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Skeeter

Skeeter

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I wrote this in response to liebstandarte. But I think it deserves a new thread. This is serious and we need to really not let UPS stand peed us into only what they want to give us.



Originally Posted by liebstandarte
The question is? What will a no vote do the force them to give more? You have to back it up with something. Not just vote no.

I don't understand you liebstandarte. You will fight tooth and nail against all odds with Overnite. But when it comes to a union contract you want to just lay down and die. Taking what ever they give from the kindness of their heart.
Let me clue you in UPS has no heart. The teamsters are just as desperate as we are when they go up against UPS.
So it is JUST up to the rank in file to get what we deserve. Are not we the drivers, and dock workers the bread and butter of this company. Would any of them from CEO on down have a job if not for us.
Yes, Voting the contract down would have a profound effect. It will even be in the news. That is the last thing UPS wants.
Don't fight the good fight this far to accept a sub par contract now.
The local 150 is covered under the NMFA and don't pay for their medical. What have they done for us to deserve that and we don't.
We will be union and you are already represented by the union if they try to pull something. Hold out we deserve it.
 
Skeeter said:
I wrote this in response to liebstandarte. But I think it deserves a new thread. This is serious and we need to really not let UPS stand peed us into only what they want to give us.



Originally Posted by liebstandarte
The question is? What will a no vote do the force them to give more? You have to back it up with something. Not just vote no.

I don't understand you liebstandarte. You will fight tooth and nail against all odds with Overnite. But when it comes to a union contract you want to just lay down and die. Taking what ever they give from the kindness of their heart.
Let me clue you in UPS has no heart. The teamsters are just as desperate as we are when they go up against UPS.
So it is JUST up to the rank in file to get what we deserve. Are not we the drivers, and dock workers the bread and butter of this company. Would any of them from CEO on down have a job if not for us.
Yes, Voting the contract down would have a profound effect. It will even be in the news. That is the last thing UPS wants.
Don't fight the good fight this far to accept a sub par contract now.
The local 150 is covered under the NMFA and don't pay for their medical. What have they done for us to deserve that and we don't.
We will be union and you are already represented by the union if they try to pull something. Hold out we deserve it.
Click to expand...

It is good to know that I am the center of all your union frustration. You could have no cost medical. If you want the same wage increase as the NMFA, which is about .42 cents a year. You say you want NMFA, that is the new NMFA wage increase. Is that OK with you? It is all a trade off. What message does it send if you vote no? Will you encourage a strike? Are you willing to strike the company? A no vote without the support of the employees to strike is an empty gun. Venting your anger at me will solve nothing. I'm a big boy I can take it. 'I've got chunks of guys like you in my stool.' I borrowed that line from Phil Hartman.

If I am content with the Indy contract, then I am content. If 50%+1 are content with the contract then it will pass. Do you have a problem with letting the members vote on the new contract and excepting the outcome? Pro or con, your vote? I don't. I will except the members vote either way.
 
liebstandarte said:
It is good to know that I am the center of all your union frustration. You could have no cost medical. If you want the same wage increase as the NMFA, which is about .42 cents a year. You say you want NMFA, that is the new NMFA wage increase. Is that OK with you? It is all a trade off. What message does it send if you vote no? Will you encourage a strike? Are you willing to strike the company? A no vote without the support of the employees to strike is an empty gun. Venting your anger at me will solve nothing. I'm a big boy I can take it. 'I've got chunks of guys like you in my stool.' I borrowed that line from Phil Hartman.
Click to expand...

Man are you reading me wrong. Yes, I would be willing to strike. If something you believe in is not worth fighting for then you are the spineless one willing to accept anything and act like you are one of the ones really in the fight. You are all talk and that is all. You will deserve what you get. But I'm sure the ones willing to vote no and walk a picket line if need be are the real men. And yes I would be willing to do that. But that is not what it will take. The media will fight our fight something UPS is really afraid of.
Oh by the way I have zero anger toward you or anyone. So if that is all you are trying to do is provoke a CB Rambo discussion then you lose :hysterical:
 
Skeeter said:
Man are you reading me wrong. Yes, I would be willing to strike. If something you believe in is not worth fighting for then you are the spineless one willing to accept anything and act like you are one of the ones really in the fight. You are all talk and that is all. You will deserve what you get. But I'm sure the ones willing to vote no and walk a picket line if need be are the real men. And yes I would be willing to do that. But that is not what it will take. The media will fight our fight something UPS is really afraid of.
Oh by the way I have zero anger toward you or anyone. So if that is all you are trying to do is provoke a CB Rambo discussion then you lose :hysterical:
Click to expand...

If you call me out I will answer. Will you except the outcome of the contract vote?
 
liebstandarte said:
If you call me out I will answer. Will you except the outcome of the contract vote?
Click to expand...

Of course I will. That is not what I am talking about. I want to make it a good and fair contract patterned after the NMFA. Why should we take anything less. But if the majority accepts what Indy has then I think it would be a shame and way below what we deserve.
 
liebstandarte said:
It is good to know that I am the center of all your union frustration. You could have no cost medical. If you want the same wage increase as the NMFA, which is about .42 cents a year. You say you want NMFA, that is the new NMFA wage increase. Is that OK with you? It is all a trade off. What message does it send if you vote no? Will you encourage a strike? Are you willing to strike the company? A no vote without the support of the employees to strike is an empty gun. Venting your anger at me will solve nothing. I'm a big boy I can take it. 'I've got chunks of guys like you in my stool.' I borrowed that line from Phil Hartman.

If I am content with the Indy contract, then I am content. If 50%+1 are content with the contract then it will pass. Do you have a problem with letting the members vote on the new contract and excepting the outcome? Pro or con, your vote? I don't. I will except the members vote either way.
Click to expand...


How many times have you said it is not about the money?

The nmfa protects the employees from work being handed to others, like the dock workers here. who no longer work the bed & bath, which is being worked at the parcel terminal. Or limits on rail loads or sub contractors, what about letting UPS cartage deliver our p&d. Would you trade that for $.42
 
Skeeter said:
Of course I will. That is not what I am talking about. I want to make it a good and fair contract patterned after the NMFA. Why should we take anything less. But if the majority accepts what Indy has then I think it would be a shame and way below what we deserve.
Click to expand...

That is what it is all about, having a voice. I too will except the outcome, either way.
 
Overnite said:
How many times have you said it is not about the money?

The nmfa protects the employees from work being handed to others, like the dock workers here. who no longer work the bed & bath, which is being worked at the parcel terminal. Or limits on rail loads or sub contractors, what about letting UPS cartage deliver our p&d. Would you trade that for $.42
Click to expand...

We still work the bbb here. Sub contractors have been hauling one ways in Texas for years.
 
Skeeter said:
Of course I will. That is not what I am talking about. I want to make it a good and fair contract patterned after the NMFA. Why should we take anything less. But if the majority accepts what Indy has then I think it would be a shame and way below what we deserve.
Click to expand...

Ok, I'm starting to get tired of hearing how damn good the NMFA is... The bottom line is, and I think we can all agree on it is, that UPS will NOT sign the NMFA. ANY contract that we do end up with will be it's own "white paper" deal more akin to the parcel contract than the NMFA. Stop and think about why UPS bought a freight company in the first place. What is the priority of incorperating us into the portfolio. Now what does UPS do best? They bring efficiency. They already have a model for HR, it's called the parcel contract. Is it more effcient to have their freight contract be as close to the parcel or NMFA? Obvious? UPS will try to remove as much overhead as possible from within their HR department. Also and next, if you bother to think long term, you have to ask yourself honestly if it makes any sense to operate to totally indepent linehaul systems? Are there obstacles? yes. Can UPS fix 'em? Easily. And the biggest one isn't equipment isses, but drivers. Driver's are more expensive then trucks over their usable lifetime.

If UPS accepts anything like the NMFA now, it will hinder them later in trying to make UPGF as effceint as possible. So we might as well get used to the great NMFA not being on the table. But that does not mean surrender. We still need to fight for every penny and benny we can get on the table now. Will that mean rejecting any first contract offer? Maybe. But everyone needs to get their heads out from you know where and realize what all the consequences will be as we go through this process. We have to be honest with ourselves and forget the delusions that this will be some panacea to fix every ill that we as individual's see in our operations. The union is about what is best for the majority of ALL employees. Not our own little fifedoms.

Carry on now.
 
TX_jarhead said:
Ok, I'm starting to get tired of hearing how damn good the NMFA is... The bottom line is, and I think we can all agree on it is, that UPS will NOT sign the NMFA. ANY contract that we do end up with will be it's own "white paper" deal more akin to the parcel contract than the NMFA. Stop and think about why UPS bought a freight company in the first place. What is the priority of incorperating us into the portfolio. Now what does UPS do best? They bring efficiency. They already have a model for HR, it's called the parcel contract. Is it more effcient to have their freight contract be as close to the parcel or NMFA? Obvious? UPS will try to remove as much overhead as possible from within their HR department. Also and next, if you bother to think long term, you have to ask yourself honestly if it makes any sense to operate to totally indepent linehaul systems? Are there obstacles? yes. Can UPS fix 'em? Easily. And the biggest one isn't equipment isses, but drivers. Driver's are more expensive then trucks over their usable lifetime.

If UPS accepts anything like the NMFA now, it will hinder them later in trying to make UPGF as effceint as possible. So we might as well get used to the great NMFA not being on the table. But that does not mean surrender. We still need to fight for every penny and benny we can get on the table now. Will that mean rejecting any first contract offer? Maybe. But everyone needs to get their heads out from you know where and realize what all the consequences will be as we go through this process. We have to be honest with ourselves and forget the delusions that this will be some panacea to fix every ill that we as individual's see in our operations. The union is about what is best for the majority of ALL employees. Not our own little fifedoms.

Carry on now.
Click to expand...

I agree and shouldn't of said NMFA. I meant a contract like UPS. We should have what they have if they are going to integrate us to a certain degree.
It has been said we can't get what they make because parcel is so far out of our class. I know line drivers would take a cut if UPS paid us by the hour like the do feeder drivers. I'll average over $30.00 an hour with the mileage pay we have right now.
So I don't think this whole thing is about pay. It's about benefits. Our benefits for our families is worth fighting for.
Just my thoughts on it.:1036316054:
 
Overnite said:
How many times have you said it is not about the money?

The nmfa protects the employees from work being handed to others, like the dock workers here. who no longer work the bed & bath, which is being worked at the parcel terminal. Or limits on rail loads or sub contractors, what about letting UPS cartage deliver our p&d. Would you trade that for $.42
Click to expand...
we still handle rails full of bed and bath
 
Where are the people that were so vocal about the 401 match not being guaranteed and it could be taken away at any time becuase it is not under the contract?

Well neither is dock work. Or any job for that matter there are no protections.

For this to be a good contract we need office people and mechanics in this contract.

Strength in numbers.
 
Overnite said:
Where are the people that were so vocal about the 401 match not being guaranteed and it could be taken away at any time becuase it is not under the contract?

Well neither is dock work. Or any job for that matter there are no protections.

For this to be a good contract we need office people and mechanics in this contract.

Strength in numbers.
Click to expand...
they are taking the 401k match no if ands or buts
 
Overnite said:
Where are the people that were so vocal about the 401 match not being guaranteed and it could be taken away at any time becuase it is not under the contract?

Well neither is dock work. Or any job for that matter there are no protections.

For this to be a good contract we need office people and mechanics in this contract.

Strength in numbers.
Click to expand...
mechanics are joining the machinist's union
 
wassesname said:
so little-o, go walk arround the office and hand out cards.
Click to expand...

There not covered under the indy contract, it has already been deceided between the company and the union who is covered under the contract.

The real decision makers are the dockworkers there the single biggest group. There the ones that need to be swayed.

Why do you think I brought to light the BB&B being worked by parcel?

I am already 2 steps ahead of you.
 
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