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In the cotract for Indy it stsaes that full time dock without cdl will be red circled. What does that mean? Will they be allowed to keep working?
 
Redwing,
Red circled means that they won't lose their jobs and won't have to get CDL's either. All future employees will probably be required to be CDL qualified before being hired. Red circled is a Union protection term.
 
BusterNite said:
If I understand the Indy contract regarding this, There are two lists, Road & City, At Bid time you can bid in either classification with your full time company hire date (seniority). If you choose to move to another classification before bid, You go to the bottom untill bid time.
Click to expand...

Thats rite!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
stldude44 said:
Redwing,
Red circled means that they won't lose their jobs and won't have to get CDL's either. All future employees will probably be required to be CDL qualified before being hired. Red circled is a Union protection term.
Click to expand...

Thats rite!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
ok, thanks. now the guys on the dock w/out a cdl are being told that a new hire dock/cdl has more seniority than they do! They have been there for longer than I have and I have 14 years. does that make sense? This info is coming from the asst. tm.
 
I`ve got mine, I run the road. I was a dock supervisor before, and the guys on the dock still ask me about things, probably because I tell them the facts, as I know them. And if I don`t ,I find out what the facts are and pass it on.
 
That stands to reason,any driver can work the dock.
But dock without a CDL can't drive.
The LTL companies now want people that can do everything.
just being a dock worker is to limiting,and not that valuable to the companies they are working for.
When a new hire comes on board with a CDL they will have a job long after any dock worker without a CDL no matter how many years they have with their company.
 
Apostolic said:
That stands to reason,any driver can work the dock.
But dock without a CDL can't drive.
The LTL companies now want people that can do everything.
just being a dock worker is to limiting,and not that valuable to the companies they are working for.
When a new hire comes on board with a CDL they will have a job long after any dock worker without a CDL no matter how many years they have with their company.
Click to expand...

Even the new NMFT has language about utility personnel. The companies want as much flexibility with their personnel as possible. Can you blame them??? All a CDL does is increase your value to the company. Isn't being valued what we're all sort of after???????????:1036316054:
 
Apostolic said:
That stands to reason,any driver can work the dock.
But dock without a CDL can't drive.
The LTL companies now want people that can do everything.
just being a dock worker is to limiting,and not that valuable to the companies they are working for.
When a new hire comes on board with a CDL they will have a job long after any dock worker without a CDL no matter how many years they have with their company.
Click to expand...

Its, not going to matter when the contract comes in, everything will be by seniority, CDL or not.:1036316054: Fulltime before part time.
 
BusterNite said:
If I understand the Indy contract regarding this, There are two lists, Road & City, At Bid time you can bid in either classification with your full time company hire date (seniority). If you choose to move to another classification before bid, You go to the bottom untill bid time.
Click to expand...

The indy contracts states the following:

For full time employees there shall be two seniority lists "local cartage" and "over the road". There shall be a separate casual "local cartage" seniority list. Employees in the following classification shall be included on the local cartage seniority list; all truck drivers, helpers, dock workers, jockeys and such other employees as may be presently or herafter represented by the Union, engaged in local pick up, delivery, and assembling of freight. The "over the road" seniority list shall include all over the road drivers whose primary job is to transport freight between the employers facilities. Nothing within this paragraph shall preclude the company from requesting a road driver to make extra stops to pick up or deliver freight in connection with his regular run or performing other local cartage work as the company may assign. It is not the intent of the company that this provision be utilized to diminish cartage employee's work.

In regards to job posting it states the following:

Start times, by classification will be posted for bid on the Union bulletin board on a semi-annual basis. The bids will contain a description of the run or job. Bids shall remain posted for fourteen (14) calandar days. The most senior employee bidding on the job shall be awarded the bid.

There is more specific language but it pertains to bump bids, start time changes, vacated positions, etc...

So now let me get to my point! I do not believe they (the company) is going to bid all the jobs as one bid. Another words semi annually you can change from running the road then next bid go to the city. I have never seen this done anywhere. I saw a post before saying NMFA companies (ABF/Yellow) have an annual bid and you can go anywhere you seniority will take you and that is false. I labored under the NMFA for years and the road driver bid the road board and the local cartage employees bid the city/dock/hostling only. The only exception to this rule was the last NMFA put in the Premium Service Employee that pertained to new business and that is where a local cartage employee with a cdl can do this work which is short lane line haul with kicks/picks while on this run but that employee stays on the local cartage roster. The new Utility Driver that is in the new NMFA is simular to this but a expaned version. Parcel does not ever bid their jobs the way you guys are talking about. Now if you switch from a package car to feeder driver yes you go to the bottom of that seniority roster but retain your company seniority. That is probably what we will do here pertaining to this matter but that's the way we do it now. I started dock with cdl and went into the city when they need more driver and I went to the bottom of that board. I bet you a anything when we bid....road drivers will bid road board and local cartage will bid local cartage board. If you switch no matter what time of year you will go to the bottom of that board.
 
Emptypockets said:
The indy contracts states the following:

For full time employees there shall be two seniority lists "local cartage" and "over the road". There shall be a separate casual "local cartage" seniority list. Employees in the following classification shall be included on the local cartage seniority list; all truck drivers, helpers, dock workers, jockeys and such other employees as may be presently or herafter represented by the Union, engaged in local pick up, delivery, and assembling of freight. The "over the road" seniority list shall include all over the road drivers whose primary job is to transport freight between the employers facilities. Nothing within this paragraph shall preclude the company from requesting a road driver to make extra stops to pick up or deliver freight in connection with his regular run or performing other local cartage work as the company may assign. It is not the intent of the company that this provision be utilized to diminish cartage employee's work.

In regards to job posting it states the following:

Start times, by classification will be posted for bid on the Union bulletin board on a semi-annual basis. The bids will contain a description of the run or job. Bids shall remain posted for fourteen (14) calandar days. The most senior employee bidding on the job shall be awarded the bid.

There is more specific language but it pertains to bump bids, start time changes, vacated positions, etc...

So now let me get to my point! I do not believe they (the company) is going to bid all the jobs as one bid. Another words semi annually you can change from running the road then next bid go to the city. I have never seen this done anywhere. I saw a post before saying NMFA companies (ABF/Yellow) have an annual bid and you can go anywhere you seniority will take you and that is false. I labored under the NMFA for years and the road driver bid the road board and the local cartage employees bid the city/dock/hostling only. The only exception to this rule was the last NMFA put in the Premium Service Employee that pertained to new business and that is where a local cartage employee with a cdl can do this work which is short lane line haul with kicks/picks while on this run but that employee stays on the local cartage roster. The new Utility Driver that is in the new NMFA is simular to this but a expaned version. Parcel does not ever bid their jobs the way you guys are talking about. Now if you switch from a package car to feeder driver yes you go to the bottom of that seniority roster but retain your company seniority. That is probably what we will do here pertaining to this matter but that's the way we do it now. I started dock with cdl and went into the city when they need more driver and I went to the bottom of that board. I bet you a anything when we bid....road drivers will bid road board and local cartage will bid local cartage board. If you switch no matter what time of year you will go to the bottom of that board.
Click to expand...


From my perspective, it seems fair except for the semi annual bid, once a year should be enough, I also do not believe that someone with company seniority should have to go to the bottom of any list if he or she decides to switch positions.

Again seniority means very little, we allready have that problem.:smilie_132:
 
Accelerator said:
From my perspective, it seems fair except for the semi annual bid, once a year should be enough, I also do not believe that someone with company seniority should have to go to the bottom of any list if he or she decides to switch positions.

Again seniority means very little, we allready have that problem.:smilie_132:
Click to expand...

Sorry the semi annual is good. Its the seniority I have a problem with as I had stated above.
 
Emptypockets said:
The indy contracts states the following:

For full time employees there shall be two seniority lists "local cartage" and "over the road". There shall be a separate casual "local cartage" seniority list. Employees in the following classification shall be included on the local cartage seniority list; all truck drivers, helpers, dock workers, jockeys and such other employees as may be presently or herafter represented by the Union, engaged in local pick up, delivery, and assembling of freight. The "over the road" seniority list shall include all over the road drivers whose primary job is to transport freight between the employers facilities. Nothing within this paragraph shall preclude the company from requesting a road driver to make extra stops to pick up or deliver freight in connection with his regular run or performing other local cartage work as the company may assign. It is not the intent of the company that this provision be utilized to diminish cartage employee's work.

In regards to job posting it states the following:

Start times, by classification will be posted for bid on the Union bulletin board on a semi-annual basis. The bids will contain a description of the run or job. Bids shall remain posted for fourteen (14) calandar days. The most senior employee bidding on the job shall be awarded the bid.

There is more specific language but it pertains to bump bids, start time changes, vacated positions, etc...

So now let me get to my point! I do not believe they (the company) is going to bid all the jobs as one bid. Another words semi annually you can change from running the road then next bid go to the city. I have never seen this done anywhere. I saw a post before saying NMFA companies (ABF/Yellow) have an annual bid and you can go anywhere you seniority will take you and that is false. I labored under the NMFA for years and the road driver bid the road board and the local cartage employees bid the city/dock/hostling only. The only exception to this rule was the last NMFA put in the Premium Service Employee that pertained to new business and that is where a local cartage employee with a cdl can do this work which is short lane line haul with kicks/picks while on this run but that employee stays on the local cartage roster. The new Utility Driver that is in the new NMFA is simular to this but a expaned version. Parcel does not ever bid their jobs the way you guys are talking about. Now if you switch from a package car to feeder driver yes you go to the bottom of that seniority roster but retain your company seniority. That is probably what we will do here pertaining to this matter but that's the way we do it now. I started dock with cdl and went into the city when they need more driver and I went to the bottom of that board. I bet you a anything when we bid....road drivers will bid road board and local cartage will bid local cartage board. If you switch no matter what time of year you will go to the bottom of that board.
Click to expand...

Im still having a hard time understanding the contract in regards to seniority bidding and classifications. Under the contract, At bid time, will employee's be able to change classifications (road/P&d) with their full seniority? It would appear that the contract is saying that you can bump into the road or city with your full seniority hire date at bid time.
 
BusterNite said:
Im still having a hard time understanding the contract in regards to seniority bidding and classifications. Under the contract, At bid time, will employee's be able to change classifications (road/P&d) with their full seniority? It would appear that the contract is saying that you can bump into the road or city with your full seniority hire date at bid time.
Click to expand...

I am 100% positive that will not happen, parcel has been wanting that for years and I had a long discussion with a parcel guy tonight about it. There would be several issuses such as training with the DIAD that system is changing frequently and by doing it the way you are thinking that would be opening pandoras box. If parcel could not get it done and they have been working on their contract for years I just could not see them handing that to us right out of the box. Plus industry standards polls...no other freight lines does it that way and I promise they reviewed the industry. The way we do it now will not change except there will be language that the company will have to follow for bidding. This subject has been kicked around way too much and it is very simple but for some reason it has been a hot subject. Either way you slice it right now we have nothing to stand on that is solid but with a contract we have a safety net and a solid foundation to build on.:1036316054:
 
Emptypockets said:
I am 100% positive that will not happen, parcel has been wanting that for years and I had a long discussion with a parcel guy tonight about it. There would be several issuses such as training with the DIAD that system is changing frequently and by doing it the way you are thinking that would be opening pandoras box. If parcel could not get it done and they have been working on their contract for years I just could not see them handing that to us right out of the box. Plus industry standards polls...no other freight lines does it that way and I promise they reviewed the industry. The way we do it now will not change except there will be language that the company will have to follow for bidding. This subject has been kicked around way too much and it is very simple but for some reason it has been a hot subject. Either way you slice it right now we have nothing to stand on that is solid but with a contract we have a safety net and a solid foundation to build on.:1036316054:
Click to expand...

You are correct that this is not the industry standard. Our local has told us this. But they also told us that New England has done this in the past. So I guess we may end up voteing on this issue. The diad thing, Again you are correct. I have been a road driver for 25 years. You hand me one of those things and I would be looking for pac man.
 
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