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ABF | To all members that are struggling with this decision

Originally Posted by madmatt04
Any company at anytime can decide they are not making money...or enough money, and pull the plug. Think about these points:
1) no company in this country will match our health plan
2) our pension is protected... And in some cases increased
3) unlike YRCW we have the opportunity to increase our wage. We stand to make a great deal of money as the next 5 years pass!
4) Article 26 is for fire-able offenses. "Theft and dis-honesty except for time related". Unless your stealing **** off the truck you have nothing to fear. You're not going to get fired for grabbing a cup of coffee off route.
5) to all of you that can "Work Anywhere". Please send me the address of this mystical place where you're gonna get a better deal!
You have the right to be mad-matt. Why risk all of the above? ABF can't grow the business having the highest cost structure on the planet. The freight teamsters are a dying breed as it is. Take Hostess for example. Not freight but the thinking was it is better to shut it down and go down with honor. Nuts eh? There seems to be a serious problem of delusions of grandeur - a delusion (common in paranoia) that you are much greater and more powerful and influential than you really are in some ABF teamsters.

I think I seen one other post other then yours who values his job more then his ego. My hat is off to you, bro. We can only hope the silent majority feel as you do. You got some very ignorant team-mates like the ABF'er who is willing to throw it all away in the belief he is a teamster god or maybe he thinks his 20 years will shield him from losing his job. He couldn't care less about the company losses or job security. He feels he's too big too good for this scenario to happen to him. He's delusional brother. He's fighting a battle he cannot win. We can only hope the delusional wacko is not of the majority or another 7000 teamster jobs will go the way of Hostess.


I'm actually impressed!
The name-calling irrational comments by ABF management are outstanding!

Bravo! What circus act will you perform next?

Post a few substantiated facts on this thread instead of childish comments.

After all, we all are adults! We are Teamster's!
 
madmatt04 said:
Any company at anytime can decide they are not making money...or enough money, and pull the plug. Think about these points:
1) no company in this country will match our health plan
2) our pension is protected... And in some cases increased
3) unlike YRCW we have the opportunity to increase our wage. We stand to make a great deal of money as the next 5 years pass!
4) Article 26 is for fire-able offenses. "Theft and dis-honesty except for time related". Unless your stealing **** off the truck you have nothing to fear. You're not going to get fired for grabbing a cup of coffee off route.
5) to all of you that can "Work Anywhere". Please send me the address of this mystical place where you're gonna get a better deal!
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I like your points

1) Obama care is coming and our healthcare plan won't be saved remember the teamsters fought to get Obama care.

2) the pension is broke wake up I'm in central states its at 53.9% funded and loosing 5% a year. This is dumb the math dose'nt work. Why are you kidding yourselves.

3) I can live with the wage package I'm not happy but with all the money being thrown away on a broke pension I understand.

4) some of the language sounds scary to me I don't like this seems like alot of room for abuse by the company.

5) my worries are there is no teeth for excessive use of subs . Lots of room for abuse and no way to verify. Remember the PSE and what we were told and look how many road jobs were lost. ABF is still loosing money on the PSE.

6) my biggest worry is

Bids will be based on 60% of the lane nation wide vs 75% we have now -15% loss
Plus -6% loss to subs
Turn runs only bid on cut time - were gonna loose miles.
No bids on unbalanced lanes - they can unbalance a lane with a stroke of a key
 
dave larson said:
Matt I wish I could be as trusting as you. 25 years in the bus makes that almost impossible for me LOL. I believe that health plan changes are in the works already. Like someone mentioned above I believe guys with time in will be targeted with the electronics. I dont know if it is true but I have been told that Judy said no truck driver is worth 60000 dollars. Kinda SHOWS WHAT WE ARE DEALING WITH.
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I'm with you I just don't trust ABF. I see lots of room for abuse by bad management or the fort.
 
ABFer said:
Not to mention how vague 'dishonesty' and 'theft of time' are and how they can be (mis)construed. This is the type of sloppy language UPS has and it costs the members dearly.
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Yes exactly he speaks the truth!!!
I served 5years UPS package.
 
nothumbleenough said:
Dave you seem like an individual with lots of common sense, but for the life of me I cant understand why you would put out such an unsubstantiated rumor concerning the $60000 trucker. This kind of comment will invoke strong feelings and I would hope we could be a little more respectful of the facts versus the rumor mill.
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Like I said I don't know it to be true, just like many guys on here DON"T KNOW IT TO BE TRUE that yrc will buy us, or ABF will lock us out, or ABF will close the doors, or Panther will take our freight etc etc etc. At least I admitted I wasn't 100%. I hear there is a video, I will try to locate.
 
The second to the last word says it all ( I )
NextGen Teamster said:
The time has come for Teamsters to change their way of thinking. We've strangled all of our companies for too long now. Most teamster companies have already been choked out and died. Now our ABF is asking you to release your stranglehold just enough to allow them to continue to exist, and you say, "No"? All they want is a chance to finally show a profit, and you say "No". They ask for the means to actually fire a worthless employee, not because he's older and slower, but because he takes advantage of the untouchable nature of a Teamster, and he sleeps in the truck (even after the trailer is unloaded), or takes extra breaks. Shouldn't they BE fired? In my opinion, they should not only be fired.... the Union should NOT have the power to bring them back. I'm thinking that most/all of the lines of the contract that you oppose, are necessary for the company to survive and compete. Maybe you don't NEED the company to survive much longer, but I do!
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nothumbleenough said:
Dave you seem like an individual with lots of common sense, but for the life of me I cant understand why you would put out such an unsubstantiated rumor concerning the $60000 trucker. This kind of comment will invoke strong feelings and I would hope we could be a little more respectful of the facts versus the rumor mill.
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90% of the rhetoric posted by the YES guys is unsubstantiated rumor or sky is falling supposition at best. NHE you know I value what you bring to the discussion, but you way off base on this one
 
dave larson said:
90% of the rhetoric posted by the YES guys is unsubstantiated rumor or sky is falling supposition at best. NHE you know I value what you bring to the discussion, but you way off base on this one
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James Welch of YRC has made a public offer to buy ABF for $18 a share. There is no confusion on this. The debate that ensues is are we Preston or Roadway? Neither is very appealing!
 
nothumbleenough said:
James Welch of YRC has made a public offer to buy ABF for $18 a share. There is no confusion on this. The debate that ensues is are we Preston or Roadway? Neither is very appealing!
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First I dont believe it was legit offer. I have always believed this was settlement more than negotiation. We can agree to disagree on that. That was ONE of the MANY rumors mentioned. My point being this whole discussion of the contract proposal is based on MAYBES and WHAT IFS. So to say that my supposition is any different...........is hypocritical.
 
dave larson said:
First I dont believe it was legit offer. I have always believed this was settlement more than negotiation. We can agree to disagree on that. That was ONE of the MANY rumors mentioned. My point being this whole discussion of the contract proposal is based on MAYBES and WHAT IFS. So to say that my supposition is any different...........is hypocritical.
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Dave, I much appreciate the conversation. When a CEO publicly comments on purchasing another company it is not supposition. In the case of Welch and YRC, it is supposition to say this is somehow a settlement from a stupid lawsuit. Point of fact, not opinion, this lawsuit issue has been heard in the appeals court of our federal court system. You cannot have a "settlement" without there being some sort of disclosure considering two of the parties are publicly traded companies. Secondly, would you agree with your Union experience that the Preston experience is a pretty reasonable conclusion?
 
nothumbleenough said:
Dave, I much appreciate the conversation. When a CEO publicly comments on purchasing another company it is not supposition. In the case of Welch and YRC, it is supposition to say this is somehow a settlement from a stupid lawsuit. Point of fact, not opinion, this lawsuit issue has been heard in the appeals court of our federal court system. You cannot have a "settlement" without there being some sort of disclosure considering two of the parties are publicly traded companies. Secondly, would you agree with your Union experience that the Preston experience is a pretty reasonable conclusion?
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NHE, of course I am aware that no legal settlement has been reached. Would collusion have been a better choice of words? LOL. CEO public comments would not fall under..... suppositions, but they sure the hell could fall under.........maybes and what ifs. I firmly stand behind my point this whole discussion is MAYBES and WHAT IFS. If we going to engage in the futility of debating "what ifs", lets not digress into semantic debates on top of that. NHE I am not familiar with the Preston story. Help me out.
 
Yellow bought Saia, Jevic and Preston in the late 90's. They kept Saia and Jevic but shut down Preston and used all their equipment at Yellow. From what I have been told, the drivers had no dovetail rights. Therefore out of a job. I would think many in these pages could confirm the Preston Story and how it relates to our current situation.
 
nothumbleenough said:
Yellow bought Saia, Jevic and Preston in the late 90's. They kept Saia and Jevic but shut down Preston and used all their equipment at Yellow. From what I have been told, the drivers had no dovetail rights. Therefore out of a job. I would think many in these pages could confirm the Preston Story and how it relates to our current situation.
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Dose'nt matter the subs will get all my work I'm screwed either way.
 
nothumbleenough said:
Yellow bought Saia, Jevic and Preston in the late 90's. They kept Saia and Jevic but shut down Preston and used all their equipment at Yellow. From what I have been told, the drivers had no dovetail rights. Therefore out of a job. I would think many in these pages could confirm the Preston Story and how it relates to our current situation.
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Didn't doubt ya NHE, just wasn't familiar with what happened. No confirmation needed I take you at your word.
 
'What if' we are successful in voting this thing down? Will we get a better deal by sending them back to the table? I can only assume that while they're 'on their way back to the table', our customers will be 'on their way' to other carriers and Welch will be 'on his way' back to the Fort. Our stock will be 'on its way' down, and shareholders will be 'on their way' to deeper frustration over losing money. My fear is that ultimately, I may be 'on my way' to wearing a YRC hat and taking a bigger cut than what we're currently being asked to take(if I'm lucky enough to keep my job at all).
 
JAFO said:
'What if' we are successful in voting this thing down? Will we get a better deal by sending them back to the table? I can only assume that while they're 'on their way back to the table', our customers will be 'on their way' to other carriers and Welch will be 'on his way' back to the Fort. Our stock will be 'on its way' down, and shareholders will be 'on their way' to deeper frustration over losing money. My fear is that ultimately, I may be 'on my way' to wearing a YRC hat and taking a bigger cut than what we're currently being asked to take(if I'm lucky enough to keep my job at all).
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you can swing and get your ass kicked or ya can just take a beatin, either way I think were gonna get hurt in some way. I gotta take a swing. JMO
 
Swing hard and true. And take pride in the fact that you were willing to take that swing. But be prepared for the horrific results that may ensue if the collective 'punch' lands and is felt. I fear that by the time the parties meet back at the negotiating table, the company will be in a much, much worse financial position than its in now. But it will be way cool to tell everyone at the unemployment office about how hard you swung.
Seriously, wake up!
 
nothumbleenough said:
Yellow bought Saia, Jevic and Preston in the late 90's. They kept Saia and Jevic but shut down Preston and used all their equipment at Yellow. From what I have been told, the drivers had no dovetail rights. Therefore out of a job. I would think many in these pages could confirm the Preston Story and how it relates to our current situation.
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You forgot about the USF buyout I was there they announced our closure on day one they owned us. They paid 1.37 billion to eliminate competition plus terminals and equipment
 
JAFO said:
Swing hard and true. And take pride in the fact that you were willing to take that swing. But be prepared for the horrific results that may ensue if the collective 'punch' lands and is felt. I fear that by the time the parties meet back at the negotiating table, the company will be in a much, much worse financial position than its in now. But it will be way cool to tell everyone at the unemployment office about how hard you swung.
Seriously, wake up!
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We differ in our prognostications, you seem to feel that horrific results may ensue, I don't. I have been through this scare BS for 8 contracts. I am willing to take that risk. What about 6 months from now when they say we are cutting your med coverage? Swinging yet? What about 1 yr from now when they say we arent going to contribute to your pension? Swinging yet? What about 18 months from now when they say they need another 15% back? Swinging yet? Been in this business a long time, I cant recall when a concession has saved a company and labor got it back. Maybe someone can help me out. I can't recall one. The way it seems to go, is there are concessions, labor eats it. Big boys get huge severance packages and golden parachutes made from your concessions. We will all draw the line somewhere. For me it is here. Vote your heart brothers
 
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