Dissolve and disperse central states pension fund now !

Discussion in 'Central States Pension Fund Discussion' started by I got nothing, May 31, 2016.

Do you want what's yours from Central States ?

  1. Yes

    38 vote(s)
    84.4%
  2. No

    7 vote(s)
    15.6%
  1. papajohn

    papajohn Banned

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    I do agree with you that it is every Retiree and Active member's moral obligation to call their elected officials today and demand that MPRA is repealed, to strengthen, and protect Multi-Employer Pensions. There be no pension cuts period... Congress needs to start protecting American Citizens, not just the Wealthy Corporations, and the top 1 Percent. Congress and Wall Street created this Delima and now needs to make restitution for the theft that was allowed under the provisions of Erisa.
     
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  2. deadbeat

    deadbeat Member

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    you could take a cut now and and they would say everything is fixed but with the same clowns running things it would still be broke in ten years or less.
    [​IMG]
     
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  3. papajohn

    papajohn Banned

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  4. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    The poster made no sense..... It sounded to me like he was confused about Social Security....and connecting that with the Pension issue.....
     
  5. Bubba Gump

    Bubba Gump Active Member

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    first I have 36 years of seniority, my profile is bogus, if you are following me on face book I really don't live in Stockholm Sweden. my point on s.s. and the pension is you really were not very good stewards in protecting the assets of either one were you !! ??
     
  6. Bubba Gump

    Bubba Gump Active Member

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    been in the business 36 years. Let's talk about 40 year people being complacent, ignorant and irresponsible.
     
  7. nounionfool

    nounionfool Banned

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    First, you say that your profile on TB is bogus. Second, you say that you also lie on Facebook. So how can you expect anyone with half a brain to take you seriously and believe anything that you have to post? I'm sorry but the only point that I see you have made is that you readily admit that you are prone to lie which you obviously don't find anything wrong with. Why is that? You may want to look in the mirror the next time before you accuse others of being ignorant and irresponsible.
     
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  8. Bubba Gump

    Bubba Gump Active Member

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    There you go again with your personal attacks !!!!!.Shame on you. If you were still employed, instead of retiring early so you can get all you can from a dying pension. You FOOL would know about employers with aggressive social media monitoring. That is why I choose to stay anonymous. You don't know how much it hurts me to remind you that you are going to eventually collect $35.75 max per year, with no survivor benefit from the PBGC. No bailout for you FOOL from Hilary "there is no WALL STREET BANKER I will not take $225,000 per speech from" Clinton !!!!!
     
  9. pilot87

    pilot87 Well-Known Member

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    First, none of this has any relevancy.....

    Secondly, your "point" makes no sense whatsoever...... I have no control over Social Security assets nor the Pension fund......anymore than you do.....

    If you want to rant about Clinton....take it to the political forum..... You will be wildly popular there......
     
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  10. deadbeat

    deadbeat Member

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    Good Grief!
    [​IMG]
     
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  11. nounionfool

    nounionfool Banned

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    First, I'm not attacking. I only reiterated what you admitted about yourself in order to put it in proper perspective, so if you want to pin the blame on someone about personal attacks, blame yourself first and foremost. You may think of yourself as a scintillating conversationalist since you think you have followers following you around all over the internet because you're a man of intellect and comprehension but I find you exasperating to say the least and that is not an attack, that is my opinion. In my book, when someone who is known to lie, they are liars, pure and simple. You never know if and when they are telling the truth.

    Second, You may want to spend some of your free time sticking your nose in the dictionary because there is a big difference between choosing to be anonymous and choosing to be a liar. A person can be anonymous without having to resort to lies. Only a liar resorts to lies when wishing to remain anonymous. And while you have that dictionary dusted off, you may want to look up the word paranoia because I know that all the companies in the country are scrambling around as we speak trying to find out just who this Bubba Gump character is. So please be careful now that you admitted that you are a 36 year Teamster because they will scrutinize every one of them until they find out just which one you are, that is, if you were actually telling the truth this time around.

    Third, you have no business being on social media if you are so scared about your employer finding out who you are and what you think. Social media wasn't designed for those who are fearful and insecure by nature. You may want to try taking up tiddlywinks or playing a good game of go fish instead of getting all worked up on social media with the thought of someone finding out who you are and what you actually think because too much stress is not good for one's health. Again, this is not an attack, it's just my observation and caring nature.

    Fourth, I see that your comprehension skills haven't improved one bit since I have told you numerous times that I'm not in the CSPF. Or is it that you assume others lie just because you do?
     
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  12. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    nounionfool,wondering what your rant about another member has anything to do with this topic?
    Not to be sarcastic to your tie-raid.
    As with your posts you seem to present yourself as a very highly intelligent individual.
    So on topic,do you have any solutions to resolve our failing Teamster pension plan?
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2016
  13. nounionfool

    nounionfool Banned

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    You may call it a rant...tirade or anything else you desire but I call it stating my opinion after what I have been observing from this member's posts. In my opinion, his main objective is either to disrupt this forum or to just play games because he spews nothing but rhetoric and nonsense. You may try and deny that a man's character and integrity doesn't come in to play when having an argument or debate all you want but the simple fact of the matter is that it has everything to do with the matter at hand. Just like being a witness at a trial, credibility is the main issue on any topic. You destroy their credibility and you destroy their testimony or argument, whichever the case may be. You also can't reason with anyone who wishes to be unreasonable, just like you can't avoid a collision with anyone who is determined to collide with you. So, to answer your question about what this has to do with this topic, it has plenty to do with the topic. Not to be sarcastic, but why did you feel the need to make this reply and what did you expect to get accomplished?

    As for your remark about me presenting myself as a highly intelligent individual, that couldn't be further from the truth. I'm just an average man that actually thinks what he wants to get accomplished and which words I use before I just start typing or opening my mouth. One had best
    prepare oneself if he wishes to stand up for what he believes in because there will be those who will be out to destroy his integrity and credibility and that is a fact. Again, not to be sarcastic,which in my opinion, is exactly what you have tried to do here.

    So, getting on topic with your question about me having any solutions on how to resolve our failing Teamster pension plan. Yet, once again, not to be sarcastic but in my opinion that's a pretty lame and premature question to ask before investigating why and how the fund got in the
    predicament in the first place because there's no doubt in my mind that the fund fell victim to fraud, irresponsibility and lack of oversight. Only when and if those culprits are revealed can anyone even attempt to come up with any viable solutions to right the wrong. That is, unless one is foolish enough to actually believe the word of thieves and liars. Then by all means, just rollover and accept getting screwed because it will be well deserved.

    I have been reading your posts and realize that you have "that something is better than nothing" mentality and just rollover and accept what you are told and live with it but as you see there are many who believe as I and won't just rollover, or the members of the CSPF would be receiving those cuts as we speak. So, just because you choose to rollover and accept things the way they are without question, first by pouting and then uttering a quiet moan once in awhile about your 31% reduction, doesn't mean everyone else will. Not to be sarcastic but that's the difference between you and I, someone may knock me down but I will at least try to get back up, not just lie there and moan. So you see, that bully may end up getting my lunch money but he will have to earn it, and earn it he will, everyday. And to me, there's no shame in that.

    Remember, you were the one that asked me a question and was wondering about my so called rant and tirade so I just answered you as courteous as I possibly could while remaining honest and sincere.

    In this day and age, how anyone can be so naïve and complaisant when it comes to the corruption in our government to the wall street bankers is beyond me. Maybe you could try and explain that one to me. You want to talk about being counterproductive, why are so many so upset at those who just wish to keep fighting for what they have earned?

    Oh, and by the way, there isn't a snowball's chance that the topic of this thread would ever come to fruition but then again, wishful thinking never hurt anyone. But what will hurt is not speaking up and just accepting corruption as the norm.

    I will end this post by giving my thanks and appreciation to all those retirees and active members in the CSPF who are fighting to save their pensions. If it weren't for you, the pension cuts would already have been in place. That's one thing they didn't count on, so many still having what it takes to stand up and actually fight for something they earned instead of just rolling over! The spirit of Teamsters past is not forgotten, at least not yet.
     
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  14. nounionfool

    nounionfool Banned

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    Apostolic: Since you felt the need to question my motives on a particular subject, I feel the need to question your motive about something I have been wondering about myself ever since I analyzed these two posts of yours:

    You first mentioned Jimmy Hoffa Sr., then produced a video that was to supposedly show what happened to the CSPF. Then in the next post, you go on with your afterthought on how you saw and heard how the Teamsters Pension Fund was squandered (wasted) by loans to the mob, for the construction of casinos to which there is no way of knowing if those loans were ever repaid, or just forgotten. Tell me, just why in the world are you now trying to imply that Hoffa Sr. was the one responsible for the dilemma the CSPF finds itself in today? Just what possible motive would one have to now try and blame a man that's been missing for over 40 years? Are you serious?

    All that video shows is that Hoffa Sr. loaned money to the mob and casinos, I say so what, as long as he made money for the fund, which I along with many others believe he did by the way:

    In the 1960's and 1970's, the Teamsters' huge Central States pension fund was a wellspring of union corruption. Tens of millions of dollars were loaned to racketeers who used the money to gain control of Las Vegas casinos. Administrative jobs were awarded to favored insiders who paid themselves big fees.

    Starting in the early 1960's, the fund loaned tens of millions of dollars for investments in Las Vegas casinos, including the Desert Inn, Caesars Palace, Stardust, Circus Circus, the Landmark Hotel and the Aladdin Hotel, according to a history by Edwin H. Stier, a former federal prosecutor hired by the union as part of its efforts to clean house.

    But many of the loans did serve their intended purpose, making money to pay for Teamsters' retirement benefits. The hotels, casinos and other real estate projects, not all of which were connected to organized crime, were generally profitable, according to Mr. Stier, and before his disappearance Hoffa saw to it that his loans were repaid.

    Since 1982, under a consent decree with the federal government, the fund has been run by prominent Wall Street firms and monitored by a federal court and the Labor Department. There have been no more shadowy investments, no more loans to crime bosses. Yet in these expert hands, the aging fund has fallen into greater financial peril than when James R. Hoffa, who built the Teamsters into a national power, used it as a slush fund.


    http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/15/business/teamsters-find-pensions-at-risk.html?_r=3

    I'll say one thing that I have absolutely no doubt and that is that our country is run by the Federal Mafia, the Fed and the Wall Street bankers and they hate competition! In my opinion, our government says it's Ok for institutions and corporations to steal from the working class as long as they get a piece of the pie but crossing that line to actually make money for the working class is transgression which is punishable, like Hoffa Sr. soon found out. After all, there's no money to be made there by the Federal Mafia. You may accept that as a norm, I do not!

    So please, do tell, just what was your motive? Does it make you feel better putting the blame on a man that has been missing for 40 years because you can't do anything about that...it's in the past right? But as you say about the past,thats the breaks,we just need to move on & do the best we can with the present. The problem is, it wasn't in the past, it's in the here and now, and that is with the Federal Mafia, the Fed and the Wall Street bankers. Whether one wants to acknowledge that fact or not is totally up to them because if they were, that is something one can try to do something about...isn't it?
     
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  15. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Oh my you sure type a lot of print,although it does look like you put a lot of thought in your posts.

    My motive is very simple,we can only live in the moment,the past is history we can look back,however we can't get it back.
    We need to learn from past errors,& do the best we can with the present.
    So there you have it,short & sweet thats about it my friend!
     
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  16. nounionfool

    nounionfool Banned

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    You may think that I put a lot of thought into my posts but as much as it pains me to say, I think that many of your posts are pointless and have a serious lack of profundity. I would even go as far as saying that some of them have a profound deceitful nature to them. After all, I see how you so conveniently ignored and refused to answer my questions as to why you are now trying to imply that Hoffa Sr. was the one responsible for the dilemma the CSPF finds itself in today and what possible motive would you have to now try and blame a man that's been missing for over 40 years? You said that your motive was very simple as we can only live in the moment, the past is history. But that is not what your statements implied, you tried to alter history to suit your needs and don't try and tell me that you didn't. In all honestly, I really can't blame you for refusing to answer those questions, after all, no one wants to come here and look foolish. That's why it is best for you to keep your replies short and sweet. At least you are smart enough to realize that the longer replies have more ammunition available for someone that wishes to use another's own words against himself.

    And you are right, one does to need to learn from past errors so they can do the best they can with the present. The problem with that, as we can see with your reply, is that very few heed their own advice.

    How's this for short and sweet my friend?
     
  17. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Oh my word, I can see you are really working at getting a negative response from me with some of your pointed comments.
    Thing is I thought I had addressed your question to my motive of bringing up past errors of those who controlled our teamster pension.
    Which was to shed light on this thread topic.

    As far as judging James Hoffa Sr.,or anyone else, that is not up to me.
    If anyone is a Bible believer they know there is coming a final judgement from God,the creator of all things.
    He alone has the right to judge anything,or anyone.
    I myself personally don't care what anyone thinks of me,other than God almighty.
    He is the only one I have to give an account to when the time comes.
    As for arguments,or debates,I live in peace by taking the easy way out,as to agree to disagree,& letting it go.
     
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  18. nounionfool

    nounionfool Banned

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    Excuse me, I'm not out for a negative response but I would appreciate a truthful one. If it truly was like you say that as far as judging James Hoffa Sr.is not up to you, then why did you? Why did you first insinuate, then implicate? Because it seems to me, after making those incriminating remarks, all you want to do now is hide behind the bible. Like you said yourself, you always take the easy way out which is so obvious to see.

    IMO...one was meant to stand behind the bible, not hide behind it. I guess we may both have some accounting to do when that time comes but at the very least, I realize that I'm just human and don't pretend that I'm perfect in the Lord's eyes.
     
  19. Apostolic

    Apostolic Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Hmm I went back & read my posts when I first came into this topic.
    I don't see that I was doing anymore than I have stated to you nonunionfool.
    Which was to address the question asked about 'What happened to the Central States fund.

    I was actually a Teamster back in the Hoffa Sr.,years,back when the Teamsters were a force to recon with.
    Back in the day when the United States Government was totally afraid of them.

    Mr.Hoffa got us some mighty sweet contracts back in those days,when there was a strike that closed up most of the industry in the country.
    The Teamsters also had to do a lot with making all industries in general more safer for their workers.
    Yes sir back in the day when we deadlined a truck for safety issues, it didn't move until the issues were repaired.

    No I really don't have anything against any union officials,even those few who were a little on the shady side.
    That is not to judge any of them, its the truth.
    Man I could tell you some true stories about those days.

    However as I cruise the trucking board to find topics of interest,I feel this topic has lost my appeal.
    I may stop by from time to time to see how its going,but for me I'm done.
    You all be blessed & I hope everything works out for you.
     
  20. nounionfool

    nounionfool Banned

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    I'm not arguing the fact that you didn't address the question asked about 'What happened to the Central States fund. You answered it sure enough because here's how you addressed it:

    And here is the question that I had for you:

    There is where my concern is, you insinuated and then implicated Hoffa Sr. as being the main culprit for the dilemma the CSPF finds itself in today. You either meant it as such or you didn't, that was my question because that's how I interpreted your statements and just wanted it clarified if that's the way you intended it to be, which I never did get a straight answer. IMO...the answer is as simple as that, you either meant it as such or you didn't.

    I'm not claiming that Jimmy Hoffa Sr. was perfect because nobody is, but like you said, he did so many significant things to make our union what I considered "was" the best, and I now say "was" because Hoffa Jr. is slowly chipping away at everything his dad worked so hard to build. In my opinion, today, we are just a shell of our former self. Hoffa Jr. isn't half the man his father was and this new generation of Teamsters don't have half the dignity, pride and courage of the Teamster's past.

    I have to be honest and I'm not claiming to be right but I do judge people because I have plenty against many of union officials who I consider corrupt, looking out for their own best interests or just going along for the ride. The members will have to remain strong and find a way to band together and find common ground if we're to ever stand a chance at making this union great again and weed out those who are corrupt, self- serving and just going along for the ride.

    I'm sorry to hear that you feel this topic has lost appeal but I sincerely hope everything works out for you too. Contrary to popular opinion, I'm not all that incorrigible and rarely hold a grudge with those I have had disagreements with. Like I said, I'm far from perfect but I do try.
     
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