freightpunk
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Lighten up Silvertooth...if you can only spuuuu bad things about our company go away. There are many who care about it and I am one of them. :smilie_132:
Remember,he has a right to his opinion...:smilie_132:
Lighten up Silvertooth...if you can only spuuuu bad things about our company go away. There are many who care about it and I am one of them. :smilie_132:
Lighten up Silvertooth...if you can only spuuuu bad things about our company go away. There are many who care about it and I am one of them. :smilie_132:
Season's greetings from a non OHFL driver.I log in just to follow this thread.In your ongoing conversation the one thing I haven't seen mentioned is a part of the union philosophy integral to all unions.I agree that non-union shops have a decided advantage in labor costs,it's difficult to prove otherwise;as part of the union belief,the unions have an obligation to organize the competition to help minimize that advantage.
It seems to me that in the 80's the Teamsters chose to give up organizing drivers and focused on clerks,policemen,deputies and other groups.Just my 2cents worth.
Shifterknob -
I went to the Dark Tower link you posted...kinda creepy! Hope you aren't trying to tell us something.......
OK, so you opened the comparison door with your ABF/CF example, so I'm jumping right in.
No doubt, CF was badly managed, ABF is extremely well run. But take a look at the list of the top 27 LTL carriers in America today based upon annual revenue listed in Transport Topics a couple of weeks ago. Here it goes, with the largest one listed first;
1. YRC World Wide (union)
2. Fed Ex Freight
3. Con-Way Freight
4. UPS Freight
5. ABF (union)
6. Estes
7. Watkins (now Fed Ex too)
8. SCS (Saia)
9. Old Dominion
10. Averitt
11. R and L
12. Southeastern
13. Lyden
14. Transforce Income Fund (Canadian)
15. AAA Cooper
16. CenTra (Central Transport)
17. Central Freight Lines
18. Vitran
19. New England Motor Express (Machinists Union)
20. Roadrunner Dawes
21. Forward Air
22. Pitt Ohio
23. A. Duie Pyle
24. PJAX
25. Milan
26. Wilson
27. Daylight
Gee, only 3 are organized, 2 are Teamster. Now I'm figuring that you have been around for a while, and you obviously are an intellegent guy since you write very well, so I'm sure you can visualize what this list looked like 10 or 15 years ago. I can, and it sure didn't look like this. There were sure alot more Teamster carriers listed then than there are now. In fact, over the last 10-15 years, virtually all of the growth in the LTL game has been by the non-union carriers, while the old line Teamster carriers have gone under, one by one, leaving this list today.
Now, you just can't tell me it is all because of "Bad Management". All of the non-union companies, who have grown over this time period, are the only ones with good management, that made all the good decisions, while all of the Teamster carriers that are now in the graveyard were all universally badly managed. That arguement holds no water with me.
It is time to face facts. Our industry features operating margins like the supermarket industry. Slim and none. Labor expense accounts for 50%-65% of an LTL carrier's total cost. If you have a 5% to 10% cost advantage in labor costs (including benefits, where the real difference lies union vs. nonunion), that is huge. Come on, which one of these LTL carriers pays OT? At best, nonunion guys get it after 45 plus hours a week, not like union carriers with OT after 8 hours.
Comments?
Shifterknob -
I went to the Dark Tower link you posted...kinda creepy! Hope you aren't trying to tell us something.......
OK, so you opened the comparison door with your ABF/CF example, so I'm jumping right in.
No doubt, CF was badly managed, ABF is extremely well run. But take a look at the list of the top 27 LTL carriers in America today based upon annual revenue listed in Transport Topics a couple of weeks ago. Here it goes, with the largest one listed first;
1. YRC World Wide (union)
2. Fed Ex Freight
3. Con-Way Freight
4. UPS Freight
5. ABF (union)
6. Estes
7. Watkins (now Fed Ex too)
8. SCS (Saia)
9. Old Dominion
10. Averitt
11. R and L
12. Southeastern
13. Lyden
14. Transforce Income Fund (Canadian)
15. AAA Cooper
16. CenTra (Central Transport)
17. Central Freight Lines
18. Vitran
19. New England Motor Express (Machinists Union)
20. Roadrunner Dawes
21. Forward Air
22. Pitt Ohio
23. A. Duie Pyle
24. PJAX
25. Milan
26. Wilson
27. Daylight
Gee, only 3 are organized, 2 are Teamster. Now I'm figuring that you have been around for a while, and you obviously are an intellegent guy since you write very well, so I'm sure you can visualize what this list looked like 10 or 15 years ago. I can, and it sure didn't look like this. There were sure alot more Teamster carriers listed then than there are now. In fact, over the last 10-15 years, virtually all of the growth in the LTL game has been by the non-union carriers, while the old line Teamster carriers have gone under, one by one, leaving this list today.
Now, you just can't tell me it is all because of "Bad Management". All of the non-union companies, who have grown over this time period, are the only ones with good management, that made all the good decisions, while all of the Teamster carriers that are now in the graveyard were all universally badly managed. That arguement holds no water with me.
It is time to face facts. Our industry features operating margins like the supermarket industry. Slim and none. Labor expense accounts for 50%-65% of an LTL carrier's total cost. If you have a 5% to 10% cost advantage in labor costs (including benefits, where the real difference lies union vs. nonunion), that is huge. Come on, which one of these LTL carriers pays OT? At best, nonunion guys get it after 45 plus hours a week, not like union carriers with OT after 8 hours.
Comments?
I think my avatar accurately expresses my frustrations with OHFL, and I don't really see it as offensive from a visual standpoint. I have seen avatars on Truckingboards that map out sex positions with a “help wanted” sign; I can see how one could consider that to be offensive. I feel the only offence one could derive from my avatar would be based on a difference of opinion, and without difference of opinion these boards would have no reason to exist.
That said if a moderator or several others feel differently, I will gladly censor (blurr)
the buttocks of Calvin, or change my avatar. It’s a shame they don’t make one of Calvin defecating, because that would more precisely express my feelings toward OHFL. Furthermore you only have five short posts, for all I know you could be an OHFL supervisor.
You mean like this one? I thought this avatar to be funny, if anybody at all has a problem with this avatar please feel free to PM me and I will get rid of it, no problem, I think the gentalman questioning your taste in the avatar works for the same company as you, and is problematic with it. Not necessarily your opinion. After all some do have pride in whom they work for...
So his opinion is that he works for a good company, and he is proud of that. My opinion is that his company is a greedy anti-union company. So a difference of opinion does exist, as you can see. And my avatar is an expression of that difference of opinion. Nothing more, the only way it could be considered offensive not based on opinions regarding Oak Harbor is if the offence is taken strictly in the imagery such as Calvin’s naked butt.
So you have made no point here. BTW I do not work for this company.
I think it is important to note the size of these companies, for instance YRC and Fed-Ex are huge companies and saia #8 on that list is very small in comparison, I bet the combined market share of the last 17 carriers on your 27 carrier list are not even equal to that of one of the top four.
Where I live every carrier has to pay OT after 40.
So you have a good point, us Teamster boys can never be as profitable as the non-unions, while some carriers such as Fed-Ex, do take good care of their people others don't. In the surviving union ltl world we have ultra-efficient management which helps we also keep our employees longer. If non-union carriers were to either take better care of their guys, or organize, the playing field would level and every one of us would enjoy better pay and benefits.
The middle class is on a race to the bottom should we lower our standards and accept less just because others do? The list you posted is misleading; in the ltl sector we run about 40% union and that’s the reason we all make decent money, unlike the TL sector.