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Yellow | Butch Lewis Committee

albag said:
There is no "snark" in the FACT that for CSPF, there are now 5 retirees to 1 fund contributing worker. I will not dispute that there was mismanagement. But while the employees of YRCW companies are a convenient scapegoats, you seem to forget C-F and Hostess. Yes YRCW is contributing at a reduced rate, but they are still contributing. You don't think the bankruptcies of just those two contributing employers has played a SIGNIFICANT role in reductions in the assets of CSPF? Do some research, before you make irresponsible accusations. UNSUPPORTED by easily accessible facts.
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Also, Fleming Foods bankruptcy in 2003 was the largest food distribution in the USA at the time employed thousands of Teamsters paying into Central States
 
realityofitall said:
no one wants to conduct a complete and accurate audit on the money. what you get is snarky remarks like if there is more going out than coming in you get this. not to mention all the yes voters from yrc, new penn, holland that gave you some of this mess.
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Yes I did say you can’t pay out more than you have coming in. You my friend can’t face reality that the fund is in deep sh.........t. As other post said you need to get your facts straight before you claim snarky remarks, you can’t go through life with a liberal attitude that some else is going to take care of you. That my friend is why our government is so far in debt, social programs.
 
Stick to trucking because your debate skills suck. No tax payer money for private pensions. You are the liberal, sjw, socialist who wants 30 years of debt and then depend on the unions to pay back the money. You refuse to audit the books. See how much money is siphoned from investment fees and high risk stocks and bonds. If you csnt pay the pension now how can you pay it later plus the loans ?
 
realityofitall said:
Stick to trucking because your debate skills suck. No tax payer money for private pensions. You are the liberal, sjw, socialist who wants 30 years of debt and then depend on the unions to pay back the money. You refuse to audit the books. See how much money is siphoned from investment fees and high risk stocks and bonds. If you csnt pay the pension now how can you pay it later plus the loans ?
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What do you expect to achieve with an audit? There is no credible evidence of criminal behavior. Bad investment decisions are not recognized as criminal. Just bad judgement. High brokerage fees? Once again, not CRIMINAL, immoral of course. But not illegal.
The bar to PROVE criminal INTENT is very high. And your dealing with people who are mostly Attorneys. Do you seriously believe that what ever activities occurred, were not scrupulously analyzed for any possible legal liabilities? I'm sorry, but I have to ask. Do you still believe in Santa Claus?
 
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Making high risk investments high fees cronyism is a failure of fidicuary responsibilities. Could be fraud involved and thats criminal. Stop asking for a hand out. Get the truth as to where the money went. Or in your case lets cosign a car loan together so i can default and you xan hold your hand out for a bailout.
 
realityofitall said:
Making high risk investments high fees cronyism is a failure of fidicuary responsibilities. Could be fraud involved and thats criminal. Stop asking for a hand out. Get the truth as to where the money went. Or in your case lets cosign a car loan together so i can default and you xan hold your hand out for a bailout.
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Brother I'm not asking for a "hand out". Quote, "Or in your case let's cosign a car loan together so I can default and you can hold your hand out for a bailout." (I corrected your spelling) How do you equate buying a car on credit, the value of which will deprecate, and a failing pension which should have appreciated? There is a tangible asset that can be sold, in the event of default. But in the interim you will have use of the car.
I will give you some FREE advice, something NO Attorney is going to do. Start a "Go Fund Me" and have your "forensic" audit conducted. FYI, I contributed money to pay to have an INDEPENDENT audit, a couple of years ago. You will need to raise several thousand dollars, because "Pro Bono" is NOT an option, for what you want. In the end, I will be ASTOUNDED if any criminal prosecutions occur.
Congressional hearings have been held regarding failing pension funds, that included CSPF. Do you think that the questions you want answered, were NOT already asked AND ANSWERED? Those committees subpoenaed witnesses as well as any documents, and hired accountants to review those documents. I will reiterate, the actions of the administrators of CSPF may have been unethical, hell they probably were. But they were not criminal, which is why so many good men and women will bear the burden of reduced benefits. Or in some cases, NO retirement benefits at all from the funds that they participated in. Which has already occurred in some smaller funds, whose assets have been taken over by the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation. Every man and woman in that situation has my sympathy. It is a tragic eventuality, but "stamping your feet and pointing your finger" will not alter that fact. This crisis is a slow motion "train wreck", it didn't just pop up 5 years ago! The "writing on the wall" has been evident for 20 years or more. When your house is just a pile of ashes, it's a little late to call the Fire Department.
And when you allege "fiduciary" malfeasance. I really don't think you understand that BY LAW, plan administrators must act in a way that is in the best interest of the fund. NOT the participants. Once again poor decisions when investing are not criminal.
 
The car loan quip is the same as the pension. You agree to work for decades at a company you hope they make the payments the truck looses money just like stocks and bonds but you hope they make smart choices with your money so it keeps the value up like your truck. You care for it you take pride in it. But if someone doesnt make the payments from the start or defaults and keeps the truck thats a break in the promissory note and the truck gets taken like your pension and then you scramble to get the money to get the truck back like you want the tax payers to do who dont work in that pension fund but you want to saddle them with your obligation to pay the note and expect to once again have use of the truck.
In upstate ny there was an audit done and the union wasnt to friendly in handing over the documents. What was found was tens of thousands of dollars in fees high risk low return instruments while the members got a nice 20% deduction in there benefits on top of the yrc shaft job that many on this board voted yes for and will do so again but will bs you with there tough talk here.
I suggest that you see just how bad the tsunami of underwater pension plans there are. Start with calpers and work your way out to the east.
 
albag said:
What do you expect to achieve with an audit? There is no credible evidence of criminal behavior. Bad investment decisions are not recognized as criminal. Just bad judgement. High brokerage fees? Once again, not CRIMINAL, immoral of course. But not illegal.
The bar to PROVE criminal INTENT is very high. And your dealing with people who are mostly Attorneys. Do you seriously believe that what ever activities occurred, were not scrupulously analyzed for any possible legal liabilities? I'm sorry, but I have to ask. Do you still believe in Santa Claus?
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https://www.pionline.com/article/20...ent-costs-in-line-but-funding-still-declining
and
https://www.gao.gov/products/GAO-18-105

:6817:
 
Work forty years for a retirement! The wife and I are really going to enjoy retirement!
Nope the pension will be broke when ya get there!

That’s ok The wife and I will make do with the 1/3 I get from the PBGC together with our little nest egg!
Nope that’s broke too!

Well I still have Social Security and the little nest egg!
Nope that’s going bust too! Probably with perfect timing just like all the other ::shit::!!!

Hey brother can you spare a little change?
 
Bart said:
Work forty years for a retirement! The wife and I are really going to enjoy retirement!
Nope the pension will be broke when ya get there!

That’s ok The wife and I will make do with the 1/3 I get from the PBGC together with our little nest egg!
Nope that’s broke too!

Well I still have Social Security and the little nest egg!
Nope that’s going bust too! Probably with perfect timing just like all the other :::shit:::!!!

Hey brother can you spare a little change?
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History has a way of repeating itself...


Stay tuned!

:hissyfit:
 
realityofitall said:
Stick to trucking because your debate skills suck. No tax payer money for private pensions. You are the liberal, sjw, socialist who wants 30 years of debt and then depend on the unions to pay back the money. You refuse to audit the books. See how much money is siphoned from investment fees and high risk stocks and bonds. If you csnt pay the pension now how can you pay it later plus the loans ?
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Okay you win I am not good at debating. I also have learned that some times certain individuals will never listen to reason, it is always their way.
I am smart enough to know and have invested in the market for years to know that regardless of fees and if there was some poor investments, that the fund would and can not survive with lack of members paying in.Multi Employer
Pensions Plans were set up that current workers would be funding retirees as well as growth of money not paid out(cash flow).
Let me explain if you have a million in a 401k and retire at 62 and you have investments that are earning 3.6 % in dividends annuals you would have 36,000 or 3000 a month to live on.
With me so far?
Now you could draw on that forever and not touch the million.
Still following?
Now you’re million grows a pity 4% a year so now you have 1,040,000 earning 3.6 so now you have 3120 a month.
You following?
Now for some reason you’re expenses go up and you start getting into the principal and after 5 years you are at 700,000 but still earning 3.6 you’re monthly has gone down to 2100 a month.
Still with me?
Now you got your expenses down but still want 3000 a month so you keep pulling down the principal.
Now there are a lot of things i didn’t include in my example, but like I said earlier if you have more going out than coming in to build up the pool of money earning dividends and market growth
Regardless of poor management or investments you can’t have a DEFINED BENEFIT plan that will work unless you allways have a DEFINED amount of money coming in.
My example was 1 person 1 401k stop and think what happens when several thousand more are collecting verses putting in.
I hope my class on investments 101 will help you?
 
Djia is up 7.8% over the last 52 weeks 3.8% just this ytd.
The union is culpable on 2 fronts. Allowing 30 and out at any age, allowing yrc to not pay the full amount into the pension.
Since 2008 djia is up over 8k points. The money was squandered. Keep buying into the union though because they are like oz but there is no yellow brick road.
 
realityofitall said:
Djia is up 7.8% over the last 52 weeks 3.8% just this ytd.
The union is culpable on 2 fronts. Allowing 30 and out at any age, allowing yrc to not pay the full amount into the pension.
Since 2008 djia is up over 8k points. The money was squandered. Keep buying into the union though because they are like oz but there is no yellow brick road.
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Okay you don’t get it. I give up.
 
albag said:
Absolutely disgraceful! There is no excuse for our continued MULTI- BILLION dollar, donations to Zionist Israel.
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The reason is we also pay MUlti-BILLION dollar donations to Hammas so they pay their Terrorists to fire rockets into Israel... Hammas also gives lifetime pensions to the families of ******* bombers who kill Jews.
 
jimmy g said:
The reason is we also pay MUlti-BILLION dollar donations to Hammas so they pay their Terrorists to fire rockets into Israel... Hammas also gives lifetime pensions to the families of ******* bombers who kill Jews.
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Do we give directly to hammas , or does our money find it's way to them thru a third party, U.N. etc. I thought Iran the bad guy paid for the Palestinian lunatics, seems absurd we subsidize them, after we boycott them. Tangled web, for sure.
 
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