Joe the plumber
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Yet another instigating punk remark. nothumbleenough is a far more interesting poster then you'll ever be. Muler can handle it..butt out
ABF | Would you defer your contract raises until December. ABF Only
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Yet another instigating punk remark. nothumbleenough is a far more interesting poster then you'll ever be. Muler can handle it..butt out
Dont push your luck you can still get banned, this is not the yrc forum where you got away with name calling & got another member banned....
Joe the plumber
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Don't push my luck? What luck? I was already banned for merely posting in the ABF forum. I broke no rule or insulted no one. It was back when there was this aura of invincibility of ABF teamsters even being questioned or challenged about the contract. Now there is quarreling about what should be given back before you even hear from headquarters or the IBT
How does that affect you? Your a retired yrc driver that can't let go....
nothumbleenough
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Have you looked at the poll started by Muler about being open to different solutions with CSPF. Currently, 68% are open to other options. 32% stay in the current pension plan. I believe the majority of the group that you say I am not popular with (and I agree with your statement) support the minority 32% of no changes. Yet my position, open to changes has the majority over 2 to 1. Why do you think that it is? My best guess is lots of folks come into these pages looking for any and all information but don't participate due to the hostile nature received from the "moderator" of the boards on opinions contrary to his. I would be interested ABFer in your explanation of why 68% of those in ABF truckingboards are open to change and why we don't see much conversation from these folks.
We are not against having a change, we are open for idea's. The only thing I am not open to is having our pension cut. Their are other options that will be good for both the company and for our members. It sounds like you are promoting pension relieve and cuts to our pension. I wonder how old you are and how many years you have as a teamster?
nothumbleenough
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You asked, and I have answered this before. I'm interested in your definition of solidarity.
You seem to interpret change as an all out exit from our defined pension plan. I have told you in the past that many of the voters and I have spoken and we all agreed that change is a likely answer to our pension system. But we do not in any way think that a cut in our benefits is going to happen. You mistaken the poll as to mean a vote for change called for a total change from our defined benefit plan and that would make you completely off base. ABF teamsters will not settle for less we have earned our benefits and that will be evident when and if an attempt is made to do so. Remember most of the other plans are doing well and that in it's self would make any vote for a reduction almost impossible. I find it interesting that you want less for us. But you are what you are and you are but just one person. I see you could not find a way to rebut that CSPF has been holding steady for well over a year now. You still have not posted all the links for your numbers that you have posted. I wonder why? No you will go as we the majority vote and that will be a fact. YOUR BROTHER WITH A PENSION ALWAYS!
D
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I have looked at the poll and I am one of the 68% and I disagree that most of the people you are not popular with are in the 32%. But like you said, it it what you believe, at least you didn't try to tout it as fact. I am open to some changes but not a giveaway as you seem to be. Whether or not it is what you want or are looking for you come off as willing to just give away some of our pension contributions. I believe that there are less that 32% on here that want that.
nothumbleenough
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Open to change means I am open to change the current plan. Really Muler, are you having a difficult to understanding the term change?
I am not for ABF teamsters receiving less than the benefits earned. I am against ABF paying for retirement benefits to employees who never worked a day at ABF. The figure we are talking about is roughly 45 million a year.
I can back up any statistic I have quoted as fact. I said the pension has average a loss of 2.2 Billion since 2008. I backed that up with a link showing the loss since 2008 at 9.1 Billion. 2012 is not over with. I cannot tell you how much it will lose for the calender year considering the year is not over. But since I have a chance to get you on the record, are you willing to say it will be up in total assets for the calender year 2012? I am sure you and I will still be arguing when the numbers are released. Please state your opinion, will the CSPF be up or down in total assets for the calender year 2012? I will make sure I save your response.
You sure seem to be really up tight. What has happened since I was off? I like how you say the fund has lost an average of 2.2 billion a year since 2008. You and I both know that is what you had earlier called a RED HERRING isn't it. Because the bulk of that loss was in 2008 to the tune of roughly 6 billion dollars correct. Now would you please show your links for each year from 2008 to 2011 so the members can see for themselves what you are saying? In the mean time I will post links to SHOW YOU there have been meetings and discussions on the HILL about our pension funds for years.You are way behind on the pension curve. You have been crying the sky is falling and it has been being addressed for years. You still have not said how we the ABF Teamsters could clear up any pension liability concerns ABF may have. You keep saying that ABF needs relief but how do you think we the ABF Teamsters could help? As you know giving up any of our benefits would be out of the question. But let's hear your ideas as to how we can get them a better deal. Unless you think we should drive them too the brink of closure then do as yrc did and allow them to defer and then reduce their contribution amount thus throwing we the ABF Teamsters into the DEFAULT Plan. That doesn't seem like a very viable solution to me. So you have been on here whining for months and yet you have not given one viable option for compromise. Speaking of a RED HERRING! YOUR AWAITING YOUR GREAT RESPONSE BROTHER ALWAYS!
http://www.iwla.com/CustomFiles/downloads/61227723-A559-4B4D-B117-0B2D09C15EE0.pdf
I am waiting for the manner in which we the ABF Teamsters can change the pension liability for ABF. If you want a break for ABF the only way it can be done by us Teamsters is to give back wages and vacation and work rules. And you have stated you can't withstand a wage cut. So what is your answer? We can't vote ABF out with them not paying around a BILLION DOLLARS in liability cost. So if you would please stop whining and tell us how you see this happening. YOUR WAITING FOR THE ANSWER BROTHER ALWAYS!
truxforever
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Muler The CEO of ABF freight said himself that they can't withdraw from the fund, the cost would be to high.
truxforever
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After reading page 205, I can see them going that way Muler, but is there something we can do. It looks like it will be out of our hands.
My Brother we the ABF Teamsters must stand together and make sure we are not wronged. We don't ask for anything that we have not earned. In my opinion if they took that route to CHEAT US OUT OF OUR PENSIONS we would have nothing to lose by exploring every avenue to seek justice. You have to remember they just added this clause to our pension fund. Just think of the hundreds of Teamster companies that were put out of business because they could not afford to pay the pension payments. And for CSPF and the IBT along with ABF to now by virtue of them having Trustees and Appointed Teamsters Trustees on a board that could and would deprive us of our pensions and to use distressed employer clause to exit the fund would be nothing short of ROBBERY. Now ABF has not as of yet attempted to use this clause and I pray to GOD they never try this maneuver. Remember it was the companies and the IBT that allowed UPS to get out and it was these same groups that allowed yrc to skirt the withdraw liabilities. Yes it was the companies and the IBT that have brought the wolves to our pension fund doors. It was them that allowed the investment companies that lost BILLIONS of our dollars to go away forever. The very Trustees and lets not forget mr. nyhan and all he HAS NOT DONE FOR CSPF and he is still there. No if this BACK STABBING TACTIC is ever enacted we would have no choice but to fight back with everything in our powers. Let's pray ABF still has more respect for their Teamsters than to allow this to be done to them. YOUR BROTHER ALWAYS!
Joe the plumber
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I can't believe that all balderdash you're spouting at us muler
nothumbleenough
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This is REALITY. Yes it sucks, but it is REALITY. Muler, this isn't any different than if your regular mortgage payment of 850 is raised to 1300 because your neighbors cannot afford to make their payment. You don't live in the house, you will not receive a penny in equity but the payment is increased to cover the shortfall of others. Remember, you have a member down the street who only pays .25 cent for every dollar you pay and he owns three times the homes in the neighborhood.
So according to you, Tyson Johnson is cheating you. Tom Nylan is cheating you. And ABF is about to cheat you because they are no longer willing to pay the pensions of employees who never worked a day at their company. BTW, UPS Paid BILLIONS of dollars to get out of pension liability. The pension has been on a path of failure for 10 years due to changing labor environment within the LTL industry. Our union leaders have avoided the corrected actions based on political calculation. The Calculus has just gotten a lot harder.
I wholeheartedly disagree with the consensus that ABF is going after the distressed status. They have been spending millions in diversifying their assets to subsidiary corporations. A protracted labor dispute is exactly what the doctor ordered to a company that is slowly bleeding itself to death. What do they have to lose but to swing for the fences in a make or break contract?
stillno2abf
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you would agree to $10 a month dues increase????? how insane is that? do you know that our union officials take HUGE pay raises every year and they use OUR dues money to pay for it?? how about our union officials stop takes 10's of thousands of dollars every year in salary increases and use the money towards organizing, you have organizers that are already making well over 100 thousand dollars a year and who have they organized???? wake up man the union is sticking it to us as much as the company when it comes to our money