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TForce | Tell me WHY

Now this may be a stretch,but could this be a way Jimmy H.Jr had of getting back at all of us old Overnite workers?
Because his reason for becoming president of the Teamsters in the first place,was to organize us,or put Overnite out of business.
 
Metal Head said:
slo, I detect and appreciate some friendly sarcasm. The objective in organizing UPSF, in my mind, should have been to bring those workers up to the level enjoyed by NMFA covered workers not create a situation where YRCW can make a legitimate argument for concessions. I hope I am stirring up something, preferably thought provoking discussions, parody at the highest level and Unity across the industry. I did read yor first post and was trying to elaborate on what I believe was the point you were making. I maybe should have stated the Indy contract could potentially became the new standard as opposed to stating it as an inevitability. Happy Holidays.
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Well sir, there is some validity in your statement for a few reasons.

1. Hoffa worked for UPS at one time and I am sure made a few buddies in the process.
2. With the first statement I have made, would you think it is a conspiracy? with a combination of elements with beneficial results for UPS.
3. What will Bill Z gain if he tubs YRC? and what does that mean for UPS?
4.Hoffa holds the name of charisma, which is the reason he was elected as a Teamster official.

I am not saying I know what is going on but I feel these things could come true. And the true outcome is nothing but pure speculation in many different angles.

I feel there could be a strategy for the Teamsters by negotiating this contract, after all , it was only one terminal. Would it be beneficial for them to strike when there are 200 other terminals in the system that could potentially work around them.

I feel the strategy in this case was not too sink the newly brothered terminal, but too negotiate a contract too say we have one, then unionize the rest of the company, when you have that as bargaining power, you have the strength to get what you want. I could be guessing incorrectly, but I feel this is thier motivation.

In this deal, they did get something that means more then anything in the contract from thier ( the Teamsters )perspective, and should be the most part of our perspective, and that is an end date.

If more terminals organize, then we know there is more strength in #'s, and gives us the strength too organize better in 2013.

I feel they sold us out as a strategy ploy for better results, or someone was paid off.

One must ask themselves why Yellow bought all Teamster companies, and sold off the nonunion firms.
 
Apostolic said:
Now this may be a stretch,but could this be a way Jimmy H.Jr had of getting back at all of us old Overnite workers?
Because his reason for becoming president of the Teamsters in the first place,was to organize us,or put Overnite out of business.
Click to expand...

I think it is a golfcart conspiracy.......
 
I have wondered myself on the motives of those involved. My feeling is that UPS is making this easy on the teamsters and in the process they're getting what they wanted in the deal.

That then puts pressure on YRC and their employees in their contract negotiations which will likely create a volatile situation with the competitors. And the teamsters have said that they will now focus their attention on FedEx. Hoffa got what he wanted and has gained back his credibility and UPS gets what they wanted. No labor disputes and has now sent Hoffa after their biggest rival and at the same time has created labor issues with the unionized carriers.

I call that a win, win, win situation for Hoffa and Eskew/Holmes. The alternative would have been a long bitter battle that would have tarnished their legacies and would have disrupted business. Now let that be case for FedEx and YRC (UPS' thoughts). Hoffa on the other hand has been vindicated and has kept his biggest client (UPS) happy.
 
upgf-driver said:
I have wondered myself on the motives of those involved. My feeling is that UPS is making this easy on the teamsters and in the process they're getting what they wanted in the deal.

That then puts pressure on YRC and their employees in their contract negotiations which will likely create a volatile situation with the competitors. And the teamsters have said that they will now focus their attention on FedEx. Hoffa got what he wanted and has gained back his credibility and UPS gets what they wanted. No labor disputes and has now sent Hoffa after their biggest rival and at the same time has created labor issues with the unionized carriers.

I call that a win, win, win situation for Hoffa and Eskew/Holmes. The alternative would have been a long bitter battle that would have tarnished their legacies and would have disrupted business. Now let that be case for FedEx and YRC (UPS' thoughts). Hoffa on the other hand has been vindicated and has kept his biggest client (UPS) happy.
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Believe me, at this point I would not doubt anything, There is many different angles in which this could come together, if you kill the biggest competitor, wether it be Yellow, and I doubt FEDEX, and others alike, you gain market share, and those with little too no flexibility both financially and in work force (YRC), Then it does create a win, win, for both FEDEX and UPS.

UPS especially if the Teamsters unionize FEDEX, but at this point, I think it will be a cold day in hell for FEDEX too unionize with this SUB-PAR contract as an example or the vehicle of choice for that matter.There is alot of good in this contract but there is also alot of flexibility, too much as far as I am concearned.

It is a contract, and I am greatfull for the work rules most of all, but I do think it could have been better. It's a golfcart conspiracy I tell ya.
 
Accelerator said:
Believe me, at this point I would not doubt anything, There is many different angles in which this could come together, if you kill the biggest competitor, wether it be Yellow, and I doubt FEDEX, and others alike, you gain market share, and those with little too no flexibility both financially and in work force (YRC), Then it does create a win, win, for both FEDEX and UPS.

UPS especially if the Teamsters unionize FEDEX, but at this point, I think it will be a cold day in hell for FEDEX too unionize with this SUB-PAR contract as an example or the vehicle of choice for that matter.There is alot of good in this contract but there is also alot of flexibility, too much as far as I am concearned.

It is a contract, and I am greatfull for the work rules most of all, but I do think it could have been better. It's a golfcart conspiracy I tell ya.
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I truley doubt that most employees would have the stomach for a union at UPSF, if it invovled a long nasty process. The card check is the only reason the union will come to UPSF. I was for the union back when it was OVNT, but it was a no win situation and I am not a fool. This unionization of UPSF is what UPS wants and that is the biggest reason it will happen. I for one will join and take all the benefits and drawbacks of the union. The early years of the union will have some growing pains but in the long run it will make us all alot more secure.:1036316054:
 
steve5 said:
Are you trying to say that if you employees under the NMFA, get a bad deal next negotiation it will somehow be UPSF's fault?

We have nothing to do with your company or the NMFA. If you get a substandard contract, it will be the result of of no one but your company and whoever is negotiating your contract.
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I believe you might be having a bit of a perception problem.
 
steve5 said:
Are you trying to say that if you employees under the NMFA, get a bad deal next negotiation it will somehow be UPSF's fault?

We have nothing to do with your company or the NMFA. If you get a substandard contract, it will be the result of of no one but your company and whoever is negotiating your contract.
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I am not saying that is the fault of any UPSF member. This is the fault of Hoffa and Hall for negotiating a contract that completely undermines the NMFA with a company as powerful as UPS. The NMFA has always been the standard in the freight industry. What I am saying is it was Hoffa and Hall's duty to bring the brothers and sisters at UPSF under the NMFA and by failing to do so they have jeopardized the protections and benefits it took decades to gain. As far your statement "we have nothing to do with your company or the NMFA" I ask you to consider that as Teamsters we have everything to do with each other and the struggle to get our fair slice of the pie whether you work at Roadway or UPSF or a Teamster warehouse. In the post you resonded to I stated it was my intent to stir up discussion, parody and unity. Welcome to the Brotherhood and Happy Holidays.
 
Accelerator said:
Well sir, there is some validity in your statement for a few reasons.

1. Hoffa worked for UPS at one time and I am sure made a few buddies in the process.
2. With the first statement I have made, would you think it is a conspiracy? with a combination of elements with beneficial results for UPS.
3. What will Bill Z gain if he tubs YRC? and what does that mean for UPS?
4.Hoffa holds the name of charisma, which is the reason he was elected as a Teamster official.

I am not saying I know what is going on but I feel these things could come true. And the true outcome is nothing but pure speculation in many different angles.

I feel there could be a strategy for the Teamsters by negotiating this contract, after all , it was only one terminal. Would it be beneficial for them to strike when there are 200 other terminals in the system that could potentially work around them.

I feel the strategy in this case was not too sink the newly brothered terminal, but too negotiate a contract too say we have one, then unionize the rest of the company, when you have that as bargaining power, you have the strength to get what you want. I could be guessing incorrectly, but I feel this is thier motivation.

In this deal, they did get something that means more then anything in the contract from thier ( the Teamsters )perspective, and should be the most part of our perspective, and that is an end date.

If more terminals organize, then we know there is more strength in #'s, and gives us the strength too organize better in 2013.

I feel they sold us out as a strategy ploy for better results, or someone was paid off.

One must ask themselves why Yellow bought all Teamster companies, and sold off the nonunion firms.
Click to expand...

I agree with the possibility that the strategy could be as you say and it in some ways makes sense. It would indeed be difficult to pressure UPSF with only one barn organized. What concerns me is the amount of regress the industry will suffer in achieving the goal, and the difficulty that will be encountered trying to gain back what was lost. As far as the Yellow? I believe the Yellow acquisitions were masterminded by DHL and it won't be long before we hear that DHL has acquired YRCW. I appreciate the thoughtful post. Happy Holidays
 
Metal Head said:
I am not saying that is the fault of any UPSF member. This is the fault of Hoffa and Hall for negotiating a contract that completely undermines the NMFA with a company as powerful as UPS. The NMFA has always been the standard in the freight industry. What I am saying is it was Hoffa and Hall's duty to bring the brothers and sisters at UPSF under the NMFA and by failing to do so they have jeopardized the protections and benefits it took decades to gain. As far your statement "we have nothing to do with your company or the NMFA" I ask you to consider that as Teamsters we have everything to do with each other and the struggle to get our fair slice of the pie whether you work at Roadway or UPSF or a Teamster warehouse. In the post you resonded to I stated it was my intent to stir up discussion, parody and unity. Welcome to the Brotherhood and Happy Holidays.
Click to expand...

You get another gold star.:1036316054:
 
Metal Head said:
I am not saying that is the fault of any UPSF member. This is the fault of Hoffa and Hall for negotiating a contract that completely undermines the NMFA with a company as powerful as UPS. The NMFA has always been the standard in the freight industry. What I am saying is it was Hoffa and Hall's duty to bring the brothers and sisters at UPSF under the NMFA and by failing to do so they have jeopardized the protections and benefits it took decades to gain. As far your statement "we have nothing to do with your company or the NMFA" I ask you to consider that as Teamsters we have everything to do with each other and the struggle to get our fair slice of the pie whether you work at Roadway or UPSF or a Teamster warehouse. In the post you resonded to I stated it was my intent to stir up discussion, parody and unity. Welcome to the Brotherhood and Happy Holidays.
Click to expand...

The NMFA is a relic of the past. It may have been good before deregulation, but now it is not, any person who ever thinks UPS would go under the NMFA is insane. It will never happen. I repeat it will never happen. If you are holding out for NMFA you will die waiting. There is no chance it will ever happen.
 
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