Yellow | Multiemployer Pension Reform Act of 2014

[Canadian Flyer]

That is quite by design.... If they can portray Retirees as young well off greedy elitists who spend all day on the Golf course, they know that the general public will believe that is how all retired people live and will not feel any sympathy towards joining them in supporting the protections deserved by Seniors who have earned their retirement...

They should be showing the ones who are older..with health problems or other hardships that can't afford to be golfing....who are just getting by and would be devastated by that large of a cut, especially all in one fell swoop, nonetheless... But then again, that would be counter productive to what their goal is....
For probably the majority, a 30 to 60 percent cut will create far more difficulty than just not being able to play golf...

We are just being played against each other.... Those still working against those who have fulfilled their obligations and Retired... Your right Jimmy, it's a no-win situation for any of us..... Each group, the still working and already retired, have valid points about the situation and I can see and understand them both.... In the end game we all will take a loss....it's the way the system is designed for the average "Joe" in America today... The only "option" is we all have to keep moving ahead with the stream of time....no choice in that....but we will all just have to find ways to adapt to fit the new reality of what lies ahead......

As someone who couldn't be much further away from what you guys are talking about, it still makes me sad that promises made to you all are being broken. It truly is guys who complain that a rich lifestyle won't be as rich that make the unions look less enticing to others out there. And I speak as someone who could have chosen to be a Teamster and deliberately picked a non-union carrier (Reimer vs. FedEx).

Most union guys just want to work for what they signed up for, and I have a lot of respect for anyone who puts in their time, union or not. Nobody who works as hard as truck drivers do should be told that what they've been working towards for decades will be taken away from them because a bunch of tall foreheads are always trying to find new and inventive ways to screw people out of their money.

As ESP has said, it's no fault of the orphans that they were left as orphans. And it's likewise no fault of the young man hoping for a better future that his pension will be gone by the time he's ready to retire. There are no winners here...greed on the part of a few brings about suffering on the part of many, regardless of the amount of time that's passed. You all deserve what you've been promised...nobody should've put the CSPF in the position it's in to begin with.

Keep on truckin', fellow freightmen of today and years gone by. I hope that something can fix what's been done to you.

 

[pilot87]

Here's where a lot of it goes EVERY year...

Are The "Administrative Expenses" Too High At The Central States Pension Fund?

According to the 2013 (for the 2012 year) 5500 Report to the IRS, Central States paid out $901,215 in "Professional Fees, $44,344,901 in "Investment Advisory and Management Fees", for a total of $78,987,497 in "Administrative Expenses"!

These firms were listed as being paid compensation for "Investment Services"...

The Northern Trust Co of CT-$5,062,220
LSV Asset Management-$3,745,888
William Blair & Co LLC-$2,485,287
The Bank Of New York Mellon-$2,297,674
Wellington Management Co LLP-$2,196,458
Pzena Investment Management-$2,148,742
Cramer Rosenthal McGlynn, LLC-$1,975,698
Institutional Capital LLC-$1,767,596
Oaktree Capital Management, LP-$1,608,071
Pacific Investment Management Co-$1,459,470
Genesis Asset Managers-$1,397,780
Cohen & Steers Capital Management-$1,258,005
TCW Asset Management Co-$1,160,232
W R Huff Asset Management Co, LLC-$1,157,482
Westfield Capital Management Co-$1,153,030
State Street Global Advisors-$1,113,286
Columbus Circle Investors-$1,067,062
BNYM Cash Investment Strategies-$1,060,836
Turner Investments-$1,044,552
Triology Global Advisors, LP-$975,970
Causeway Capital Management, LLC-$962,101
Ballie Gifford Overseas LTD-$935,921
Stone Harbor Investment Services-$928,581
Donald Smith & Co Inc.-$886,317
Jennison Associates LLC-$764,449
Denver Investments-$761,390
Thornburg Investment Management Inc-$697,086
Artio Global Management LLC-$632,387
Tradewinds Global Investors, LLC-$569,120
Riverbridge Partners-$541,620
Cardinal Capital Management-$515,867
Delaware Investment Advisers-$469,401
Mellon Capital Management Corp-$397,517
UBS Global Asset Management (Americas)-$395,345

With all that "expertise" CSPF should bursting at the seams with cash!

 

[jimmy g]

That is quite by design.... If they can portray Retirees as young well off greedy elitists who spend all day on the Golf course, they know that the general public will believe that is how all retired people live and will not feel any sympathy towards joining them in supporting the protections deserved by Seniors who have earned their retirement...

They should be showing the ones who are older..with health problems or other hardships that can't afford to be golfing....who are just getting by and would be devastated by that large of a cut, especially all in one fell swoop, nonetheless... But then again, that would be counter productive to what their goal is....
For probably the majority, a 30 to 60 percent cut will create far more difficulty than just not being able to play golf...

We are just being played against each other.... Those still working against those who have fulfilled their obligations and Retired... Your right Jimmy, it's a no-win situation for any of us..... Each group, the still working and already retired, have valid points about the situation and I can see and understand them both.... In the end game we all will take a loss....it's the way the system is designed for the average "Joe" in America today... The only "option" is we all have to keep moving ahead with the stream of time....no choice in that....but we will all just have to find ways to adapt to fit the new reality of what lies ahead......

Here we go again...

The was no plot by the media to present retired as rich and entitled. Those guys presented themselves to the media. Letters to media and to Senators are posted on this forum that were a public relation disaster. They didn't say they would have to cut back groceries, they talked of being forced to cut back on golf. They didn't beg humbly to have it reconsidered. They demanded that they were entitled. Teamsters were our own worst enemy....

 

[pilot87]

Here we go again...

The was no plot by the media to present retired as rich and entitled. Those guys presented themselves to the media.

Ok..here is why I made the statement I did regarding the media..... It is a fact that Companys are very anti-Union..they will dedicate any resources they feel necessary to undermine "organized" labor.... The media in this Country is wholly owned and controlled by Large Corporations and Large Corporations are largely anti-Union.... There is a definite bias in the Corporate media against Unions...sometimes subtle....sometimes not....and as a result the Anti-Union sentiment is growing and the the numbers of Union membership is declining..
So whether or not the media sought out such individuals, or they "presented themselves" to the media is not entirely germane to the central issue.... which is that those are the type of people that they, the media, gives air time to because it fuels the anti-Union sentiment more... Corporations do not want to allow any positive information regarding what Unions have done for this Country to get any "play" if they can help it.......They just want to re-enforce the negative image that more and more people have today and what better way than to give air time to retired 50 somethings crying about having to give up, or cut back, on golf.....

Letters to media and to Senators are posted on this forum that were a public relation disaster. They didn't say they would have to cut back groceries, they talked of being forced to cut back on golf.

Yes, there were letters and comments on here that probably weren't the best written...But then again this forum doesn't have the same impact as a major corporate media outlet has either...

They didn't beg humbly to have it reconsidered. They demanded that they were entitled.

I understand the old adage, " You can catch more flies with honey than vinegar", however to suggest that people that have worked hard for decades to fulfill their obligations should have to "humbly beg" to get, or keep, what they have earned isn't right either.... If the retirees were involved in a "negotiation" to try and solve the issue, or even at the least, to "reconsider" undoing an already done action, taking a humble approach might be worth trying....but that was not the case...there were no negotiations and even worse, they didn't even tell the retirees....they tried to keep it as much a "secret" as they could.... So yes they have a right to be angry....and Yes they have a right to demand...... Will it do any good??... probably not.... will begging "humbly" do any good?...again...probably not....

Teamsters were our own worst enemy....

Sometimes this is very true!

 

[jimmy g]

P, the average person reading those letters would be led to believe we deserved all kinds of cuts. The letters work against us.

And you certainly are bitter towards business. The large corporation I work for actually Invited the union to represent us....

 

[pilot87]

P, the average person reading those letters would be led to believe we deserved all kinds of cuts. The letters work against us.

Yes...that's exactly why those types of letters or those types of people are the ones that get the attention....because it works against us.... Exactly my point...

And you certainly are bitter towards business. The large corporation I work for actually Invited the union to represent us....

Bitter towards business? ... Not hardly... Consumers rely on Businesses and Businesses, likewise, rely on consumers....What I have a problem with is the Huge Multinational Corporations that use their profits to buy politicians with the goal of enriching a few at the top, while they pay the workers as low as they can...which is why they are, by and large, anti-Union..
Your Company is the exception rather than the rule.... I'm glad that your fortunate enough to be working for such an exception.....

 

[jimmy g]

Like I said, you're bitter towards biz (corporations). Its in more than half your posts....

 

[pilot87]

Like I said, you're bitter towards biz (corporations). Its in more than half your posts....

Well, your entitled to your opinion.... All my posts are out there for everyone to read and they can arrive at their own conclusions, just as you have done. I find it rather unfortunate that your unwilling to see the demarcation between being "Bitter towards Business" and disapproving of some of the actions and behavior of Corporations such as I explained in my previous post.... As I said, if that's your opinion, and that's all you got out of my post..fine...you just go with that.... It doesn't change the Fact....

 

[jimmy g]

. It doesn't change the Fact....

It isn't a fact at all. Its your Opinion, that you Call a fact....

 

[ESP]

Well, your entitled to your opinion.... All my posts are out there for everyone to read and they can arrive at their own conclusions, just as you have done. I find it rather unfortunate that your unwilling to see the demarcation between being "Bitter towards Business" and disapproving of some of the actions and behavior of Corporations such as I explained in my previous post.... As I said, if that's your opinion, and that's all you got out of my post..fine...you just go with that.... It doesn't change the Fact....

Calm down guys Jimmy g, is just being a devils advocate. Jimmy g, will not like his cut either. I still believe I am entitled to my full pension, because I paid into it with all expectations I would have it to live on. Damned if I ain't wrong. All three of us are really blessed, look around and see the others who have lost all of their pensions, vets living on the streets and people missing limbs. Hell, I have no problems.

 

[pilot87]

It isn't a fact at all. Its your Opinion, that you Call a fact....

Here is what I said, once again. "Huge Multinational Corporations that use their profits to buy politicians with the goal of enriching a few at the top, while they pay the workers as low as they can...which is why they are, by and large, anti-Union.."

That is a fact....not an opinion....

 

[pilot87]

Calm down guys Jimmy g, is just being a devils advocate. Jimmy g, will not like his cut either. I still believe I am entitled to my full pension, because I paid into it with all expectations I would have it to live on. Damned if I ain't wrong. All three of us are really blessed, look around and see the others who have lost all of their pensions, vets living on the streets and people missing limbs. Hell, I have no problems.

Ok ESP... I'm calm... Thanks!.. Indeed we are blessed in many ways and there are others that have so much less..... As I travel in Latin America I see this reality first hand....

 

[jimmy g]

Here is what I said, once again. "Huge Multinational Corporations that use their profits to buy politicians with the goal of enriching a few at the top, while they pay the workers as low as they can...which is why they are, by and large, anti-Union.."

That is a fact....not an opinion....

If you had added 'SOME', it would be a fact. You didn't. You appeared to represent that corporations are bad, and they aren't. So its Opinion. Who defines whats good, or bad? Any more than some unions are great, some are bad. Like if someone came on here and misrepresentated in a post: Teamsters as stupid. SOME are, Most are not. (And i am one) Such would be someone's opinion and Not a fact.

(Warning- opinion coming) You are a left of center guy. Poll after poll shows the USA as slightly right of center. The media represents (and they admit it) a left of center push, political opinion. So why would the media purposely pick stories that make teamsters look bad???

P, this is an Opinion Board. 90% of things represented on these boards are Opinions. Even most presented as facts. Especially yours.

 

[jimmy g]

P, I return to our disagreement. You go after corporations for donating to (in your opinion) 'things that go against workers'. There are Verifiable Facts showing that corporate combined with union , personal and PAC donations are 6 times GREATER to left-leaning organizations than right-leaning. I listed the link on that other site... I think you get your biases wrong...

 

[pilot87]

If you had added 'SOME', it would be a fact. You didn't. You appeared to represent that corporations are bad, and they aren't. So its Opinion.

Ok... One last time... Here is what I said...."Huge Multinational Corporations that use their profits to buy politicians with the goal of enriching a few at the top, while they pay the workers as low as they can...which is why they are, by and large, anti-Union.."

Take special notice of the word "THAT"... It refers to those Corporations THAT engage in the activities and behaviors that I described....it doesn't mean "all".... only those THAT do..

I know your smart enough to know the meaning of what I said.... You appear to have a desperate need to prove me wrong about everything I post....no matter how innocuous it may be... Take notice of the word "appear"..... I'm not saying you actually do....I'm saying it "appears" to me like you do....yes..Opinion...... Ok..enough said on this...I'm not going to go any further....

 

[pilot87]

P, I return to our disagreement.

JImmy, We just "cleared the air", so to speak, from the last time we ventured down this path.....and I am not going to return to that disagreement....It would be pointless and serve no purpose at this juncture.... I disagree with your claim for the same reasons as I tried to impart to you in another thread.... Anyone can go back and read the posts and come to their own conclusions..

So, How much snow did you get up in your part of the world Jimmy? I have a daughter that resides in Chicago and she said they had nearly 20 inches in some locals... I haven't heard what the official tally was... but in any case, it was a lot.
Be safe out there!...

 

[jimmy g]

Ok... One last time... Here is what I said...."Huge Multinational Corporations that use their profits to buy politicians with the goal of enriching a few at the top, while they pay the workers as low as they can...which is why they are, by and large, anti-Union.."

Take special notice of the word "THAT"... It refers to those Corporations THAT engage in the activities and behaviors that I described....it doesn't mean "all".... only those THAT do..

I know your smart enough to know the meaning of what I said.... You appear to have a desperate need to prove me wrong about everything I post....no matter how innocuous it may be... Take notice of the word "appear"..... I'm not saying you actually do....I'm saying it "appears" to me like you do....yes..Opinion...... Ok..enough said on this...I'm not going to go any further....

So now you can interpret their motives???!

I don't have to be desperate to prove you wrong. You're doing a fine job on your own...

 

[Snark Monkey]

Watch this movie whenever you're feeling down about our Union and the power of the company.

 

[jimmy g]

JImmy, We just "cleared the air", so to speak, from the last time we ventured down this path.....and I am not going to return to that disagreement....It would be pointless and serve no purpose at this juncture.... I disagree with your claim for the same reasons as I tried to impart to you in another thread.... Anyone can go back and read the posts and come to their own conclusions..

So, How much snow did you get up in your part of the world Jimmy? I have a daughter that resides in Chicago and she said they had nearly 20 inches in some locals... I haven't heard what the official tally was... but in any case, it was a lot.
Be safe out there!...

For ' not going into it further', it was the very next post!!!!

My buddy abag said he got 22". Up Northern Indiana. My house got 2" in Indy area. I'm in Wyoming, bare here...

 

[Elwood]

I am aware of companies that have chosen to unionize in order to better provide for their employees.
One company

For ' not going into it further', it was the very next post!!!!

My buddy abag said he got 22". Up Northern Indiana. My house got 2" in Indy area. I'm in Wyoming, bare here...

"Balmy" even! (WY that is)