Saving America's Pension Plans Is A Rare Chance For Bipartisan Accomplishment | Opinion

[canaryinthemine]

Actually, you voted Repub more than I have. I voted straight Repub from 1972-2000, but felt betrayed by Bush43 as he increased spending and was lax on the border, so I voted Constitution Party in 2004. In 2008, there was no way I could vote for Juan “Cross-the-aisle” McCain, so, again it voted Constitution Party. In 2012, I actually called the GOP HQ and asked why was the GOP running a Dem (Romney)? I voted for my dog Zeus that year. Then, in 16, I swore I wouldn’t vote Trump- but did- because , somehow, anyhow, Hillary Had to be stopped! The nation couldn’t survive a 3rd Obama Term of corrupt Marxism. Trump has pleasantly surprised me, and become the Best US Prez since Reagan. By the way- I believe Trump would sign the Lewis Bill you want- if it passes...

Not bad, Jimmy G........I'll give you much credit for thinking for yourself as far as voting goes......even if I disagree with your methodology....But that's what makes a representative republic.......
Something T. Jefferson said about the "Loyal Opposition..."

In the Local where I was the PAC fund treasurer,.......out of 2,300 members,...roughly 2/3rds were Democrat,...and a third were Republican,...with a smattering of third-party voters....
We had to research and find local candidates who were palatable to both Republicans and Democrats,.....for the endorsements we presented to the members......At a local level,....many Republicans and Democrats were able to work with their counterparts, and listen to ideas across the aisles.....

It doesn't appear that way if you listen to....mass media....
For years I told guys to: "Vote with your Eyes(...READ!..), not your Ears..(Radio, TV,Blogs/podcasts..)...

But,....literacy isn't...."in fashion"..anymore......When I worked the night time dock, road drivers would pull in off the road, you'd hop in the tractor to switch out,...and their radio was on some sort of...ranting "talk show"......

Indoctrination....of a captive audience,..for hours on end.......

Some of these guys would get out of the truck in a rage.........and tell me the latest...."conspiracy theory"......

I would agree with you that Mr. Trump.....under certain conditions,....would sign the Butch Lewis Act.....If he was down by ten points two weeks prior to the election,.....he certainly would...

But,...would he sign it because he BELIEVES it would rectify a wrong?.....In My Opinion,....No.....His large corporate donors would be horrified....

And,.....since Paul Ryan has left Congress,..and his merry band of Deficit-Hawks have seemed to....dissipated.....and the Federal Deficit is......through the roof.....
.....How do you feel about Congress's ability to.....pass laws and spending bills,.....on a truly altruistic and fiscally responsible level?
.......instead of throwing"sops" to the Large Donors?

 

[Crystal]

Get your lazy ass up and look for yourself crybaby.

Real classy post. Why would I want to read it when I've already said I'm not interested in it? You started with me by posting that I was part of the problem. I asked you what problem and you have yet to answer how I am a part of your unnamed problem. Obviously you can't or won't answer my question so you have to resort to repeated name calling. I thought you were done talking to me.

 

[Crystal]

Actually, you voted Repub more than I have. I voted straight Repub from 1972-2000, but felt betrayed by Bush43 as he increased spending and was lax on the border, so I voted Constitution Party in 2004. In 2008, there was no way I could vote for Juan “Cross-the-aisle” McCain, so, again it voted Constitution Party. In 2012, I actually called the GOP HQ and asked why was the GOP running a Dem (Romney)? I voted for my dog Zeus that year. Then, in 16, I swore I wouldn’t vote Trump- but did- because , somehow, anyhow, Hillary Had to be stopped! The nation couldn’t survive a 3rd Obama Term of corrupt Marxism. Trump has pleasantly surprised me, and become the Best US Prez since Reagan. By the way- I believe Trump would sign the Lewis Bill you want- if it passes...

I joined the Teamsters when I got out of the service in 1969. At that time Fitzsimmons was the IBT president. If I remember correctly the Teamsters were the only union endorsing Nixon. That's probably why I started voting republican. Like I said to me it was a personality contest. Guys like Humphrey, McGovern and McCarthy seemed kind of wimpy to me. But I was voting personality and not policy......................I'd still vote for the bi-partisan John McCain in a heart beat

 

[SAC75]

Real classy post. Why would I want to read it when I've already said I'm not interested in it? You started with me by posting that I was part of the problem. I asked you what problem and you have yet to answer how I am a part of your unnamed problem. Obviously you can't or won't answer my question so you have to resort to repeated name calling. I thought you were done talking to me.

I did answer your question idiot. Being uneducated on your rights and liberties is a start on losing all rights and liberties. I absolutely posted that being uneducated specifically in math and history is what is going to ruin this country. Apparently you can’t read! You even took the quote where I explained it to you. And below is my quote!!!

“Done talking to you if the lack of knowledge of our constitution is a part of pride in your world. The lack of math skills and American history is astounding in this country.”

 

[SAC75]

Real classy post. Why would I want to read it when I've already said I'm not interested in it? You started with me by posting that I was part of the problem. I asked you what problem and you have yet to answer how I am a part of your unnamed problem. Obviously you can't or won't answer my question so you have to resort to repeated name calling. I thought you were done talking to me.

You want to keep going I promise I will just keep yapping at you. I got nothing but time of yours to waste If you’d like to ruin every thread you’re on.

 

[jimmy g]

Not bad, Jimmy G........I'll give you much credit for thinking for yourself as far as voting goes......even if I disagree with your methodology....But that's what makes a representative republic.......
Something T. Jefferson said about the "Loyal Opposition..."

In the Local where I was the PAC fund treasurer,.......out of 2,300 members,...roughly 2/3rds were Democrat,...and a third were Republican,...with a smattering of third-party voters....
We had to research and find local candidates who were palatable to both Republicans and Democrats,.....for the endorsements we presented to the members......At a local level,....many Republicans and Democrats were able to work with their counterparts, and listen to ideas across the aisles.....

It doesn't appear that way if you listen to....mass media....
For years I told guys to: "Vote with your Eyes(...READ!..), not your Ears..(Radio, TV,Blogs/podcasts..)...

But,....literacy isn't...."in fashion"..anymore......When I worked the night time dock, road drivers would pull in off the road, you'd hop in the tractor to switch out,...and their radio was on some sort of...ranting "talk show"......

Indoctrination....of a captive audience,..for hours on end.......

Some of these guys would get out of the truck in a rage.........and tell me the latest...."conspiracy theory"......

I would agree with you that Mr. Trump.....under certain conditions,....would sign the Butch Lewis Act.....If he was down by ten points two weeks prior to the election,.....he certainly would...

But,...would he sign it because he BELIEVES it would rectify a wrong?.....In My Opinion,....No.....His large corporate donors would be horrified....

And,.....since Paul Ryan has left Congress,..and his merry band of Deficit-Hawks have seemed to....dissipated.....and the Federal Deficit is......through the roof.....
.....How do you feel about Congress's ability to.....pass laws and spending bills,.....on a truly altruistic and fiscally responsible level?
.......instead of throwing"sops" to the Large Donors?

Trump will sign any bill involving some kind of cure for Pensions, period. He probably wouldn't even read it. He just wants to mark down a WIN and move on.

By the way, I doubt you seem to notice- but the Largest Spending by the US Government is on Entitlements and Giveaways- not to Corporations. I agree Corporate giveaways need cut. But then- the CSPF is a Corporation too....I always vote to cut everything, across the board. The only spending the Federal Government is Supposed to do is for Defense, and courts to make the States play nice together...

 

[Crystal]

You want to keep going I promise I will just keep yapping at you. I got nothing but time of yours to waste If you’d like to ruin every thread you’re on.

You started this back and forth by posting I'm part of the problem. You're the one who's calling names and ruing the thread. What other threads have I ruined? You remind me of that posted Lewsir. Now you can have the final insults if you want

 

[Michigan Bill]

I joined the Teamsters when I got out of the service in 1969. At that time Fitzsimmons was the IBT president. If I remember correctly the Teamsters were the only union endorsing Nixon. That's probably why I started voting republican. Like I said to me it was a personality contest. Guys like Humphrey, McGovern and McCarthy seemed kind of wimpy to me. But I was voting personality and not policy......................I'd still vote for the bi-partisan John McCain in a heart beat

uaw endorsed nixon as well, they had some temporary two union alliance with the ibt, since they were both in the doghouse with the afl-cio, iirc....

 

[SAC75]

You started this back and forth by posting I'm part of the problem. You're the one who's calling names and ruing the thread. What other threads have I ruined? You remind me of that posted Lewsir. Now you can have the final insults if you want

I didn’t say you ruined threads. I said I would ruin every thread you are on if you’d like. Just saying.
Stop talking to me and I’ll stop talking to you.

 

[jimmy g]

Well, what’s the latest on the Lewis Bill?

There’s only two weeks left until the end of the US Fiscal Year. End of the Year Spending is being put together this week. Appears to be (to me) Now or Never. If it’s not attached to an Omnibus, it’s going nowhere (which I believe, it’s already dead).

 

[canaryinthemine]

Well, what’s the latest on the Lewis Bill?

There’s only two weeks left until the end of the US Fiscal Year. End of the Year Spending is being put together this week. Appears to be (to me) Now or Never. If it’s not attached to an Omnibus, it’s going nowhere (which I believe, it’s already dead).

Read twice and referred to Committee on Finance. Sen. Chuck Grassley (R) is Chair. There are 28 Senate Co-Sponsors on the Senate Bill...S.2254. All Democrats...one Independent,...Sen. Sanders. No Republican Senators have sponsored the Bill.

No action whatsoever. It will probably die in Committee. Of course, it still needs to pass a Presidential veto.

H.R. 397 and S.2254 both contain provisions to fully fund PBGC ,....which, as we all know, is looking at a funding shortfall on the MEPF side to the point they will run out of funds by 2025......
......thereby opening themselves up to a class-action lawsuit for failure to fulfill their insurance obligations.

So,....If the Senate ignores this Bill,.....it will create a problem when CSPF goes bankrupt,...and the insurance plan that companies and Unions paid premiums to,...fails to cover that bankruptcy.

Call your Senator and remind him that.....wages deferred to the pension plans,...will be denied to retiring working people,....and the Insurance Plan designed to....prevent that failure,...will fail itself, due to Congressional inaction....

The Congressional Budget Office says that passage of pension reform will cost less than allowing failed plans to go to the (bankrupt) PBGC..........The Heritage Foundation calls the CBO figures...."wrong".....

Either way.........Someone is going to pay,...when CSPF issues it's final check.....

 

[jimmy g]

Either way.........Someone is going to pay,...when CSPF issues it's final check.....

I doubt, highly. We'd need recognised Standing and Permission (from the Government) to sue the Government. We Might have Standing. Good Luck getting Permission.

 

[canaryinthemine]

I doubt, highly. We'd need recognised Standing and Permission (from the Government) to sue the Government. We Might have Standing. Good Luck getting Permission.

First Amendment gives people the Right to petition the Government for a Redress of Grievances. Failure to deliberately and adequately fund a government agency created by law,...sure as heck is a Grievance, in My Opinion......

Do you think maybe the Supreme Court will have to eventually rule on whether lawmakers in Congress can deliberately underfund any Government program or law they find....distasteful? The repercussions for Social Security and Medicare may be on the line........

 

[jimmy g]

First Amendment gives people the Right to petition the Government for a Redress of Grievances. Failure to deliberately and adequately fund a government agency created by law,...sure as heck is a Grievance, in My Opinion......

Do you think maybe the Supreme Court will have to eventually rule on whether lawmakers in Congress can deliberately underfund any Government program or law they find....distasteful? The repercussions for Social Security and Medicare may be on the line........

Same answer as above. You need permission to sue the Government.

 

[canaryinthemine]

Same answer as above. You need permission to sue the Government.

"Permission" would be a judicial action. I've contacted my Pension fund Trustees as to whether they'd be willing to file suit. I would hope you are doing the same,....along with anyone else who finds this issue...important.

It's not just me who needs "permission"........I would think all of us would be seeking...permission..in the form of legal action.

I have not received an answer back from the Trustees of my Fund.

 

[jimmy g]

"Permission" would be a judicial action. I've contacted my Pension fund Trustees as to whether they'd be willing to file suit. I would hope you are doing the same,....along with anyone else who finds this issue...important.

It's not just me who needs "permission"........I would think all of us would be seeking...permission..in the form of legal action.

I have not received an answer back from the Trustees of my Fund.

I've tried to sue the USA before. Like I said- the US Court has to recognize, and agree that you have Standing (have been injured), and they have to grant permission for anyone to sue the USA. It's far more complicated than just filing a lawsuit. 90% of cases are denied.

 

[canaryinthemine]

I've tried to sue the USA before. Like I said- the US Court has to recognize, and agree that you have Standing (have been injured), and they have to grant permission for anyone to sue the USA. It's far more complicated than just filing a lawsuit. 90% of cases are denied.

I would imagine there is a legal "filter" in place......Many cases might be frivolous ..........

That's why I'd like to see either a Pension Fund itself,...or a coalition of several Pension fund groups,....institute a lawsuit. Both sets of Trustees,....Employees, and Employers....who have been paying insurance premiums to PBGC..... will be "damaged parties", if the PBGC is allowed to declare it's MEPF program insolvent.

And the bankruptcy of the CSPF will certainly push the Pension Benefit Guarantee Corporation into a....funding shortfall. In MY Opinion,...the Pension Reform Act of 2014,...was a way designed to keep bleeding down the MEPF side of the PBGC,...without it going "bankrupt".
As long as PBGC can pay 1 cent on a dollar,......the argument that they are ......"bankrupt"...will be refuted by hoards of slick-talking lawyers.....(..even though the PBGC's mission was to pay FULL benefits in the event of a Pension Fund failure,.........originally...)..

As long as the Pension Reform Act can force Pension Funds to come up with benefit cuts for participants,....the PBGC will not have to...."pick up the tab",..so to speak,.....

Which puzzles me as to why the Treasury Department refused CSPF's benefit cut plan.......All that does is set into motion the eventual bankruptcy of CSPF,...and the immediate responsibility of the PBGC to...pick up the benefits...
But,...the MEPF program of the PBGC,...is scheduled to run out of funding within 6 years. NOT the Single Employer program,...That's Fully Funded, and paying full benefits to the Single Employer participants whose Funds had gone bankrupt.....

Kind of........Strange, ...isn't it? Congress will fully fund the Single Employer side of PBGC,.....and Underfund the MEPF side......even though,.....according to W. Thomas Reeder, Director of the PBGC,.....there are 4,919 failed Single Employer plans,...as opposed to only 81 failed MEPFs.......

They (Congress...)....seem to be allocating their resources to the ....wrong area.......

Deliberate discrimination?

 

[jimmy g]

Which puzzles me as to why the Treasury Department refused CSPF's benefit cut plan.

A: it wasnt a big enough cut to save the Fund.
B: it wasnt equitably applied
C: They were afraid of the lobbyists and 200,000 retirees against the cuts.
D: CSPF had enough $ to pass the problem off to the Next Administration.
E: Read A again. And then again.

 

[Dracula]

Which puzzles me as to why the Treasury Department refused CSPF's benefit cut plan...

Who was President, when the treasury department rejected the CSPF cut plan? Obama was more concerned with the 2016 political realities of a lot of pissed off teamsters, in Northern swing states, then trying to fix the problem. His Treasury Department punted the ball to whoever won the election.

 

[canaryinthemine]

Who was President, when the treasury department rejected the CSPF cut plan? Obama was more concerned with the 2016 political realities of a lot of pissed off teamsters, in Northern swing states, then trying to fix the problem. His Treasury Department punted the ball to whoever won the election.

The Treasury Department ruling on Central States Pension Fund application for relief under Kline-Miller Multi-employer Pension reform Act of 2014,...........
....was released on 5/7/2016.

The Kline-Miller Act was part of the Omnibus bill passed in December of 2014,....under threat of a Government shutdown by the Republican-controlled House and Senate.

Mr. Obama couldn't even get his Supreme Court nominee in front of the Senate....for eight months starting March of 2016,.....because of deliberate stonewalling by Mess'rs. McConnell and Ryan.

CSPF had made application to the Treasury department within 9 months of passage of Kline-Miller. They were the first MEPF to do so. It kind of stunned Labor activists to see how fast the Trustees jumped on the Pension Reform Bill relief provisions.

I guess, if we're going to point fingers,.......The 113th Congress has to accept a good bit of it...