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ABF | Days off W/O pay?

There is a provision in our supplement that says if you are out of sick days, and you have a " bona fide" emergency........ say your hot water tank malfunctions.... you may take a day off, and if work is available on Saturday, you may make up your lost day.

Kind of open-ended, but how "bona fide" your emergency is would be up to you, subject to whether the TM thinks you're abusing the language.
 
canaryinthemine said:
There is a provision in our supplement that says if you are out of sick days, and you have a " bona fide" emergency........ say your hot water tank malfunctions.... you may take a day off, and if work is available on Saturday, you may make up your lost day.

Kind of open-ended, but how "bona fide" your emergency is would be up to you, subject to whether the TM thinks you're abusing the language.
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Kind of makes sense. Always some kind of work on Saturday. If the TM is willing to work with the men it would be to his & ABF's advantage to let him make up the lost day, Especially without an Article 46 or verbal paperwork. von.
 
canaryinthemine said:
When this contract first ratified, and within 6 months, they realized they had screwed up with the vacation pay being unilaterally cut,.....especially for new-hires, AB F upper management approached the Union and had asked for a weeks vacation for first year employees only, and the ability for new-hires to take "courtesy/convenience" days off without pay or penalty.

Amazingly, the Union said that must be applied unilaterally for them to accept that........ in other words, senior guys get to take "CC" days off too,...... unpaid and with no penalty, discipline, or warning letter.

Horrified by the potential ramifications of that, the company withdrew their proposal.
And that's where it stands today.

In our terminal, we made it very clear that if you give a new-hire an unpaid day off with no penalty in his first couple years of employment,......... well then every employee from the top on down will then take an unpaid day whenever he felt like it.

OR.......... you could change the contract back and restore the vacation schedule and pro rate vacations for first year employees.

Fat chance they were going to do that, right?

It may seem harsh, but we weren't going to allow the company to make special provisions for new-hires that older employees couldn't have.
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So where does it stand at your terminal, canary? We currently have a new-hire (less than a year on board) who's taken several 'no pay' days off. As of January 1st, he received his 5 sick days, and on April 1st the two personal days, but hasn't used any for those days off. Several years ago when I was hired, I asked the question about unpaid days off and was told it couldn't be done if I had sick days or personal days to use. Do I have a legitimate grievance if I schedule one and get told 'no'?
 
Trucker 206 said:
So where does it stand at your terminal, canary? We currently have a new-hire (less than a year on board) who's taken several 'no pay' days off. As of January 1st, he received his 5 sick days, and on April 1st the two personal days, but hasn't used any for those days off. Several years ago when I was hired, I asked the question about unpaid days off and was told it couldn't be done if I had sick days or personal days to use. Do I have a legitimate grievance if I schedule one and get told 'no'?
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Yes you do, Brother. The contract must be applied unilaterally and without prejudice, regardless of your seniority.

A "benefit " granted by the company to one, MUST be available to all. You all pay the same amount of Union dues, proportionally, for the same amount of representation. And,.... seniority is not rank. If the shoe was on the other foot ,so to speak, and senior men were taking unpaid time off, don't you think that a junior man would eventually file Labor charges for non-representation if the Union backed up the company and denied him the right to unpaid time off?
 
Trucker 206 said:
Do I have a legitimate grievance if I schedule one and get told 'no'?
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canaryinthemine said:
The contract must be applied unilaterally and without prejudice, regardless of your seniority.
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Absolutely and it would be interesting to see what the 'union' has to say about it. Anytime I bring up something like this I get told that I'm wrong for thinking that someone else should be denied a benefit because I can't get it.

At the same time that you file the grievance you should file an unfair labor practice with the NLRB. They'll call you in to whatever their 'local' office is out there and take a report. Then they'll tell you that you have to run through the grievance procedure before they'll hear the case. However, I do believe that the union only has 30 days to address the matter and we all know that that won't be done.
 
canaryinthemine said:
Yes you do, Brother. The contract must be applied unilaterally and without prejudice, regardless of your seniority.

A "benefit " granted by the company to one, MUST be available to all. You all pay the same amount of Union dues, proportionally, for the same amount of representation. And,.... seniority is not rank. If the shoe was on the other foot ,so to speak, and senior men were taking unpaid time off, don't you think that a junior man would eventually file Labor charges for non-representation if the Union backed up the company and denied him the right to unpaid time off?
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All good points, canary. What I failed to take into account is that these 'no pay' days might be part of an FMLA thing for him. I, personally, would feel uncomfortable asking him if that were the case, as it's not my place to ask such a question.
 
ABFer said:
Absolutely and it would be interesting to see what the 'union' has to say about it. Anytime I bring up something like this I get told that I'm wrong for thinking that someone else should be denied a benefit because I can't get it.

At the same time that you file the grievance you should file an unfair labor practice with the NLRB. They'll call you in to whatever their 'local' office is out there and take a report. Then they'll tell you that you have to run through the grievance procedure before they'll hear the case. However, I do believe that the union only has 30 days to address the matter and we all know that that won't be done.
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But, if the member has filed a unfair labor practice with the NLRB, doesn't that put more pressure on the union to hear the grievance in a timely manner? If he files with the Local & the NLRB @ the same time doesn't that put pressure on the union to a hold more fair hearing or maybe the outcome versus not filing with the NLRB might be different? von.
 
Trucker 206 said:
All good points, canary. What I failed to take into account is that these 'no pay' days might be part of an FMLA thing for him. I, personally, would feel uncomfortable asking him if that were the case, as it's not my place to ask such a question.
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Then file and let the company do some 'splainin'.
 
Trucker 206 said:
All good points, canary. What I failed to take into account is that these 'no pay' days might be part of an FMLA thing for him. I, personally, would feel uncomfortable asking him if that were the case, as it's not my place to ask such a question.
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10-4, Brother,.......But even if it's an FMLA thing,....then it should be questioned and verified,.....if for nothing else, as a teaching moment for all the other employees. Someone else may see a use for FMLA leave that he was not aware of before you raised the inquiry.

And, of course, there is no need to get into a HIPPA Act violation merely to confirm an employees' use of FMLA time.......
 
canaryinthemine said:
10-4, Brother,.......But even if it's an FMLA thing,....then it should be questioned and verified,.....if for nothing else, as a teaching moment for all the other employees. Someone else may see a use for FMLA leave that he was not aware of before you raised the inquiry.

And, of course, there is no need to get into a HIPPA Act violation merely to confirm an employees' use of FMLA time.......
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Interesting though...I remember an injury I had about three years ago. I had to apply for FMLA only AFTER I'd used up my sick days first according to our HR person.
 
Trucker 206 said:
Interesting though...I remember an injury I had about three years ago. I had to apply for FMLA only AFTER I'd used up my sick days first according to our HR person.
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I think that's right..... technically that's what sick days are for.
But,..... if you read it carefully, only UNSCHEDULED vacation days/weeks can be used before FMLA. If it's scheduled , it can't be used.
 
Trucker 206 said:
Interesting though...I remember an injury I had about three years ago. I had to apply for FMLA only AFTER I'd used up my sick days first according to our HR person.
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No, that is not right but FMLA language states that the company can make you use personal time off (PTO) as part of your FMLA time. I do not know what it says about scheduled vs non scheduled time though. Furthermore, I do believe that you need to apply for FMLA time before you even go off, not start it after you've been out.
 
ABFer said:
No, that is not right but FMLA language states that the company can make you use personal time off (PTO) as part of your FMLA time. I do not know what it says about scheduled vs non scheduled time though. Furthermore, I do believe that you need to apply for FMLA time before you even go off, not start it after you've been out.
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True, ABFer. Having FMLA in place before you need it is recommended. If VACATION days AND personal days are pre-scheduled, then they can't ding you one of those days. Using sick leave is optional, providing you have notified HR that you're using an FMLA day instead of a sick day.
 
canaryinthemine said:
I think that's right..... technically that's what sick days are for.
But,..... if you read it carefully, only UNSCHEDULED vacation days/weeks can be used before FMLA. If it's scheduled , it can't be used.
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You are dead on. Scheduled can not be used. Anybody say different they have no idea what they are talking about. I know it for a fact. I lived it @ 050.
 
Yes, we had a couple of guys on FMLA and we went round and round with management on their........ interpretation........

They can not force you to use scheduled vacation in lieu of, or before, FMLA.
 
canaryinthemine said:
There is a provision in our supplement that says if you are out of sick days, and you have a " bona fide" emergency........ say your hot water tank malfunctions.... you may take a day off, and if work is available on Saturday, you may make up your lost day.

Kind of open-ended, but how "bona fide" your emergency is would be up to you, subject to whether the TM thinks you're abusing the language.
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Show them a 300 dollar plumber bill. Cost you more to get your pipes fixed than a doctor visit. von.
 
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