Holland | August 2008 U.E. Change Of Operations

[Osprey]

Blame game

I don't care if you believe me or not. Mindless sheep is what got us here in the first place. If everyone educated themselves, then we would not be in this situation. Tell yourself what ever you want. Why would I make up something like this? Do you think I am bitter? I am! That does not make me a liar. I can prove that the IBT and our locals lied about the application of the UE. We have all seen the results of their promises. Why would you believe anything they say? Again, make your own opinion, I do not care what you think is BS. Open your eyes and look around.

I am not calling you a liar, but c'mon, out of 300,000 IBT members that voted for this monstrosity, don't you think somebody understood it.

The problem is that everyone that voted YES will say they voted no, so who are you going to blame , the Union, give me a break will you. You are supposed to understand what you're voting for, we are grown men bro.

If you want to play the blame game for the next FIVE years have at it.


GBA:USA: Semper Fi

 

[Forty-Five]

I am not calling you a liar, but c'mon, out of 300,000 IBT members that voted for this monstrosity, don't you think somebody understood it.

The problem is that everyone that voted YES will say they voted no, so who are you going to blame , the Union, give me a break will you. You are supposed to understand what you're voting for, we are grown men bro.

If you want to play the blame game for the next FIVE years have at it.


GBA:USA: Semper Fi

I,for one, have to agree with him. I sat at the same Dog and pony show(meeting), that he did. The so called leadership sat there and tried to say that this wasn't gonna be the result, yet, here it is. And they're some of the ones that knew what was about to happen.
They just sat up there, oblivious to what was being discussed, and looked like they'd rather be somewhere else.
If being part of the IBT, is having the Captain put you in a lifeboat, knowing that it was going to sink, and then telling you to trust them, you can have it!!!!!

 

[buckeye bandit]

i don't want to start a war here. Forget the contract language and all of the hype and emotions. I have just one question. What type of work is the ue doing? If you say mostly road work then you will agree that the road man should follow their work. If anyone can show me how the ue at holland is doing mostly city work then i will drop this issue.

this was all covered at contract time if you did not like it then why was it voted in.........

 

[Benny Hill]

this was all covered at contract time if you did not like it then why was it voted in.........

Welcome to Truckingboards Buckeye bandit.

 

[teamster02]

The truck load is for rail loads only.

I dont read it that way. I'm referring to "over-the-road purchased transportation substitute service". And they present it as a needed alternative to rail loads as stated here: "The parties recognize that the current shipping markets demand expedited delivery of freight in a manner that may not be accomplished by hauling certain freight by rail. These market demands create a need to reduce the amount of freight hauled by rail and to use alternative methods of substitute service." This is where they bumped up the % allowed (of substitute service) every year of the contract. Having said that, this will basically only effect Yellow/Roadway due to the fact that we do not do truckload anyway. I believe Roadway is already seeing (Glenmore) taking some loads out of some of their terminals. Just another example of how bad of a contract this is for us Teamsters. I believe you did vote no, but there sure were alot of people who either didn't actually read the contract, or were too dumb to read between the lines. It seemed pretty obvious to me how bad of a deal this was. Now we pay the price for the majority's stupidity.

 

[jarhead13]

this was all covered at contract time if you did not like it then why was it voted in.........

The contract was voted in because most people relied on their elected Union officials to interpret the contract for them. The representatives lied to the membership. Some of us tried to explain this. Now it is too late. This is no different than anything that is voted on. If there is a proposition on your ballot, do you read the entire legal document? Very few do this. So if you local politician has a personal stake in the matter, he is prone to "white wash" the situation to get what he wants. That is what happened here.

 

[Benny Hill]

I have a copy of the language that the company wants to use in this COO, its as it was reported.

It says that the company will comply with the seniority application decision of the Committee. However, the company proposes the following changes...

The company has asked the National UE Review Committee to consider allowing ALL CURRENTLY QUALIFIED road men to bid on the UE jobs first and then only if there are any un-filled positions left over then the city men can bid. This is only a proposal by the company, I think to try and drive the city and road farther apart. It says that if you're awarded such bids you will remain on the bid at least until 01-2009. They said that before and then let the first guys get bumped off anyway. I won't say how I feel about something this outrageous, I'll save my opinion until after the decision is made. If this change is allowed to take place I hope that the responsible parties get what they deserve, no matter how bad it is.

I understand that some of you guys are new to this type of issue and as such I've let you relieve stress as I thought I should. I hate to state this but here goes, just for your information, if you're currently on layoff status, you are not CURRENTLY QUALIFIED, that means that you can't bid if you're on layoff and you may never get called back to Holland because they will cut more road bids for these UE bids. If you're not called back you're stuck in the no win zone. I don't know what we can do to save these jobs now that this contract is in affect?

 

[Boilerpeddle]

Has this kind of "super seniority" ever been used before?

 

[imported_Bowbender]

I have a copy of the new COO. Most of you probably have a copy. Everything that has been reported is mostly accurate.

On to a more important issue.
I have some very disturbing news to share with everyone. I learned today that when the Company and the Union were negotiating this terrible contract the Company wanted the Road Drivers to drop freight and do switches at open terminals. The UNION came back to the Company with the idea of the UE. THIS WAS OUR LEADERSHIPS' IDEA. We all knew they screwed us. Now we know they did it intentionally and have lied about it the whole time. I will Never vote for any incumbent at the IBT or at the Local level again. It was bad enough when we though they were just ignorant, morons. It makes me sick to learn that they orchestrated the whole thing. Even if the Road Drivers manage to keep a job, we will lose $15k to $20k per year. These people were elected to represent all of us and now they have done worse than lie, they have betrayed us. I will not rest until these people are voted out of office. I hope everyone will see the truth and join me. We cannot forgive this Heinous act. I do not care how they reason what they have done. I say they are done!

If this is true that our own union leadership came up with the UE position . The road drivers will be a thing of the past. How could these people be this ignorant. Do you think YRC is sitting back and laughing at the IBT.

 

[buckeye bandit]

I understand the road drivers can follow the work but they cannot bid out of order. If this is allowed to happen we just lost are last true right (SENORITY)

 

[jarhead13]

I understand the road drivers can follow the work but they cannot bid out of order. If this is allowed to happen we just lost are last true right (SENORITY)

If the Road Drivers are following their work, how are they bidding out of order?

 

[jarhead13]

I hate to state this but here goes, just for your information, if you're currently on layoff status, you are not CURRENTLY QUALIFIED, that means that you can't bid if you're on layoff and you may never get called back to Holland because they will cut more road bids for these UE bids. If you're not called back you're stuck in the no win zone. I don't know what we can do to save these jobs now that this contract is in affect?

Doesn't qualified mean qualified for the job? The only thing we can do to save the road job is to allow road drivers to bid on the UE first. The outrageous thing to me is that the city boards are gaining work from the road and then do not care what happens to the Road Driver. (Most of them anyway) I think we need to go to a single board and bid everything by company seniority.

 

[Osprey]

So long BROS

We received C.O.O. from BA On 8-15-08, Original fax came from Holland Central Dispatch efax.
This is what Page 4 Bidding states


BIDDING

This Utility Employee Change of Operations will create one-hundred eighty six (186) new local cartage position.

The Company will comply with the senority application decision of the Committee.However,the Company propose the following job opportunity proposal for the National Utility Employee Review Committee's considerations:

* All Utility Employee positions would be bid terminal by terminal and all currently qualified road employees may bid to these new positions by senority at his/her present domicile.Any un-filled positions may be bid by local cartage employees by seniority at his/her present domicile.

* Employees awarded such bids will remain on the bid until January 2009, after that they will bid on the next annual or semi-annual bid provided for in the supplement.

The sign up sheets will be posted at the domiciles for seven (7) days.

The Company seeks to implement the UE COO no sooner than September 29,2008.

Based on current economic conditions this proposed COO will have no affect on current local cartage operations.

In today's economic environment and excess capacity, the Company's opportunity to grow revenue diminishes every day. It is essential that this UE COO be approved by the National UE Review Comittee and implemented as proposed, which is no sooner than Sept.29,2008 to avoid the consequences of lost revenue and jobs.

This is everthing on page 4 (after the sign up sheets line I used abbrevations foe UE, COO and Sept.)

The locals that are affected by this are as follows,
7,20,24,26,40,89,100,135,164,179,200,215,238,299,325,364,371,377,406,407,413,414,486,505,600,614,651,710,916,957,375,397,449,538,612.

I hope this info helps answer some questions, It does not sound like the contract that was voted on.

No one ever is satisfied, I know a lot of city men that will be very disappointed by this change, and the battle between road and city will continue which is
exactly what the Company wants, "Divide and Conquer", the Brotherhood, if there was still any left is crumbling

 

[Boilerpeddle]

Doesn't qualified mean qualified for the job? The only thing we can do to save the road job is to allow road drivers to bid on the UE first. The outrageous thing to me is that the city boards are gaining work from the road and then do not care what happens to the Road Driver. (Most of them anyway) I think we need to go to a single board and bid everything by company seniority.

But you are not saving road jobs by letting junior road drivers bid ahead of senior city men. The position is a city position. It shouldn't be probably but it is. I do care about all jobs at holland. But I have to agree with another poster and say that seniority is the only thing we have left. Traditionally when you follow work don't you usually dovetail in?

 

[shoeman]

But you are not saving road jobs by letting junior road drivers bid ahead of senior city men. The position is a city position. It shouldn't be probably but it is. I do care about all jobs at holland. But I have to agree with another poster and say that seniority is the only thing we have left. Traditionally when you follow work don't you usually dovetail in?

So do you want to be a road driver or city driver. I want to be a road driver and want nothing to do with peddles ( whatever the f those are) or p and d's. Us guys caught in the middle of the road board are almost going to have to take Utility to keep a job. But rest assured Boilerpeddle, I will stay on Utility, working my nights just like before unless you senior "city" drivers make me go to the "city", with your seniority bumping rights!!!! What comes around goes around i geuss. You want to be able to take your seniority into road work taken by the UE but dont like the thought of road drivers ahead of you on the city board! It just all around sucks!!!

 

[jarhead13]

But you are not saving road jobs by letting junior road drivers bid ahead of senior city men. The position is a city position. It shouldn't be probably but it is. I do care about all jobs at holland. But I have to agree with another poster and say that seniority is the only thing we have left. Traditionally when you follow work don't you usually dovetail in?

Once again, The reason the UE city position has work is because it has come from road work. If the Road Drivers bid on the UE, the senior city men can have that job at the next bid. How are they being screwed? I know the road jobs are gone. If five city UE jobs are added and five road jobs are canceled, how is the city Driver getting screwed?

 

[Boilerpeddle]

So do you want to be a road driver or city driver. I want to be a road driver and want nothing to do with peddles ( whatever the f those are) or p and d's. Us guys caught in the middle of the road board are almost going to have to take Utility to keep a job. But rest assured Boilerpeddle, I will stay on Utility, working my nights just like before unless you senior "city" drivers make me go to the "city", with your seniority bumping rights!!!! What comes around goes around i geuss. You want to be able to take your seniority into road work taken by the UE but dont like the thought of road drivers ahead of you on the city board! It just all around sucks!!!

That's just it. There won't be any road drivers ahead of me in the city because unless we combine boards they would be city drivers. Plus as far asthat goes I don't think anyone on our road board with more seniority than me will bid to it anyway.
I absolutley think anyone losing jobs should be able to follow the work. But a 5 year man bidding ahead of a 20 year man doesn't seem fair to me.

 

[Boilerpeddle]

Once again, The reason the UE city position has work is because it has come from road work. If the Road Drivers bid on the UE, the senior city men can have that job at the next bid. How are they being screwed? I know the road jobs are gone. If five city UE jobs are added and five road jobs are canceled, how is the city Driver getting screwed?

Ok so the city guys only get their seniority violated the first time.
Maybe that is the best way to implement this disatser. But all the roadndrivers are saying that this new way is fair and I am just trying to point out that there are problems with it also.

 

[dieseldummy]

How many times must I say it....If we had one board, seniority would prevail.....Classifications stink period. If you have the whiskers, you can work where you choose...if not, wait until you grow some and be happy working where your seniority allows

 

[dokman]

So do you want to be a road driver or city driver. I want to be a road driver and want nothing to do with peddles ( whatever the f those are) or p and d's. Us guys caught in the middle of the road board are almost going to have to take Utility to keep a job. But rest assured Boilerpeddle, I will stay on Utility, working my nights just like before unless you senior "city" drivers make me go to the "city", with your seniority bumping rights!!!! What comes around goes around i geuss. You want to be able to take your seniority into road work taken by the UE but dont like the thought of road drivers ahead of you on the city board! It just all around sucks!!!

I started this thread with the intent to let everyone know what was going on with the COO, I'am sorry it has caused so much hate and discontent between road and city. I think everyone should step back take a deep breath and realize one way or another things will work out we have to stay together as a group not divided like a play ground full of school kids. We all need to work together to get things changed we can start by keeping good records of what happens and does not happen (per contract) and setting down with the locals to get things hammered out and follow the contract. After all TY kept calling us and telling us VOTE YES THIS IS A GOOD CONTRACT! We can hold there feet (IBT) to the fire since this is the contract that they negoited for us,the dues paying members.