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ABF | ABF Agreement: Monday, May 20!

Docker said:
Don't try to weasel out now...don't even try and tell me that you didn't admit defeat by stating that labor will probably have to accept some wage cuts and benefit reductions to survive! Did you or did you not make that statement? The only part you left out was just how much of a pay cut and what benefit reductions you were so willing to give up!!!!! So tell us now...the company is watching...this way they will know just what to ask for to get your vote!!!!!!
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Do you just randomly pick certain parts of a post to start a fight? The very next sentence I said "But why would anybody agree to do this until the company fixed the operating issues that they currently have that is draining money?". Not trying to weasel out of anything. As my post stated, I would not even consider concessions until ABF took the time to fix their in house problems that is losing money. So, the answer to your question is yes, I made the statement, but in the future take the time to post the whole statement and not just the parts you want to start an argument.
 
Steward of the Rock said:
Do you just randomly pick certain parts of a post to start a fight? The very next sentence I said "But why would anybody agree to do this until the company fixed the operating issues that they currently have that is draining money?". Not trying to weasel out of anything. As my post stated, I would not even consider concessions until ABF took the time to fix their in house problems that is losing money. So, the answer to your question is yes, I made the statement, but in the future take the time to post the whole statement and not just the parts you want to start an argument.
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What is it with people like you...you think that you can make statements and then just backtrack later when you are called on it? I don't give a crap about what you said before or after that statement...the fact is that you made that statement! Just for your information...ABF will be fixing their house problems...then you can give them that wage cut and benefit reductions that you promised....they just wanted to get a concessionary contract passed first...after all...you can't get concessions if you're making profits...can you?

What I find amazing is that your local was a no in 2010...it seems that your own people don't even take your advice...do they?
 
Docker said:
What is it with people like you...you think that you can make statements and then just backtrack later when you are called on it? I don't give a crap about what you said before or after that statement...the fact is that you made that statement! Just for your information...ABF will be fixing their house problems...then you can give them that wage cut and benefit reductions that you promised....they just wanted to get a concessionary contract passed first...after all...you can't get concessions if you're making profits...can you?

What I find amazing is that your local was a no in 2010...it seems that your own people don't even take your advice...do they?
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I will do what you are so famous for doing by responding to your question with a question. What is it with people like you that want to snip certain parts of a statement to attack without posting the whole statement? Whether you give a crap or not, there are some people that prefer to see what all was said in a statement as opposed to just one sentence. You really have no idea what you are talking about. I was a NO vote in 2010 and you can ask anyone that knows me what I recommended to them if they asked my opinion about the 2010 Concessions. And since you have the inside scoop on how ABF plans to fix their house problems then please share with the rest of us.
 
Steward of the Rock said:
I will do what you are so famous for doing by responding to your question with a question. What is it with people like you that want to snip certain parts of a statement to attack without posting the whole statement? Whether you give a crap or not, there are some people that prefer to see what all was said in a statement as opposed to just one sentence. You really have no idea what you are talking about. I was a NO vote in 2010 and you can ask anyone that knows me what I recommended to them if they asked my opinion about the 2010 Concessions. And since you have the inside scoop on how ABF plans to fix their house problems then please share with the rest of us.
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I answered your question...I can't help that you can't comprehend it...but I will try and slow it down for you this time...Ok? When you make a statement like "When it is all said and done, labor will probably have to accept some wage cuts and benefit reductions to survive."...it doesn't matter what was said before or after the fact!

Well...that does surprise me...you a no vote in 2010...so...why the change of heart now? After all those raises and bonuses given to top management and the purchase of Albert and Panther since coming after our money last time and you make a statement like that! Unless you think that top management deserves more huge raises and bonuses and buy more non asset companies that they want us to pay for. Are you saying that top management deserves to get more and we should accept less?

Now...if you can't see the way the company has been wasting money all over the system,,,especially being a steward...plus the major network changes already in the works as we speak that they will implement soon after the contract is passed...that it being concessionary or not...then you just haven't been doing your job very well...have you? I bet that you and your terminal manager are buddy buddy...so ask him about the changes coming...he knows. Or did he already tell you and wanted you to keep that to yourself?
 
Docker said:
I answered your question...I can't help that you can't comprehend it...but I will try and slow it down for you this time...Ok? When you make a statement like "When it is all said and done, labor will probably have to accept some wage cuts and benefit reductions to survive."...it doesn't matter what was said before or after the fact!

Well...that does surprise me...you a no vote in 2010...so...why the change of heart now? After all those raises and bonuses given to top management and the purchase of Albert and Panther since coming after our money last time and you make a statement like that! Unless you think that top management deserves more huge raises and bonuses and buy more non asset companies that they want us to pay for. Are you saying that top management deserves to get more and we should accept less?

Now...if you can't see the way the company has been wasting money all over the system,,,especially being a steward...plus the major network changes already in the works as we speak that they will implement soon after the contract is passed...that it being concessionary or not...then you just haven't been doing your job very well...have you? I bet that you and your terminal manager are buddy buddy...so ask him about the changes coming...he knows. Or did he already tell you and wanted you to keep that to yourself?
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I am sorry that you obviously can't read very well, but if you will go back and look at the posts where I replied to Go4gold on, you will see that I explained about some of the waste that ABF had from within (RPM). Also, since you don't comprehend very well, I stated that I would vote no to any concessions until ABF gets their house in order. But as usually, you want to take one sentence and try to create something to argue about. Also, if you will take the time to read (Whoops!! Forgot again about your limited reading ability), I also stated in one of those posts that Judy M. got a $455,000 raise in 2011 and that even with her reduced income for 2012 that she was still making roughly $50,000 more than she did in 2010. I then said that I would vote yes to 35% pay increase followed by a 30% pay decrease the next year. I do know my terminal manager very well as I have to talk to him every day representing my co-workers or trying to get a problem fixed, or gathering information for a grievence. So, you are way off base on your assessment of me, but I really don't give a rat's a$$ what you think about me anyway.
 
Steward of the Rock said:
I am sorry that you obviously can't read very well, but if you will go back and look at the posts where I replied to Go4gold on, you will see that I explained about some of the waste that ABF had from within (RPM). Also, since you don't comprehend very well, I stated that I would vote no to any concessions until ABF gets their house in order. But as usually, you want to take one sentence and try to create something to argue about. Also, if you will take the time to read (Whoops!! Forgot again about your limited reading ability), I also stated in one of those posts that Judy M. got a $455,000 raise in 2011 and that even with her reduced income for 2012 that she was still making roughly $50,000 more than she did in 2010. I then said that I would vote yes to 35% pay increase followed by a 30% pay decrease the next year. I do know my terminal manager very well as I have to talk to him every day representing my co-workers or trying to get a problem fixed, or gathering information for a grievence. So, you are way off base on your assessment of me, but I really don't give a rat's a$$ what you think about me anyway.
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Who are you trying to BS! You sure do care what I think of you or you wouldn't be trying to weasel out of that statement you made and you didn't even know you were making to a management POS. No...my assessment of you is crystal clear...try as you may...you will never be able to justify making that statement...a steward on a public forum to a management POS to boot.You were played for a sucker by that POS...way to go...you really showed go4gold...lol

And you are right...I do want to take one sentence and make something out of it because just that one sentence tells me that you are already beginning to accept concessions. You really are proud of that steward position too...aren't you...after all...you sure wanted to let everyone know by making it part of your username. You even went as far as to ask my classification and where I was out of too like you thought that title would mean something to me...didn't you? I got news for you...it means something when the man behind that title is worthy of it! That's why you became a steward...for the title. Tell me...am I way off base again...lol
 
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Docker said:
Who are you trying to BS! You sure do care what I think of you or you wouldn't be trying to weasel out of that statement you made and you didn't even know you were making to a management POS. No...my assessment of you is crystal clear...try as you may...you will never be able to justify making that statement...a steward on a public forum to a management POS to boot.You were played for a sucker by that POS...way to go...you really showed go4gold...lol

And you are right...I do want to take one sentence and make something out of it because just that one sentence tells me that you are already beginning to accept concessions. You really are proud of that steward position too...aren't you...after all...you sure wanted to let everyone know by making it part of your username. You even went as far as to ask my classification and where I was out of too like you thought that title would mean something to me...didn't you? I got news for you...it means something when the man behind that title is worthy of it! That's why you became a steward...for the title. Tell me...am I way off base again...lol
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This is getting comical now. I was not trying to show Go4gold anything. I was simply having a conversation with the guy on why I would be voting no on this contract offer if there are any concessions. You really should get over yourself. You were the one that made the comment about me being a steward, so I confirmed that I am one and where at. By the way, you still have not told us about what the network changes are going to be within the company from your earlier post. You told me to ask my terminal manager what they are since, as you put it, I am so buddy, buddy with him. I've got a better idea. Since you have already got this vital information from your terminal manager, why don't you share it with all of us so we don't have to do what you had to to get this information. Also, being a steward is very hard work as obviously you cannot please everyone. I would gladly step aside and let someone else be the steward here if that is what our members wanted. I would ask you if you have ever been a steward or served in any union capacity, but you would probably just get offended like you did when I responded to your comment about being a steward.
 
No....even in his heyday, I don't think Joe was that articulate......and there's no little animated cartoons....... But Go4Gold, I think you've stirred up the suspicions of a few of us as to your motives. Your argument seems to distill down to whether the company was mismanaged into a hole by overpaid, incompetent managers, or whether it was mismanaged into a hole by overpaid, incompetent managers forced to pay a decent wage to the labor force, that couldn't have their compensation cut on the whim of the same overpaid and incompetent managers, blaming it on "ebb and flow" of business. Steward of the Rock does make a good point about ABF's threat to cut the labor force if they don't get a concessionary contract. We're all working 10 or 11 hour days,......an 8 hour day is a thing of the past. If they lay off more employees, how much more will they start paying in overtime? ...Can they physically get the overtime out of us old, tired codgers? Didn't ABF used to have about 14,000 employees a decade ago? No wonder we're all working massive overtime, we've got to pick up the slack of about 7,500 other people. Or, how about this, Go4Gold? Since trucking is not covered by the Fair Labor Standards Act of 1938, and consequently are exempt from overtime laws,.......except when negotiated........why doesn't ABF propose to remove the overtime provisions in the contract? Too obvious? That would certainly lower our standards down to some of our ......ummm....."competitors". The only problem with that is that the reason ABF has the employees they do, is because we realize what our labor is worth, and....speaking for myself only,....I think I'm a little smarter than to go to work for a company that doesn't compensate for overtime. This is, after all, the 21st century. ABF and it's......"competitors"....are very different companies.......not comparable at all.
 
This TA will have concessions, that is a fact, whether they will go back to the table is yet to be seen, Docker seems sure they will....I'm not betting on it...play your own hand when it's dealt and hope for the best, I've enjoyed working at ABF these last two years and would work here for less, since I'll surely work somewhere else for less, but, it won't be at YRC...you guys with 17 or so years may get to take a few spots over there, but there won't be that many when they run most of ABF's customers off...but by all means do what you think is right and I shall do the same
 
TurnCoat said:
This TA will have concessions, that is a fact, whether they will go back to the table is yet to be seen, Docker seems sure they will....I'm not betting on it...play your own hand when it's dealt and hope for the best, I've enjoyed working at ABF these last two years and would work here for less, since I'll surely work somewhere else for less, but, it won't be at YRC...you guys with 17 or so years may get to take a few spots over there, but there won't be that many when they run most of ABF's customers off...but by all means do what you think is right and I shall do the same
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Turncoat, that pretty much sums it up. If you are comfortable with what the tenative agreement offers then by all means vote yes. If you are not comfortable with what it has to offer then vote no. I will vote no if there are any wage or benefit cuts but that is just me.
 
TurnCoat said:
This TA will have concessions, that is a fact, whether they will go back to the table is yet to be seen, Docker seems sure they will....I'm not betting on it...play your own hand when it's dealt and hope for the best, I've enjoyed working at ABF these last two years and would work here for less, since I'll surely work somewhere else for less, but, it won't be at YRC...you guys with 17 or so years may get to take a few spots over there, but there won't be that many when they run most of ABF's customers off...but by all means do what you think is right and I shall do the same
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I agree with Brother Docker, ...Brother Turncoat, when they see the terrorization program doesn't bear fruit, then they'll return for more honest negotiations. If ABF was in such dire straits, why isn't top management jumping ship? And......if they're so badly compensated for their .....ummm...."skills"......again, why aren't they leaving, in the proverbial droves? Watch what they do, not what they say. As in the case of YRC,......so broke they had to rob their employees three times, yet apparently had the money to pay two Teamster appointees $250,000 a month,....Pay "Dollar Bill" Zollars a handsome Golden Parachute to leave,....according to Go4Gold, apparently they have the money to compensate their top executives at about 5 times what ABF is doing......none of whom,...other than Mr. Zollars seems to be leaving,....yet,...and even though they had the paperwork filed with the SEC too, they were so broke they had to pick their employees' pockets three times....and yet Mr. Welch somehow, mysteriously, can come up with $451 million to purchase ABF,...and still pay dividends on stock? Anyone feel like they got "snookered"?
 
Steward of the Rock said:
Turncoat, that pretty much sums it up. If you are comfortable with what the tenative agreement offers then by all means vote yes. If you are not comfortable with what it has to offer then vote no. I will vote no if there are any wage or benefit cuts but that is just me.
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Now that's a post of respect. Far too many so called union brothers demean others who will vote for concessions.

Docker is by far the worst.
 
Steward of the Rock said:
Turncoat, that pretty much sums it up. If you are comfortable with what the tenative agreement offers then by all means vote yes. If you are not comfortable with what it has to offer then vote no. I will vote no if there are any wage or benefit cuts but that is just me.
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That's what its all about EVERYONE has a say. We live with the end results on move on.
 
canaryinthemine said:
I agree with Brother Docker, ...Brother Turncoat, when they see the terrorization program doesn't bear fruit, then they'll return for more honest negotiations. If ABF was in such dire straits, why isn't top management jumping ship? And......if they're so badly compensated for their .....ummm...."skills"......again, why aren't they leaving, in the proverbial droves? Watch what they do, not what they say. As in the case of YRC,......so broke they had to rob their employees three times, yet apparently had the money to pay two Teamster appointees $250,000 a month,....Pay "Dollar Bill" Zollars a handsome Golden Parachute to leave,....according to Go4Gold, apparently they have the money to compensate their top executives at about 5 times what ABF is doing......none of whom,...other than Mr. Zollars seems to be leaving,....yet,...and even though they had the paperwork filed with the SEC too, they were so broke they had to pick their employees' pockets three times....and yet Mr. Welch somehow, mysteriously, can come up with $451 million to purchase ABF,...and still pay dividends on stock? Anyone feel like they got "snookered"?
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Yrc has no money to buy anything. They do not own them selves and neither does abf. The investers own most all of both companys and are only in it to make money. If the contract is voted down and the stock price for abf drops much at all they will be a prime target for yrc investers.If there is no contract for abf they will fall under yrc contract. Think about it and live to fight another day!
 
Steward of the Rock said:
This is getting comical now. I was not trying to show Go4gold anything. I was simply having a conversation with the guy on why I would be voting no on this contract offer if there are any concessions. You really should get over yourself. You were the one that made the comment about me being a steward, so I confirmed that I am one and where at. By the way, you still have not told us about what the network changes are going to be within the company from your earlier post. You told me to ask my terminal manager what they are since, as you put it, I am so buddy, buddy with him. I've got a better idea. Since you have already got this vital information from your terminal manager, why don't you share it with all of us so we don't have to do what you had to to get this information. Also, being a steward is very hard work as obviously you cannot please everyone. I would gladly step aside and let someone else be the steward here if that is what our members wanted. I would ask you if you have ever been a steward or served in any union capacity, but you would probably just get offended like you did when I responded to your comment about being a steward.
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If you want to talk about comical...that was what it was like watching go4gold stringing you along like a puppy dog and finally getting you to admit and concede that,,,in your words..."labor will probably have to accept some wage cuts and benefit reductions to survive." I usually would of just chuckled and moved on without making a remark except for the fact of you being a steward...that's what really made the whole thing sickening.Someone that felt he had to make sure it was known to all that he was a steward by making it part of his username being made a fool management for all the Rank and File to see.

As you stated...being a steward is very hard work as obviously you cannot please everyone...but that doesn't include announcing to the world on a public forum that you are a steward then letting management make a fool out of you. Remember...you are the one that felt it was necessary to have your title in your username...then you should of acted with the dignity and the respect of that title and IMO...you did not!!!!!
 
Stoney said:
Now that's a post of respect. Far too many so called union brothers demean others who will vote for concessions.

Docker is by far the worst.
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papajohn said:
Ha Ha Ha.. Everything proves your point, and yet nothing proves your point. By the way where did you run to yesterday? Docker was really looking forward to having a nice conversation with you.
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He was just being his usual self papajohn...he was asked to prove a statement that he made and as usual couldn't...so he took off and...as usual...comes back later thinking we all forget about what he was asked to prove. Now...since you are back stoney...here's your statement:

Stoney said:
You're company right? Remember according to my union brother's, only other's are greedy, never them.
Everyone else should take a paycut, but never them! It doesn't matter that everyone on the company side( CEO on down) took a cut in pay and benefits, you company lackys are selfish and greedy!
Truth is, right now, it's my so called union brothers that are being selfish and greedy.
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Prove it!!!!!!
 
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