or not. But not designating it as bulk even though there are totes is pretty bad.
Seems like a lot of mistakes happen when the enforcer is drawn up. I had a double whammy the other day. Shipping papers used a decimal system instead of commas for weights. The shipper had weights like this: 1.425, 150.367, etc.. Somebody in the office must have been in a hurry and thought the bill had 1,425 lbs of corrosive, instead of about a pound and a half. All you had to do was go to the bottom of the weight column this shipper used on their paperwork and it showed a total of 250 some lbs of the gross weight for all the items being shipped. Pretty simple. So the enforcer had the trailer requiring class 8 placards. The kicker is that the driver showed up, with no placards on the trailer, even though the envelope had required placards for class 8. He totally overlooked it. When I saw the envelope I then opened it up and saw it didn't need placarded anyhow. But this driver 1. overlooked the outside of the envelope which said the trailer needed placards and 2. didn't even open the envelope (yes it was still sealed) to see that he didn't need the placards anyhow.
We could probably update this thread daily with hazmat screw ups.
And the thing that blows my mind is that the company spends so much time with ROI scores and lecturing drivers about that but fails to take action and ask why a hazmat enforcer is still sealed, or worse, staples the freaking paperwork together so as to send a message that these papers don't need examined by the driver at all. Hazmat issues are more important than ROI.
These hazmat issues need to be remedied from the management of each terminal. Corporate and safety should send a message out to the terminal and/or linehaul managers to instruct drivers to examine their paperwork, and it should enforced / monitored. If change isn't initiated and consistently reinforced from the top (management at each terminal), change isn't gonna happen.
These hazmat issues need to be remedied from the management of each terminal. Corporate and safety should send a message out to the terminal and/or linehaul managers to instruct drivers to examine their paperwork, and it should enforced / monitored. If change isn't initiated and consistently reinforced from the top (management at each terminal), change isn't gonna happen.
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