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ABF | ABF-Teamsters Contract Negotiations Update 4-19-13

nothumbleenough said:
Ever stop to think how much Judy and her fellow management team has lost in their own personal wealth since the company stock used to trade above 45 dollars in value. Five years ago that many shares would have been valued well over 3,000,000. Today those are worth about 750,000. That's a loss in value over 2,250,000 to her alone. Earnings manipulation almost always exaggerates earnings to increase the stock price. I would ask you cite publicly traded companies guilty of this type of reverse stock manipulation.

BTW, ABF did show a different number in its company propaganda(230 million) for the last five years than it publicly reported as a loss. About 160 million.
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You Sir are right on the number of the lost that was reported by ABF. I was just trying to show that they are exaggerated the lost to try and gain concessions and it has only been in press releases.
 
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truxforever said:
That is it more bull****, when you can't answer the question. I know they didn't lie on the SEC reports because it is not a 230 million lost. I have ask on ask the president (Roy), inforoundtable and keepontruckin and they can't answer the question either. Why is that Stoney if you had lost 230 million I bet you could tell where and how could you not? Now where in the shareholder reports do they claim a 230 mill lost can you prove that. I know the answer, No because they never claimed a 230 mill lost to the shareholders, you can find that report on the ABC homepage. Now why don't you go and check it out and than come back to tell us where it was reported to the shareholders in that report. The only time you here of a 230 mill lost is in articles in the media and on ABF press releases. Here is your chance the lost has grown to 250 mill cause by the contract since 2009 which ABF claims. That means ABF has to show a lost of more than 20 mill this quarter on the 1st Quarter reports. Here is the link to 250 mill a press release to us

http://easycaptures.com/fs/uploaded/609/6267688032.png
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So how much money do you think ABF loss or made the last five years? More importantly, how does that number compare to our non-union completion like O.D.,FedEx and Conway. How do our numbers compare to the lowest cost ltl and our union brothers at YRC for the last two years?
 
nothumbleenough said:
So how much money do you think ABF loss or made the last five years? More importantly, how does that number compare to our non-union completion like O.D.,FedEx and Conway. How do our numbers compare to the lowest cost ltl and our union brothers at YRC for the last two years?
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Let us say for now we give them everything they want in a contract. Let us say the non-union carriers cut their price by another 30% after we give concessions to ABF. When this happens will ABF come back again saying they can't compete because of the contract, do we give another 10 or 15% in the next contract. When will it stop or are we opening a can of worms we can't close. What is ABF willing to give us, YRC gave stock is this being offered to us? What will ABF stock be worth if they get concessions, let us all share in the profits or is that just for management. ABF has said the non-uion employees have given 80 mill, what has management given up. I said you lead from the top down don't ask anyone to do what you are not willing to do.
 
truxforever said:
nothumbleenough Don't get me wrong I do know they are loosing money, just not as bad as they are trying to make us think.
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Brother Trux-
I get the point about ABF misrepresenting (aka lying) in their propaganda posters. Losing the intellectually honest side by misrepresenting the cold hard facts only weakens their argument. Unfortunately this is common place in both politics and negotiation. Trust but verify.

Kudos to Teamsters, I hadn't heard such stretches of the truth so far. Heck, until this memo dated 4-19 it's been real quiet.
 
truxforever said:
Let us say for now we give them everything they want in a contract. Let us say the non-union carriers cut their price by another 30% after we give concessions to ABF. When this happens will ABF come back again saying they can't compete because of the contract, do we give another 10 or 15% in the next contract. When will it stop or are we opening a can of worms we can't close. What is ABF willing to give us, YRC gave stock is this being offered to us? What will ABF stock be worth if they get concessions, let us all share in the profits or is that just for management. ABF has said the non-uion employees have given 80 mill, what has management given up. I said you lead from the top down don't ask anyone to do what you are not willing to do.
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Its true that yrc teamster members received stock, but their stock could have been used as toilet paper, it is and was worthless right from the beginning. It was not worth anything til it reached a certain amount and it will never reach that the point where it will ever pay off.......
 
stickman said:
Ya we do know,keep tryin to spew your B.S. on here. We are supposed to bite the bullet so you can start getting a bonus again. Remember one thing there are a lot more driving jobs than there are lower management jobs
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Ya ya, I'm company. ( rolling eyes ).
 
papajohn said:
Its true that yrc teamster members received stock, but their stock could have been used as toilet paper, it is and was worthless right from the beginning. It was not worth anything til it reached a certain amount and it will never reach that the point where it will ever pay off.......
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ABF stock is not wothless papajohn, this is why it is not being offered. Papajohn just think of what it will be worth with word of us taking concessions. ABF stock will sky-rocket.
 
truxforever said:
ABF stock is not wothless papajohn, this is why it is not being offered. Papajohn just think of what it will be worth with word of us taking concessions. ABF stock will sky-rocket.
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I agree with you 100%, ABF stock is worth having and I hope that if concessions ever did happen that we will benefit also when the company benefits. profits will be shared by all.................
 
truxforever said:
Let us say for now we give them everything they want in a contract. Let us say the non-union carriers cut their price by another 30% after we give concessions to ABF. When this happens will ABF come back again saying they can't compete because of the contract, do we give another 10 or 15% in the next contract. When will it stop or are we opening a can of worms we can't close. What is ABF willing to give us, YRC gave stock is this being offered to us? What will ABF stock be worth if they get concessions, let us all share in the profits or is that just for management. ABF has said the non-uion employees have given 80 mill, what has management given up. I said you lead from the top down don't ask anyone to do what you are not willing to do.
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It is conceivable that IF ABF got a concession of any magnitude the non-unions would do as FedEx and Estes tried by slashing rates in 08 to put YRC out of business. It isn't likely based on our specialized and loyal customer base. Secondly and more importantly, YRC had revenues approaching 10 billion and controlled a much larger share of the ltl revenue pool than ABF has ever dreamed of controlling. I believe this to be the analogy of all the low hanging fruit being picked. If the competion can't get our existing business with our current rates how would the get it at a lower rate. Also tie any concession to new Teamster Jobs created. The contract verbiage would have to be exact to this point because they won't do it voluntarily. No new teamster jobs then some sort of kickback provision hits.
 
nothumbleenough said:
It is conceivable that IF ABF got a concession of any magnitude the non-unions would do as FedEx and Estes tried by slashing rates in 08 to put YRC out of business. It isn't likely based on our specialized and loyal customer base. Secondly and more importantly, YRC had revenues approaching 10 billion and controlled a much larger share of the ltl revenue pool than ABF has ever dreamed of controlling. I believe this to be the analogy of all the low hanging fruit being picked. If the competion can't get our existing business with our current rates how would the get it at a lower rate. Also tie any concession to new Teamster Jobs created. The contract verbiage would have to be exact to this point because they won't do it voluntarily. No new teamster jobs then some sort of kickback provision hits.
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You are right the wording would have to be exact to protect us. I would rather get new teamster jobs and stock for my wages if I must take a cut. I don't think ABF will be willing to voluntarily give up stock, the union needs to stand firm on this where we all share in the profits.
 
truxforever said:
You are right the wording would have to be exact to protect us. I would rather get new teamster jobs and stock for my wages if I must take a cut. I don't think ABF will be willing to voluntarily give up stock, the union needs to stand firm on this where we all share in the profits.
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One very important note. Any concession vote would only take place ABF declares its intentions with this hybrid plan for the pension. Meaning if they intend to take advantage of this plan, it might reap tens of millions saved in company revenues and the rank and file must know this on the front end rather than sign a concession on wages then find out 90 days later they will be paying only 90 million in pensions versus the 120 million paid in 2012.

I expressed this to the only man I actually know on the committee. He clearly understood the point.
 
nothumbleenough said:
One very important note. Any concession vote would only take place ABF declares its intentions with this hybrid plan for the pension. Meaning if they intend to take advantage of this plan, it might reap tens of millions saved in company revenues and the rank and file must know this on the front end rather than sign a concession on wages then find out 90 days later they will be paying only 90 million in pensions versus the 120 million paid in 2012.

I expressed this to the only man I actually know on the committee. He clearly understood the point.
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That's a good point I agree.
 
I just read this, and this what they think of us

Frank • 19 days ago

This is a sad state of affairs. Consumers depend on freight companies deliver the goods. The long standing view that management can not be trusted has run it's course. This is 2013 not 1937. At the end of the day if a company goes out of business because a union will not help cuts costs, the drivers and dock workers loose as very few have skill sets that will transfer to a different industry other than freight. Will the union pay the mortgage, medical bills, clothing, car payments. No. So who does? The union worker may be left twisting in the wind. It is economics 101. The low cost freight company with lowest claims wins the business, which leads to profits which leads to paychecks. Staying the course for principle may be ok, if it does not cost you your job. Think this through. Is failure to give in so the company can stay in business worth foreclosure? Worth hungry nights? Maybe not. Might want to ask the 18500 former Hostess employees. I wonder what they are doing now?

And here is more

Frank jmaz • 11 days ago

Companies have been held hostage by unions since just after the great depression. In the case of Hostess both union and management are unemployed. Their management went as far a they could. The union refused to listen and no doubt many are facing foreclosure. Grandma used to say a piece of pie (instead of the whole pie) is better than no pie at all. It is hard for me to grasp that no job and foreclosure is better than a job with reduced benefits and/or wages. The odds of finding a better job in today's market is worse that hitting a million on a slot machine. Some of the freight companies will close their dock gates for the last time over this. You heard it here first.

I bet he sure is not taking reduced paycheck sitting behind his big desk!!!1
 
papajohn said:
I just read this, and this what they think of us

Frank • 19 days ago

This is a sad state of affairs. Consumers depend on freight companies deliver the goods. The long standing view that management can not be trusted has run it's course. This is 2013 not 1937. At the end of the day if a company goes out of business because a union will not help cuts costs, the drivers and dock workers loose as very few have skill sets that will transfer to a different industry other than freight. Will the union pay the mortgage, medical bills, clothing, car payments. No. So who does? The union worker may be left twisting in the wind. It is economics 101. The low cost freight company with lowest claims wins the business, which leads to profits which leads to paychecks. Staying the course for principle may be ok, if it does not cost you your job. Think this through. Is failure to give in so the company can stay in business worth foreclosure? Worth hungry nights? Maybe not. Might want to ask the 18500 former Hostess employees. I wonder what they are doing now?

And here is more

Frank jmaz • 11 days ago

Companies have been held hostage by unions since just after the great depression. In the case of Hostess both union and management are unemployed. Their management went as far a they could. The union refused to listen and no doubt many are facing foreclosure. Grandma used to say a piece of pie (instead of the whole pie) is better than no pie at all. It is hard for me to grasp that no job and foreclosure is better than a job with reduced benefits and/or wages. The odds of finding a better job in today's market is worse that hitting a million on a slot machine. Some of the freight companies will close their dock gates for the last time over this. You heard it here first.

I bet he sure is not taking reduced paycheck sitting behind his big desk!!!1
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I love this line.

At the end of the day if a company goes out of business because a union will not help cuts costs, the drivers and dock workers loose as very few have skill sets that will transfer to a different industry other than freight.

Can you feel the love and respect!!!1
 
I like to comment on this, i used to work for roadway express, now working for yrc. The problem is that yellow has to many lazy people, and is being run by people that dont know how to run a company, we at roadway werent perfect, but yellow was bad and is still bad, there are not enough good people, at yrc to keep the company from losing money. When we were roadway here locally, we were between top 3-5 out of about 25 terminals in our district, in best profits, for over 27 yrs. Soon after yellow took us over, we lost everything, we closed down. At that location, yellow went from about 15 drivers to about 6. And the only reason they were still there was because they had 4 very heavy acct. After they lost that they closed the terminal another thing was that yellow was running 2 linehaul drivers for every one driver roadway was runnig, all of yellows freight was floored out, so there lindhaul cost was twice the cost, and other thing, most of the yellow drivers were always 2-3 hours late just about every day,. Seemed that the older yellow driver ran great.. But the younger ones were always running late. They didnt have pride in their work, ( like most yellow workers today). Today yrc has no control over the movement of their freight. Every day we pull single shipments out of different tlrs. Another thing i have learned at yrc most of the people, from to to bottom are jerks. It is a dog and cat game at yrc. Out manager keeps telling the supervisors to give out warning letters this is every..,in 27 yrs at our roadway terminal there were only 2 warning letter given out. Were worked together, we were family, we had cook outs, baseball game, etc. Now this was great..so listen abf drivers think of we at yrc are getting now, youre still better off then we at yrc will be. Good luck
 
nothumbleenough said:
Ever stop to think how much Judy and her fellow management team has lost in their own personal wealth since the company stock used to trade above 45 dollars in value. Five years ago that many shares would have been valued well over 3,000,000. Today those are worth about 750,000. That's a loss in value over 2,250,000 to her alone. Earnings manipulation almost always exaggerates earnings to increase the stock price. I would ask you cite publicly traded companies guilty of this type of reverse stock manipulation.

BTW, ABF did show a different number in its company propaganda(230 million) for the last five years than it publicly reported as a loss. About 160 million.
Click to expand...
Did you ever think she was givin those shares...Her calculated compensation for 2012 was $945,386 (bloomburg businessweek) & they want a $240 health care donation? For what? Pay for panther....
 
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