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Yellow | Why isn't bankruptcy an option?

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teamster02

TB Lurker
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Why isn't bankruptcy an option to restructure, while keeping creditors at bay? Please don't tell me it will ruin our brand image, thats nonsense. Some that have include United Airlines, Chrysler, Lehman Brothers, Trump Casino, Washington Mutual, JB Hunt, Tribune Co., and the list goes on. If they truely have a plan that will work, they will come out of it. At the very least, it would buy them some time. I thinks it's BS they are basically saying "give us concessions or we close".
 
teamster02 said:
I thinks it's BS they are basically saying "give us concessions or we close".
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We all can think that all week long if we like to: Doesn't change that it appears to be true. The only option we seem to have is to approve the negotiated deal, or face closure.
 
jimmy g said:
We all can think that all week long if we like to: Doesn't change that it appears to be true. The only option we seem to have is to approve the negotiated deal, or face closure.
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You didn't answer my original question. Why not bankruptcy? They could file it today if they wanted to.
 
Because they can't give themselves performance bonuses if they are in bankruptcy:nutkick:If you read the letter from Zollars to the non-union personal they could start in the third Quarter of 2009.:popcorn:A few months earlier than what they want to give us:popcorn:2013:popcorn:
 
teamster02 said:
You didn't answer my original question. Why not bankruptcy? They could file it today if they wanted to.
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And you really want them to? I've gotten bounced checks from LTL Companies before.

Also, I believe that would in effect end our contract?????

Probably end the pensions, maybe even one of our divisions.

So, do you REALLY want bankruptcy? Why would you rather them do that then the 10% reduction?
 
jimmy g said:
Also, I believe that would in effect end our contract?????

Probably end the pensions, maybe even one of our divisions.

So, do you REALLY want bankruptcy? Why would you rather them do that then the 10% reduction?
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Plese cite your facts for making those statements. Or are you making stuff up again?
 
teamster02 said:
Plese cite your facts for making those statements. Or are you making stuff up again?
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Again? The one appearing to be making most of the stuff up on here seems to be you, my friend. Who's the one that seems to be clouding the only issue?

I'm not a bankruptcy expert. I was only wondering. It would appear that those in the past that sought that protection found ways out of the contracts thru the courts. Didn't American Airlines and Eastern Airlines do that?
 
teamster02 said:
Why isn't bankruptcy an option to restructure, while keeping creditors at bay? Please don't tell me it will ruin our brand image, thats nonsense. Some that have include United Airlines, Chrysler, Lehman Brothers, Trump Casino, Washington Mutual, JB Hunt, Tribune Co., and the list goes on. If they truely have a plan that will work, they will come out of it. At the very least, it would buy them some time. I thinks it's BS they are basically saying "give us concessions or we close".
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Think it would depend on what they file I think chapter 11 is reorgiznation which would mean that they could tear up all the present union contracts and bargain new ones and in this economy we would end up losing a lot more than 10% I think 13 is closing the doors not sure if there is a chapter 7 or not,got a feeling that it is going to be 10%.
 
No 7 11 13

Chapter 13 bankruptcy is not usually available to businesses
Chapter 7 is used for total liquidation of assets

Chapter 11 most generally used for business, is a reorganization plan and negates all contracts with suppliers, customers, creditors and labor. These contracts are then reimposed by bankruptcy court as to usual and customary agreements. In other words the court decides the reallocation of funds and the wages and payments to creditors.

I DO NOT want my wages and benefits determined by some anti-union judge in a black robe.

When is the last time we've seen a labor friendly ruling come from the court system?
 
This deal was agreed to quickly. It is bad times, but the economy will recover again and probably before 2013. I will gladly give 10% to help, but when it does turn around all bets are off. At this point yrc has many on lay offs and only working them 2 days. So there is a big savings in h&w. Now the freight is sitting on the docks or in the yard past service dates because they do not want anyone over the 2 days. If the company was serious about being a freight company i could vote yes, but at this time it will be no. Also the warrants will only be pipe dream only. The only ones to benifit from this will be the union. The trustees, i am sure, will not work for free, and where is the admin fees going to come from?
 
teamster02 said:
Why isn't bankruptcy an option to restructure, while keeping creditors at bay? Please don't tell me it will ruin our brand image, thats nonsense. Some that have include United Airlines, Chrysler, Lehman Brothers, Trump Casino, Washington Mutual, JB Hunt, Tribune Co., and the list goes on. If they truely have a plan that will work, they will come out of it. At the very least, it would buy them some time. I thinks it's BS they are basically saying "give us concessions or we close".
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I shouldn't say I'm suprised, but damn I'm amazed at how ignorant some people are around here. You just don't get it.

A Chapter 11 VOIDS all contracts and Chapter 7 is asset liquidation. Come one genius tell us why those would be good options.
 
When in bankruptcy, you do not get to pick and choose who get what money. So our contract would be out the window as well as our pension fund and the $4-$6 billion they owe Central States. All of our retired brothers that make our positions (jobs)
possible, would see a drop monthly retirement pay of over 2/3rds. a month.

Sure they could bk tomorrow but, with their credit rating and the tight credit market
who would loan them a single dollar bill!!!

We currently hold our retired brothers, our as well as the company's future in our hands. How in God's name could you even think of "shutting 'er down"? Ive not got
stomach of looking a retired teamster in the eyes and saying "you have to go back to work cause I was to greedy to give 10% to possibly save the company.

Gary
Local 745
 
gerber baby said:
When in bankruptcy, you do not get to pick and choose who get what money. So our contract would be out the window as well as our pension fund and the $4-$6 billion they owe Central States. All of our retired brothers that make our positions (jobs)
possible, would see a drop monthly retirement pay of over 2/3rds. a month.

Sure they could bk tomorrow but, with their credit rating and the tight credit market
who would loan them a single dollar bill!!!

We currently hold our retired brothers, our as well as the company's future in our hands. How in God's name could you even think of "shutting 'er down"? Ive not got
stomach of looking a retired teamster in the eyes and saying "you have to go back to work cause I was to greedy to give 10% to possibly save the company.

Gary
Local 745
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Gary,

How dare you present facts and logic to Teamster02 and the others like him. You obviously don't know who you are dealing with. It's makes perfect sense to vote No and shut the doors. Then we can all be out of a job and all the retired folks will need a new job after they get 2/3 of their pension taken away. But at least we would be sticking it to the company.

Your post was right on Gary and couldn't have been said better. People like the author of this thread have no idea about anything and are the same people who aren't happy unless they are complaining about nothing. Screw them. This concession will be passed because too many of us know exactly what is going on and know what will happen if we do nothing.
 
Because they would be breaking the covenants with the banks and they will foreclose on everything!

"With less risk of violating the (debt) covenant and a meaningful downward adjustment to its structural costs with the 10 percent wage concession, our sense is that the risk of bankruptcy in 1H09 (first half of 2009) is meaningfully less than it was two weeks ago,".....due to the employees voting on a 10% wage reduction.......KK
 
Keep The Doors Open!

gerber baby said:
When in bankruptcy, you do not get to pick and choose who get what money. So our contract would be out the window as well as our pension fund and the $4-$6 billion they owe Central States. All of our retired brothers that make our positions (jobs)
possible, would see a drop monthly retirement pay of over 2/3rds. a month.

Sure they could bk tomorrow but, with their credit rating and the tight credit market
who would loan them a single dollar bill!!!

We currently hold our retired brothers, our as well as the company's future in our hands. How in God's name could you even think of "shutting 'er down"? Ive not got
stomach of looking a retired teamster in the eyes and saying "you have to go back to work cause I was to greedy to give 10% to possibly save the company.

Gary
Local 745
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Amen to you Gary! Unless Congress comes up with some new legislation protecting the retirees and some of us getting ready to retire soon, we are doomed! Let's keep the doors open and keep our customers happy! Let's show our customers we're here to stay!:TR10driving03:
 
teamster02 said:
You didn't answer my original question. Why not bankruptcy? They could file it today if they wanted to.
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to you, and all the countless other ignorant idiots on these boards......grow up and get educated on the FACTS before you all spew stupid comments like "let em' shut the gates", "go ahead and file for bancruptcy", "let's stick it to em" who will you be hurting? yourself, your co-workers, your fellow brothers and sisters, your families, those who are already retired, your community, and on and on and on.....grow up and get a clue....THE WHOLE COUNTRY IS CRUMBLING right now....if you all think it's better out there and jobs are plentiful, THEN RESIGN.... do everyone a favor, enough of the doom and gloom, and we're done anyway crap.....it's in God's hands now, may he guide us and bless us, and show us the way through all this......AMEN.....g
 
Great post G-Man, we work with alot of STUPID PEOPLE. Like you said resign and go try to find a job with the pay even after the 10% and bennies like we have. If someone finds it let me know. Let these STUPID PEOPLE go home and tell their wife and kids that dad voted no to giving back 10% of his pay.Now we have to move out of our house, sell the new car, get rid of the boat, stop doing anything that costs money, and oh yeah kids do not get sick or hurt because dad has no health insurance anymore.

Better yet that pension is gone, and you SMART poeple really showed them. I guess you could always go to work at JB HUNT or Werner, they seem to hire alot of "SMART" people.

Also one other job that is recession proof, they might have a job down at the local TRUCK STOP, being a DOOR KNOCKER.:eck13: Some people just seem to be smarter than others?

To all the STUPID PEOPLE how did you get so "SMART".:tongue0002::eck15::puke:

Please all the "SMART" people tell me how I am wrong, and what is your BIG PLAN, when you vote to shut it down. Where are you going to work with your brother in law who does landscaping or something like that. Sure hope he pays bennies, vaction, sick days, personals. Then again you will get all the free stone and landscaping ties you can feed your family with. WAY TO GO STUPID! GET EDUCATED WITH WHAT IS GOING ON PASS THE DOOR OF YOUR MOBILE HOME.
 
This concession will pass OVERWHELMINGLY! All you have to do is go out in the parking lot and see all the new cars and trucks, listen to people talk about their boats and Harleys, etc... Our brothers and sisters are in the same position as this and many other companies, local municipalities, and the majority of housholds in this great country. WE are strapped to the hilt with DEBT. We run our mouths about not taking any s--t from the company, yet we have put ourselves in the position to take nothing but that. We face the same crisis as YRCW and they know it!
 
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